Toledo or Cleveland (Lakewood, Oregon, Sylvania: rent, neighborhoods, bankruptcy)
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What I'm looking for are nice parks to walk my dog, museums, especially art museums, festivals, ethnic restaurants, and of course Meetups. I loved walking my dog along Lake Erie, and in the Metroparks. I"m sure Toledo has a lot to offer too. My ethnic background is Hungarian, and I have read about the Hungarian presence in Toledo, restaurants, etc. Meeting other Hungarians isn't important to me but it'd be nice to enjoy a Hungarian restaurant now and then. I used to go to West Side Market in Cleveland when I lived there and I loved being able to get my pastries at Giant Eagle. Here in NC it's a desert insofar as anything ethnic except for Latino, Chinese and Indian.
I grew up in Toledo and live outside Cleveland now. It's kind of a toss up based on what you've mentioned.
Cleveland clearly has more/better amenities overall, but not really in the things you listed. I put the metroparks on par with each other in each city. Both cities have great art museums...Cleveland's is probably "better", but not by an amount that should sway your choice either way.
There's some perks of a smaller metro like Toledo, too. It's cheap (even cheaper than Cleveland), it's far easier to get around town. Both cities have problems with poverty and urban decay, but Toledo less so. I'd also note that Toledo has milder winters -- it's not a huge difference, but it's noticeable.
The Heights area in Cleveland might fit you well, there's a lot of condos with retirees and empty nesters. You have access to RTA and the museums, and Shaker Lakes for dog walking. Plus the aforementioned Balaton restaurant and Lucy's Sweet Surrender (a Hungarian bakery) Lakewood is probably good for similar reasons.
In Toledo, someplace like the Old West End or Point Place (near the lake) might suit you. Or maybe somewhere along the Maumee River (Harvard Terrace, Maumee, Perrysburg).
You could potentially split the difference and go for a lake community like Port Clinton or Marblehead.
Are you retired? What's your budget, and renting or buying? Do you still have social connections around Cleveland? Do you drive?
Is there a train system in Toledo like RTA in Cleveland?
Not currently. But Toledo is large enough for a streetcar project similar to the Cincy and Detroit systems, both of which are lacking compared to the new Milwaukee and KC systems, both of which are being expanded. Also Toledo has long been talked about as the terminal for a commuter rail line from Detroit. Toledo also would be a major junction, transfer point for Amtrak's long-discussed hub regional passenger network... But as long as conservative Republicans continue to dominate Ohio politics, don't look for this to happen anytime soon.
Hello everyone. I need a fresh start as a freshly turned 62 y.o. I currently live in Durham, North Carolina, a place I've never fit into for various reasons. Prior to Durham I lived in the Cleveland area - North Olmsted, Olmsted Falls and Westlake. I left because at the time I couldn't handle the weather, having just moved up from Miami, Florida, where I was born.
I posted on Madison, Wisconsin too because I've been interested in that area too, with it being a university city and surrounded by water. However, so far my networking hasn't led me there. I need to move out of my apartment by the end of August as I won't be renewing the lease here. I'm thinking of either Toledo or Cleveland again.
What I'm looking for are nice parks to walk my dog, museums, especially art museums, festivals, ethnic restaurants, and of course Meetups. I loved walking my dog along Lake Erie, and in the Metroparks. I"m sure Toledo has a lot to offer too. My ethnic background is Hungarian, and I have read about the Hungarian presence in Toledo, restaurants, etc. Meeting other Hungarians isn't important to me but it'd be nice to enjoy a Hungarian restaurant now and then. I used to go to West Side Market in Cleveland when I lived there and I loved being able to get my pastries at Giant Eagle. Here in NC it's a desert insofar as anything ethnic except for Latino, Chinese and Indian.
I've been teaching ESL to adults on an online conversation platform, so I'll continue doing that but will need additional employment. I plan to register with the school system to sub or with temp office staffing agencies too. Given the state of things I will start receiving Social Security in August so that'll be a help.
I need to find temporary housing too till I get situated. I'm looking into airbnbs and the extended stay type places.
Part of me wants to go back to Cleveland because it's familiar but then the other part says to try somewhere new. Of course safety is important and medical too, medical not so much at this point. I have no desire to return to Florida. I have nothing to go back to there and the heat and humidity seem to get worse with age.
Does anyone have thoughts on which city might be a better choice?
Well if health is an important thing to you, you just can't do better than Cleveland!
World Class health care is available, that rivals anything in NY and is better than LA. There are the world renowned Cleveland and university hospital.
I am partial to the Coventry area. Nice place to walk your dog and dine.
Cleveland has become a great foodie city - I am relatively new to NE Ohio, and I ate my first Ethiopian meal in Cleveland.
Could not agree more that NC is a "food desert" - so is Florida, for that matter. Chains and pulled pork in NC. Chains and seafood in FL.
In Tremont - another area that you may want to look into for lodging, and FOOD. There's a dog friendly restaurant, ironically called "Fat Cats" that we love - dogs are welcome on the patio! A very good Thai restaurant and so many more that I am drawing a blank. You will be satiated, I can promise.
