Are tolls the only practical way of freeway construction/expansion in Texas? (Houston: credit card, taxes)

[Need4Camaro]

I've been wondering this.. ..for example.. ..what would happen if the toll roads in DFW were constructed as free roads instead of toll roads. Would they have never received the funding for construction? Would they have been constructed over a much longer period of time? would they have even made the drawing board?

I know that tolls provide immediate funding to pass road projects that are otherwise difficult to approve federal or even local financing for, hence less and less 3-DGI interstate freeways and more and more local state and tolled freeways. But I have wondered:

Does Texas construct toll roads only to pass on the cost of road infrastructure to users thereby restricting the budget from state infrastructure and conserving the financial resources or reallocating those resources to other means...

..or..

Are tolls truly the only way these routes would see the light of day thereby meaning, Texas otherwise does not have the funding to build them by any other methodology?

Basically, are we getting screwed with the state keeping the money that they should be using to build infrastructure or are tolls a necessity for these new roads to keep up with fast development over the years?

On one side, I say, San Antonio managed to do it without tolls, and their infrastructure IMHO is better than Austin's of which about half of the freeways are tolls .. .. but the toll roads in Austin do seem to move a bit better than the freeways in San Antonio.. ..DFW.. ..is an animal in itself given its massive size so they.. ..may not have easily have gotten away with what SATX pulled off.. ..but then I have yet another question.. ..do our toll roads prevent 'induced demand' in any meaningful way?

[Dopo]

Toll roads are a scam

I constantly see highways built all over Texas
But in Houston where 6 million people live (20% of Texans) = we don’t have money for highways, they have to be toll road

Complete BS
If that’s true, stop building highway in other places

[Redlionjr]

Originally Posted by Dopo

Toll roads are a scam

I constantly see highways built all over Texas
But in Houston where 6 million people live (20% of Texans) = we don’t have money for highways, they have to be toll road

Complete BS
If that’s true, stop building highway in other places

I think tolls are literally highway robbery. Matter fact did the term originate from tolls? I'm not sure but anyway, I really don't see the point in having tolls. You still get stuck in traffic while on the tolls and the alternatives are still clogged up. Since the pandemic, traffic flow has been better in Houston on the tolls but it took them laying off workers in the booth for that to happen. But I seriously would like to know where does that money go to? We have miles and miles of toll roads, meanwhile our city streets are in desperate need of repair but let's continue to focus on charging people to get stuck in traffic. SMH Rant over

[Seguinite]

I always thought the taxes on gasoline were supposed to be for roads. If that's actually the case, I'd wholeheartedly endorse a significant increase in that tax if they'd actually use it for roads.

Unfortunately, the state(s) and feds would find a reason to NOT use it appropriately.

[Dopo]

Same BS tactic as always to privatize something that is a public service = defund it and then say that the only solution is to privatize it

[LocalPlanner]

Originally Posted by Seguinite

I always thought the taxes on gasoline were supposed to be for roads. If that's actually the case, I'd wholeheartedly endorse a significant increase in that tax if they'd actually use it for roads.

Unfortunately, the state(s) and feds would find a reason to NOT use it appropriately.

There's a state gas tax and a federal gas tax. I think the state one is used almost exclusively to support motorized transport, like for freeways. The federal one does get used for a wider variety of things. Neither one has been raised in forever, and they are not indexed to inflation. In a high-growth state like TX, you end up in a situation where there's not enough revenue to both maintain existing highways (a huge share of which are 45+ years old now) and build new facilities. Hence, tolls, because politicians are unwilling to take the heat for raising taxes.

Of course now, there's an anti-toll movement too. So, the legislature has been appropriating $ from other sources not directly meant for highways, rather than raise the gas tax.

[Ice_Major]

Originally Posted by Seguinite

I always thought the taxes on gasoline were supposed to be for roads. If that's actually the case, I'd wholeheartedly endorse a significant increase in that tax if they'd actually use it for roads.

Unfortunately, the state(s) and feds would find a reason to NOT use it appropriately.

Initially gas tax revenue was used for road construction. The program worked so well due to ever increasing car dependency it ran a bouget surplus. Unfortunately, other budget areas started to decline in revenue, so the feds and many state governments diverted gas tax revenue to other sources. Much easier to take this action versus unpopular policies (budget cuts or increasing taxes).

I have no problem with tolls in regards to their original intent. Collect tolls for a set period of years to pay for the construction cost. Once paid, the road becomes free use. I was surprised at how many roads stay tolls forever, though this isn't just a Texas phenomenon.

[Ghost Town]

First time I actually agree with Dopo.
But I would prefer to keep the fuel taxes as they are now. Look at CA, how crazy it is now. I remember 10 years ago gas prices in CA were not much different from most other states, not the case anymore. Personally I never had EZ pass for almost 10 years here in Houston and don't think I will really need it in future. But they should provide more cash/credit card options on toll roads. That's the main problem I think. I haven't driven on East Coast for a while but 10 years ago they had cash options everywhere on toll roads.

[DabOnEm]

Originally Posted by Ghost Town

First time I actually agree with Dopo.
But I would prefer to keep the fuel taxes as they are now. Look at CA, how crazy it is now. I remember 10 years ago gas prices in CA were not much different from most other states, not the case anymore. Personally I never had EZ pass for almost 10 years here in Houston and don't think I will really need it in future. But they should provide more cash/credit card options on toll roads. That's the main problem I think. I haven't driven on East Coast for a while but 10 years ago they had cash options everywhere on toll roads.

On the flip side you could say California doesn't really have any tollroads, outside of the couple they built in South OC (that are easily avoidable), a few toll crossings in the Bay Area, and one near the border in SD. California has collectively the best designed and engineered freeways in the nation, in large part to their gas tax, and they built a ton of them in the urban areas. They're in better shape than the Texas freeways. Now does that make up for how high gas prices are there? I'm not so sure, but the infrastructure has held up well over time.

Then you look at states like Arizona that have only one major metro area so they're able to pour money into well designed freeways there (similar to the ones in CA), and have added several since 2010 yet don't need to add tolls onto any of them. I wonder if part of this is because the Tuscon area fought against freeway expansion so the Phoenix area got extra funds.

[Ghost Town]

Originally Posted by DabOnEm

On the flip side you could say California doesn't really have any tollroads, outside of the couple they built in South OC (that are easily avoidable), a few toll crossings in the Bay Area, and one near the border in SD. California has collectively the best designed and engineered freeways in the nation, in large part to their gas tax, and they built a ton of them in the urban areas. They're in better shape than the Texas freeways. Now does that make up for how high gas prices are there? I'm not so sure, but the infrastructure has held up well over time.

Then you look at states like Arizona that have only one major metro area so they're able to pour money into well designed freeways there (similar to the ones in CA), and have added several since 2010 yet don't need to add tolls onto any of them. I wonder if part of this is because the Tuscon area fought against freeway expansion so the Phoenix area got extra funds.

I've driven pretty much all over Texas and never needed any toll roads. I don't even remember how many of them exist in the state, except Houston. These toll roads are easily avoidable.