Dallas vs San Antonio (Austin, Fort Worth: rail, suburban, estate)

[NEsananto]

http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/realestate/Broadway%2017th.html (broken link)
Picture for the person who said San Antonio didn't have trees.

[SweethomeSanAntonio]

Originally Posted by TXperson

Quit trying to over-buff San Antonio's size. I know you love your city, but please stop blowing it out of proportion. I've already explained that they were most likely basing cities off of their population rather than their land mass, in which even if San Antonio's metro is at 2 million, it still remains as a fraction that of Dallas and Houston. Again, more people equal more opportunities. The Boston area is nowhere near as large as San Antonio in terms of land mass, yet it still has much more opportunities in comparison.

Even if San Antonio is as big as you make it out to be, it still doesn't even host a third of the opportunities, let alone ideal ones (working at an H-E-B isn't necessarily a desirable opportunity), of what you could find in Dallas and Houston. AT&T relocating their headquarters from San Antonio to Dallas isn't helping your point.

Actually thats what the Dallas forumer is doing, claiming 6.5 million people in Dallas when it is actually 19 counties in North Texas that give it that number. At&T leaving San Antonio had nothing to do with San Antonio being weak, more that the CEO is from Oklahoma and the Dallas area. At&T blossomed what it is today from it's San Antonio/SBC HQ. HEB is just a blimp on the radar in the San Antonio economy, so stop fooling yourself. San Antonio has a very healthy diversified exploding economy. HEB??!!! Thanks for the laugh!

[schertz1]

Originally Posted by TXperson

Quit trying to over-buff San Antonio's size. I know you love your city, but please stop blowing it out of proportion. I've already explained that they were most likely basing cities off of their population rather than their land mass, in which even if San Antonio's metro is at 2 million, it still remains as a fraction that of Dallas and Houston. Again, more people equal more opportunities. The Boston area is nowhere near as large as San Antonio in terms of land mass, yet it still has much more opportunities in comparison.

Even if San Antonio is as big as you make it out to be, it still doesn't even host a third of the opportunities, let alone ideal ones (working at an H-E-B isn't necessarily a desirable opportunity), of what you could find in Dallas and Houston. AT&T relocating their headquarters from San Antonio to Dallas isn't helping your point.

Is your assumption, all San Antonio jobs amount to little more than working for a grocer? If so, it's a gross exaggeration or the comments of someone that knows little about this town. Yes Dallas is larger, but this area - along with the entire region - is growing by leaps and bounds. The job market is becoming more diverse, there are numerous data centers under construction, the NSA is expanding, the BRAC is bringing thousands of jobs here, the port is rapidly expanding, and Texas A&M is building a campus here. The list could go on. The fact AT&T is moving to Dallas is not a reflection of the business climate here; it's more a reflection of Mr. Stephenson's character. His airport argument is ridiculous.

San Antonio's population was 1.99 million last year, 2.04 this year.

[Spade]

Originally Posted by SweethomeSanAntonio

Actually thats what the Dallas forumer is doing, claiming 6.5 million people in Dallas when it is actually 19 counties in North Texas that give it that number. At&T leaving San Antonio had nothing to do with San Antonio being weak, more that the CEO is from Oklahoma and the Dallas area. At&T blossomed what it is today from it's San Antonio/SBC HQ. HEB is just a blimp on the radar in the San Antonio economy, so stop fooling yourself. San Antonio has a very healthy diversified exploding economy. HEB??!!! Thanks for the laugh!

For one, I am not from Dallas nor have I ever lived in Dallas. Two, Those 19 counties population exist because of the city of Dallas. Those counties which are basically suburban Dallas owes it's existence to the city of Dallas. Most people in those 19 counties works in Dallas county and that's why census justifies that coming to the conclusion that the area has over 6.5 million people. Take it up with census if you disagree.

CSA population as of 7/1/2007
DFW- 6,498,410
San Antonio (not even big enough to be consolidated)

MSA population as of 7/1/2007
DFW- 6,145,037
San Antonio- 1,990,675

I do realize that San Antonio is more than likely over 2 million now. But at the same time. DFW is probably well over 6.2 million and the CSA is well over 6.5 million.

http://www.demographia.com/db-metmic2004.pdf

Besides, you wanted to count 2 million people in the San Antonio area and all of those 2 million do not live in Bexar county much less the city of San Antonio. They come from other counties surrounding Bexar. You cannot have your cake and it too.

Even if you only do count the the DFW MSA which stands at 6.1 million. San Antonio is still nearly (not exactly) 3 times smaller than DFW. This is a fact and this is with less counties counted for Dallas.

Also, I did NOT say that Dallas beats San Antonio in every way you look at it. I said it is BIGGER than San Antonio in every way you look at it UNLESS you want to look at municipality numbers.

[SweethomeSanAntonio]

Originally Posted by Spade

For one, I am not from Dallas nor have I ever lived in Dallas. Two, Those 19 counties population exist because of the city of Dallas. Those counties which are basically suburban Dallas owes it's existence to the city of Dallas. Most people in those 19 counties works in Dallas county and that's why census justifies that coming to the conclusion that the area has over 6.5 million people. Take it up with census if you disagree.

