abolish the property tax, reduce the school tax, raise the sales tax

[stratwrassler]

Where can I sign a petition to abolish Texas property taxes and increase the sales tax to make up the difference? If it requires a const amendment, let's get going.

[texdav]

Well a sales tax really means thoser that spend mo0re pay morer especailly if its targeted at specific items. In the end it really doesn't matter because it depends on alot of taxes and fees. Texas overall on Taxes and fees ranks 43 in the coutnriy that means it is very moderate. Also there is the fact that it cost alot of monery to rep[ari streets in neighborhoods and other ciry and country services.ZRarely is a home taxed at the actual value it would sale for and is always behind because the rates in most places can't go up but 10% pre year.

[stratwrassler]

Taking people on appraised value is just crazy. Just because the value of your house goes up doesn't mean your income and ability to pay has.

Under the present system it is possible for someone to end up paying more in property tax than their mortgage payment during the life of their loan, and that is just crazy.

[KantLockeMeIn]

Take a look at what Texans voted for in 2007 in terms of going into debt to fund projects. They as a whole feel that it was appropriate to go billions of dollars in debt to fund some projects such as cancer research in Houston. I'm all for cancer research, which is why I donate to specific charities... but I don't feel it's my place to tell my fellow Texans that I will, under threat of force, take their money for use in such ways.

Texas Consitutional Amendments November 2007 - Proposed Constitutional Amendments on the November 2007 Ballot (http://austin.about.com/od/government/tp/Constitutional_07_Election.htm - broken link)

Until we get *spending* under control, we will never get revenues under control.

[austinnetx]

Property taxes are VERY stable sources of revenue compared to other taxes.

Property taxes also have the feature that EVERYONE pays them - rich, poor, illegal immigrants, etc.

You can also determine how much you pay by where you live.

[Trainwreck20]

I don't mind property taxes, actually, although there plusses and minuses vary from person to person, depending on thier situation. I would support a change in the homestead exemption - increase it to something reasonable to give the lower income families a break. Currently, it is typically $15,000.....I wonder how long it has been sitting at that amount? My parents had a house in the Houston area in 1973 that was only $17,000, and it was fairly nice (although not big). The exemption should probably be around $100k or something (although that would neccesitate an increase in the average tax, I am sure).

Anyway, the state is going to take the same amount of money from the citizens (or abouts), the distribution and mechanism is all that changes. If the sales tax were to completely replace the property tax, one of two things would happen: you would pay basically the same amount in sales tax, or you would pay less and someone would pay more. The someone would almost certainly be the person that saves less, since they are spending a higher percentage of their money. The reason I do like the property tax is that it is so hard to 'shelter' (heh, a pun!) from it. You can't hide income, or buy stuff out of state/online to avoid the property tax.

[austinnetx]

Originally Posted by schoenfraun

I'm not sure that "production" is the right term here. Who is the least productive? My mentally ill sibling who cannot work? Or me, because my paycheck is less than yours. You can't equate the size of the paycheck with productivity, in my opinion.

Productivity is the right word.

Maybe you think that stuff grows on trees, but in reality it comes from hard work and careful thought - and the more productive among us happen to think harder and work harder and take bigger risks.

A person who runs a 100 employee business is far more productive than those individual people. You can put all those people in a room along with their tools, but without the risk, effort, thought, and leadership of the owner, they will not produce.

Among those employees, some are better than others - they get more done, they make less mistakes, they whine less. They make more money.

Among business leaders, some are better than others - they pick better people, they run things better, they plan better, they handle stress better. They make more money.

These are facts.

Wealth does not fall out the sky, it does not lay on the ground - it is the result of human activity over time.

The spark that makes all this run is the willingness to take risk and to forego rewards now for later. This spark only exists if people can keep what they create.

In your world, a mental idiot and a bureaucrat are equivalent to the owner of a car repair shop, the Doctor, the engineer, the professor, etc.

The mental idiot cannot produce anything and for the most part, neither can the civil servant. But you claim otherwise.

That's ludicrous.

[austinnetx]

Originally Posted by schoenfraun

I wish that health care and pharmaceuticals, for instance, did not have to follow the model of the marketplace. I think everyone should have equal access to health care, and I won't be convinced otherwise. Ever. You live and breathe on this planet, you deserve access to the best health care there is, no matter if you are a Vanderbilt or a migrant worker, or not working at all. I don't think profit and competition should enter into that.

So, there should not be a competitive exam to become a Doctor?

Where will the incentives to develop new medicines or to maintain the current stocks come from?

What do you think will happen to Medicine when its no longer lucrative for the best and brightest to participate?

Do you think everyone should get open heart surgery and who is going to pay for this?

How will new procedures and methods get developed without Wealthy erly adopters who are willing to pay for them?

Who will decide if the local Dr should get his own ultrasound? Who will decide what medical devices get produced and sold?

Do you really think today's medical practice is competitive? ( Why do human medicines of the same quality cost 10x of those used in Vet offices? )

Why do so many Canadians come to the USffor medical procedures? Why do the Europeans define any child younger than 32 weeks as "unviable"?

Why should I pay for YOUR healthcare?

[austinnetx]

Originally Posted by Trainwreck20

Anyway, the state is going to take the same amount of money from the citizens (or abouts), the distribution and mechanism is all that changes. If the sales tax were to completely replace the property tax, one of two things would happen: you would pay basically the same amount in sales tax, or you would pay less and someone would pay more. The someone would almost certainly be the person that saves less, since they are spending a higher percentage of their money. The reason I do like the property tax is that it is so hard to 'shelter' (heh, a pun!) from it. You can't hide income, or buy stuff out of state/online to avoid the property tax.

No, thats not true. There is a qualitative difference between property taxes and other taxes that has a material and major effect.

Income and sales taxes are dependent upon economic activity. Property taxes are not. California relies on income and sales tax to a greater degree than Texas and in every economic downturn, it has a loss of revenue.

Income and sales taxes are projected amounts and then the budget is based upon them. They ar emuch harder to forecast than property taxes. If the taxes collected are less, then there is a budget shortfall, which is either made up by cutting the budget or borrowing. If there is no budget cut, then the cost of borrwoing has to be factored into the next tax assessment, meaning the state needs MORE taxes.

State financial ratings are based upon tax base and revenue stability. Downgrades can and do occur, costing more money to borrow.

As far as sales taxes go, they can be evaded by some in a cash economy and by use of barter. Ditto for income taxes. The state has to expend more effort to find these cheats and has to tax others more to make up for it.

Sales and income taxes are much more costlier for the states that use them that property taxes.