Why do Texans deny their southern heritage? (Howe: place, convert)

[GoingHome2TX]

Originally Posted by Spade

Political Scientists believe Texas will become a liberal democratic state by 2020. I can try to find a link later today.

I can only hope that does not happen. And, no I am not a Republican, either.

[WillysB]

Originally Posted by GoingHome2TX

I can only hope that does not happen. And, no I am not a Republican, either.

Texas was a 'democratic', albeit not so liberal, state a couple of elections before Ann Richards. I'd rather see it become a bedrock of libertarianism.

Neither southern nor western, eastern nor northern.

[spursfan]

Originally Posted by WillysB

Texas was a 'democratic', albeit not so liberal, state a couple of elections before Ann Richards. I'd rather see it become a bedrock of libertarianism.

Neither southern nor western, eastern nor northern.

We can only dream...wouldnt it be nice for Texas to be the first state to for a 3rd party candidate to win?

[TexasReb]

Originally Posted by TerpsandHorns

well simply because every other person walking down the street in texas relocated from New York, Chicago, or California...

texas has really lost it's southern roots thanks to re-location in the 1980s-2000s.

Only the extreme eastern rural parts seem to hold to a native texan southern tradition.

I am not saying it is a bad thing, but a lot of relocatees (hence the number of forum posts) tend to want to change texas into a northern state or more comfortable culture to their likings.

It is only a matter of time before the combined number of California, New York, Illinois, and Mexican born citizens outnumber the native Texan born citizens.

The state will be even harder to define then.

This is a great post (giving a rep point as well), and I agree with the general points made (of course, I DO think it is a "bad" thing for Texas to be changed into something different ala' northern/California migration! LOL).

But anyway, yes, no doubt the said migration (legal and illegal) has had an impact on Texas traditional culture, and is diluting it ever more. I don't think there is any doubt that numbers affect after a while. If migration is gradual and over time, then the migrants assimilate into the larger culture. Here is a good take on this one, written by Michael Lind, a native Texan, in his book "Born In Texas."

It was a VERY critical look at the Bush administration and definitely not complimentary to the South at large, but it made a foundational point in this particular topic area:

Despite its Western trappings, Texas has always been part of the South, which provided the ancestors of the majority of white Texans as well as the dominant culture into which newcomers of all races tend to be assimilated....

Anyway, as you -- and Spade as well -- seem to say, the immigration is now coming faster now than can be assimilated into the traditional culture. I still think it is essentially a Southern state, because many of these new influences are confined to the larger cities, which get most of the attention. At the same time though, if it continues, then the traditional Texas/Southern culture will evolve into that of the newcomers. No doubt it is happening, and doesn't seem to be any stopping it. As Spade noted, it is happening in Virginia too. It has long since converted Florida. And there are other areas of the traditionally defined South as well (North Carolina, and Atlanta, Georgia), even if in smaller pockets...

Of course, my own outlook is that it is a crying shame. I will never understand the mindset which causes "yankees" to come to Texas, then try and convert it into a place identical to what they fled from to begin with...

Regardless of whether or not individual native Texans consider it a Southern or Southwestern state (and it is obvious there are disagreements! LOL), I think most of us share in THAT opinion...

[TexasHorseLady]

Of course, my own outlook is that it is a crying shame. I will never understand the mindset which causes "yankees" to come to Texas, then try and convert it into a place identical to what they fled from to begin with...

What, you never heard of Reconstruction?

However, you're right. There seems to be a tendency in some parts to do exactly that, move away from someplace to someplace entirely different and then try to change the place they moved to into the place they moved from. Madness. Or arrogance in the extreme.

[Spade]

Don't be so hasty to say all of Florida though. North Florida is overwhelmingly Southern and that doesn't look like it will change for the forseeable future. Orlando is where the South culturally is. But essentially, Florida is a southern state like Texas and Virginia.

[NenaT]

East Texas is definitely dominated by Southern traditions and influences. However, the farther west you travel, the less Southern influence you see and hear. I have lived in Texas for most of my 58 years , and I have lived in East, West, the Panhandle and Central Texas. I have lived in Plainview, Odessa, Wichita Falls, Houston, and El Paso. EL Paso is dominated by Hispanic culture and by California influences. Very few people here have "Texas accents" and the Southern influence is very limited.

And, if you call the fantastic Mexican food in El Paso "Tejano", you'll have guacamole in your eye! I've had "Mexican food" all over this country, and no place...and I mean NO place...has the incredible true Mexican food like El Paso. We are right on the border with Juarez, and folks here haven't contaminated a great culinary tradition with Tex-Mex, Tejano, or whatever you wish to call it. Come on down and have some REAL Mexican food...and it won't be served with grits, biscuits, or ham-n-beans! (which, by the way, are wonderful, too!)

"Idiotic Southern accent"...hhmmmm...that might be me you're talking about, partner...and it's part of who I am...and most of my family, too...People in each part of this country should be proud of their accents, their cultures, their tradition...and should be accepting of all...that's why we are America.

[catman]

I don't have much of a Southern accent, but I don't find it "idiotic". I find it musical and euphonious. NenaT, you're absolutely right. There are bright people, and idiots, in every part of the country.

[512 Texas Baby]

Well I'm from Texas and I love my Southren roots I stay in Georgia now and to me Georiga is not as Southren as Texas.....

[Two4damoney]

Originally Posted by TexasReb

This is a great post (giving a rep point as well), and I agree with the general points made (of course, I DO think it is a "bad" thing for Texas to be changed into something different ala' northern/California migration! LOL).

But anyway, yes, no doubt the said migration (legal and illegal) has had an impact on Texas traditional culture, and is diluting it ever more. I don't think there is any doubt that numbers affect after a while. If migration is gradual and over time, then the migrants assimilate into the larger culture. Here is a good take on this one, written by Michael Lind, a native Texan, in his book "Born In Texas."

It was a VERY critical look at the Bush administration and definitely not complimentary to the South at large, but it made a foundational point in this particular topic area:

Despite its Western trappings, Texas has always been part of the South, which provided the ancestors of the majority of white Texans as well as the dominant culture into which newcomers of all races tend to be assimilated....

Anyway, as you -- and Spade as well -- seem to say, the immigration is now coming faster now than can be assimilated into the traditional culture. I still think it is essentially a Southern state, because many of these new influences are confined to the larger cities, which get most of the attention. At the same time though, if it continues, then the traditional Texas/Southern culture will evolve into that of the newcomers. No doubt it is happening, and doesn't seem to be any stopping it. As Spade noted, it is happening in Virginia too. It has long since converted Florida. And there are other areas of the traditionally defined South as well (North Carolina, and Atlanta, Georgia), even if in smaller pockets...

Of course, my own outlook is that it is a crying shame. I will never understand the mindset which causes "yankees" to come to Texas, then try and convert it into a place identical to what they fled from to begin with...

Regardless of whether or not individual native Texans consider it a Southern or Southwestern state (and it is obvious there are disagreements! LOL), I think most of us share in THAT opinion...

I agree. And I many not be a native Texan but I do consider myself a "naturalized" Texan because I have embraced the culture, assimilated and made it my own. And I like the natives get annoyed with people from other states that have the arrogance to try to change Texas into something that matches where they come from.