Cleveland's more traditional foods - Slavic - Hungarian, Polish and nearby Ukrainian are not to be missed, Italian food is good too. A friend from the NYC area's Hungarian husband thinks that the Eastern European food beats anything he's had in NYC.
Open to new people and retires? You won't be alone. I know of several people who moved there from other places.
You already know about the Metro Parks and how great they are. Not sure if you are an art lover, but the Cleveland Museum of Art is stellar and open to the public.
We are members of the Rock Hall and enjoy going there a few times a year. If you like Rock music, there are interesting lectures and other events that are open to members.
I have only lived in OH for seven years. We are thinking of moving from our small city, to the Cleveland. We like the energy there.
I've only been to Toledo once or twice and I can't really say that I was super impressed. It was, to us, for lack of a better word, more generic and suburban, with many strip malls. I can see why it is attractive to some people, though.
I'm sure it's a perfectly nice place. But to us, it lacks the charm that Cleveland has. Just my humble opinion.
I like Cleveland's diversity and the fact that it's about to have a moment - between Millennials priced out of Brooklyn NY, to boomers looking for culture and a very low cost of living and big city amenities.
Downtown Toledo gets better and better every year. Promedicas investment has been huge and spurred all kinds of other redevelopment and new development. Toledo kind of lacks the neighborhoods like Ohio City, Tremont, Coventry, etc with thriving little walkable business districts but in the regard....Downtown Perrysburg, Maumee, and Sylvania fulfill some of that. Neighborhoods like the South end along Broadway are cool with neat cultural character. And theres lots of cool residential areas like Old West End, Old Orchard, Westmoreland, etc.
Toledo has a lot of noteworthy locales but the problem is so many places one may want to visit arent in one obvious area.
Downtown Toledo gets better and better every year. Promedicas investment has been huge and spurred all kinds of other redevelopment and new development. Toledo kind of lacks the neighborhoods like Ohio City, Tremont, Coventry, etc with thriving little walkable business districts but in the regard....Downtown Perrysburg, Maumee, and Sylvania fulfill some of that. Neighborhoods like the South end along Broadway are cool with neat cultural character. And theres lots of cool residential areas like Old West End, Old Orchard, Westmoreland, etc.
Walkable business districts and public transit are the two areas where Cleveland really trounces Toledo.
But with the things OP mentioned I think the cities are on more even footing.
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Toledo has a lot of noteworthy locales but the problem is so many places one may want to visit arent in one obvious area.
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Originally Posted by sheena12
I've only been to Toledo once or twice and I can't really say that I was super impressed. It was, to us, for lack of a better word, more generic and suburban, with many strip malls. I can see why it is attractive to some people, though.
On this note, I do think Toledo is a better place to live than to visit. It's not really set up for unplanned exploration.
It's certainly worth visiting, but you don't just say "Hey let's go to Toledo" on a whim like you might with say Chicago, knowing that you'll find things to do without having to plan.
The one thing that always gives me hope for a really cool future for Toledo is that while we dont have all those thriving walkable neighborhoods, we have those neighborhoods. They just need investment. I can easily see some future where not only Downtown, but the Old West End, South Side, East Toledo, Vistula, Library Village, Harvard Terrace, Point Place, are all thriving walkable neighborhoods of varying scale. The entire UT campus area can easily become a pretty walkable area with business districts off Secor/Dorr and along Bancroft seeing more investment. I also think that the whole length of Central Ave, Sylvania Ave, and Monroe St can be revitalized into something much more, from the central city, all the way out to Secor or so.
While that's just me dreaming, I fully suspect we will see some of those area revitalize sooner than later.
I had missed your replies till last night, everyone. Thanks so much for your continued input. I don't know how to quote people on City-Data so I'll just "Boldface" some references here. I hope that key works! Ferraris, right now I'm looking for cheaper, so if Toledo is cheaper, that's appealing; however, I am a bit concerned to dive in with my time constraints, so for that part Cleveland wins but it may not in the long run. I never knew Toledo is warmer. Wow, that's appealing! I'm in a short lease here that ends this month. I'm going to go on the month to month plan through August to prepare and hope I can be out of here by then. I don't want to renew yet again for various reasons, all due to the lousy management and maintenance I can't stomach anymore, as well as cost.
I signed up for early Social Security due to the state of the economy, etc. so that starts in August. I just turned 62. The job situation is horrible for me here. I currently teach ESL online part-time but it isn't much right now. I want to register to sub, I suppose, so with online work (which I can expand) and subbing and SS and possibly one other resource I think I can make it to rent for the time being. I see one bedrooms there are a bit less - the $600s and include heat.
I only have one social contact in Ohio now, in Findlay. I visited there some years back considering enrolling in the Master's in TESOL program at UF. I did have contacts in Olmsted Falls but they have since passed away. So, I'll be starting fresh. Sadly, here in Durham, NC I don't have anyone I consider a close friend, only some acquaintances. It's always been hard to make friends here and I think age is also a factor, plus the culture. I drive practically everywhere but it would be a nice option to be in a walkable area, not required, but a way to cut down on gas some, along with public transportation in the winter months. As for hospitals, it's just nice to know they're there and not hours away.