CSA population as of 7/1/2007
DFW- 6,498,410
San Antonio (not even big enough to be consolidated)

MSA population as of 7/1/2007
DFW- 6,145,037
San Antonio- 1,990,675

I do realize that San Antonio is more than likely over 2 million now. But at the same time. DFW is probably well over 6.2 million and the CSA is well over 6.5 million.

http://www.demographia.com/db-metmic2004.pdf

Besides, you wanted to count 2 million people in the San Antonio area and all of those 2 million do not live in Bexar county much less the city of San Antonio. They come from other counties surrounding Bexar. You cannot have your cake and it too.

Even if you only do count the the DFW MSA which stands at 6.1 million. San Antonio is still nearly (not exactly) 3 times smaller than DFW. This is a fact and this is with less counties counted for Dallas.

Also, I did NOT say that Dallas beats San Antonio in every way you look at it. I said it is BIGGER than San Antonio in every way you look at it UNLESS you want to look at municipality numbers.

DFW-CSA-North texas 6.5 million 19 counties
San Antonio 1,328,000 Bexar County 1.6 million.
San Antonio-Austin-New braunfels south Central Texas.
nearly 4.0 million.

Just comparing city proper both cities cover roughly the same land area between 300-400 sq miles, San Antonio is more dense.

The fastest growing counties are along the I-35 corridor, and the population is concentrated along 1-35, not in other areas of San Antonio-Austin's metros.

Don't get me wrong, I know San Antonio Metro by itself is much smaller than a DFW CSA. All i'm saying is a fair comparsion would be a San Antonio-Austin conglomeration.

[allbizness]

Spade,

DFW is a CSA, Dallas and Fort Worth are their own MSA's and when combined it's a CSA, not a MSA.

Dallas' MSA population is 4.1

Still twice the size as San Antonio's MSA but not three times the size.

[Spade]

You're half correct. DFW is indeed one MSA. Yes, they do break them up into a Dallas PMSA and Fort Worth-Arlington PMSA. But there is indeed a Dallas-Fort Worth MSA and a Dallas-Fort CSA. Census put those two in their own area. Just like Miami-Fort Lauderdale is it's own MSA.

[Spade]

Originally Posted by SweethomeSanAntonio

DFW-CSA-North texas 6.5 million 19 counties
San Antonio 1,328,000 Bexar County 1.6 million.
San Antonio-Austin-New braunfels south Central Texas.
nearly 4.0 million.

Just comparing city proper both cities cover roughly the same land area between 300-400 sq miles, San Antonio is more dense.

The fastest growing counties are along the I-35 corridor, and the population is concentrated along 1-35, not in other areas of San Antonio-Austin's metros.

Don't get me wrong, I know San Antonio Metro by itself is much smaller than a DFW CSA. All i'm saying is a fair comparsion would be a San Antonio-Austin conglomeration.

Yeah. I know that San Antonio city proper is more dense (although I think that'll change by 2010 census since Dallas is densifying much more faster than San Antonio in the past few years).

I also do not think San Antonio-Austin is not fair simply because it's not real. If it was, census and the government would look at it the same way you do. They are primary cities 80 miles apart from each other compared to Dallas and Fort Worth being cities 30 miles apart. They have much larger suburbs and much more populated counties adjacent to the two core counties of the metro area.

Don't get me wrong, San Antonio is a great and nice sized city that I love to visit every time. But when you look at the entire size of the Dallas area. It is much bigger than San Antonio.

[imaterry78259]

Originally Posted by Spade

Yeah. I know that San Antonio city proper is more dense (although I think that'll change by 2010 census since Dallas is densifying much more faster than San Antonio in the past few years).

I also do not think San Antonio-Austin is not fair simply because it's not real. If it was, census and the government would look at it the same way you do. They are primary cities 80 miles apart from each other compared to Dallas and Fort Worth being cities 30 miles apart. They have much larger suburbs and much more populated counties adjacent to the two core counties of the metro area.

Don't get me wrong, San Antonio is a great and nice sized city that I love to visit every time. But when you look at the entire size of the Dallas area. It is much bigger than San Antonio.

San Antonio metro area and Austin Metro area is only five miles apart

[Spade]

Originally Posted by imaterry78259

San Antonio metro area and Austin Metro area is only five miles apart

Census does not look at it that way. They look at downtown to downtown. Or CBD to CBD. Otherwise, the Washington-Baltimore-Philadelphia-New York City-Boston are would be defined as one entire large metro area. But of course, it is not. Dallas and Fort Worth isn't five miles apart though. They border each other.

Again, they look at downtown and the commuting patters from other counties into those downtown areas. And for San Antonio and Austin. The surrounding counties do not justify these two cities to be merged into one area unlike Dallas and Fort Worth. Or Miami and Ft. Lauderdale.