Sheena, Tremont sounds charming! How cool having a restaurant named "Fat Cats" to take Mollie to! As far as the food, actually as far as Florida restaurants go, where I'm originally from (Miami) has lots of ethnic diversity and some top notch restaurants. The Latino flavor - Nicaraguan, Venezuelan, Cuban are what I miss most. I have no more family in Miami anymore and the cost of living there is outrageous, so I have no desire nor the means to return there.
Tobias, today I'm going to check out the cities you mentioned online - Maumee, Perrysburg, Sylvania and the others. I have heard of Perrysburg before. The Prof, are there any bluer areas in either city?
I don't know how all this will happen but all I know is I want out of Durham and out of this apartment, with my stress level through the roof. Things have worsened since March with the start of COVID, an infestation by bedbugs which was a shock when it happened since I never experienced this before, seeking employment after being laid off, etc. I've spoken with a few apt. communities in the Cleveland area so far but may have to find an Airbnb temporarily if I don't find a place. insofar as income, they did say they look at bank accounts and/or investments to satisfy wage requirements too, so that's a little encouraging.
It's more about less snow and ice than being warmer. It's about the same temperature wise. Both are warmer than Madison, though!
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I see one bedrooms there are a bit less - the $600s and include heat.
So honestly, I think you're actually in the range where there is a noticeable difference between the quality of neighborhood and apartment you'll get in Toledo vs. Cleveland. In both metros you'll have to be cautious about selecting a neighborhood and apartment building at that price range.
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I drive practically everywhere
Toledo rentals will have free or very cheap parking compared to Cleveland. Also Toledo does not have emissions testings on vehicles, which is a nuisance and can cost money in repairs to pass.
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but it would be a nice option to be in a walkable area, not required, but a way to cut down on gas some, along with public transportation in the winter months.
Cleveland is definitely better for this, but only in the right areas, which might be tricky in your price range. I would focus on Shaker Square, Larchmere, and parts of Cleveland Heights.
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As for hospitals, it's just nice to know they're there and not hours away.
I think this is basically a wash. Both metros have plenty of hospitals.
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Tobias, today I'm going to check out the cities you mentioned online - Maumee, Perrysburg, Sylvania and the others. I have heard of Perrysburg before.
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The Prof, are there any bluer areas in either city?
Also look into the Old West End. It's less family centric than these suburbs.
Cleveland Heights is literally the most democratic city in the state. The rest of the heights and the Old West End have a reputation for being pretty liberal and progressive as well. Perrysburg, Maumee, and Sylvania are more of a mixed bag politically, but still leaning blue.
Both cities have great art museums...Cleveland's is probably "better", but not by an amount that should sway your choice either way.
Toledo has a very good art museum, arguably the third best in Ohio after Cleveland and Cincinnati, perhaps fourth best if ranked with the Butler in Youngstown which is dedicated to American art, but the Toledo Museum of Art is not in the same elite category as the Cleveland Museum of Art, one of the nation's better encyclopedic art museums and especially strong in Asian art. Persons who enjoy art museums would immediately notice the difference in the quality of facilities, collections, exhibitions (Cleveland regularly participates in notable international exhibitions), and technology.
The Toledo Museum of Art is famed for its glass collection. See the discussion of Toledo here.
The presence of the CMA in Cleveland would most certainly sway my choice, and I'm not even a regular visitor to the CMA. I visit it perhaps six times per year, definitely trying to see most exhibitions.
The Toledo Museum of Art is better than the art museums in some much larger U.S. cities, but Ohio is blessed with great art museums.
Read about the Cleveland Museum of Art in the following travel article. This is a somewhat dated article, and it doesn't reflect the closures of the museum's notable performing arts and cinema programs due to the COVID-19 epidemic.
The CMA is considered a technology innovator with arguably the best digital technology in the U.S., built into the museum during its massive renovation and expansion in the past decade.
So, if the OP greatly enjoys art museums, this would be a decisive advantage for Cleveland.
Additionally, Oberlin possesses one of the better university/college art museums, and Cleveland is much closer to the Butler in Youngstown, an easy day trip. Akron also has a good regional art museum. Check also the Transformer Station in Cleveland's Ohio City. It's affiliated with the CMA with an emphasis on photography.
Ferraris, right now I'm looking for cheaper, so if Toledo is cheaper, that's appealing
If you want cheaper, check out Painesville or Fairport Harbor in Lake County. It's an easy drive to University Circle. Lake County's Laketran offers Dial-a-Ride, point-to-point service including to University Circle's medical centers at discounted rates for seniors. It also offers scheduled service to Cleveland.
Lake Metroparks are superb, and two of Ohio's better beaches in Mentor and Fairport Harbor are nearby. Fairport Harbor has a dog beach. Also nearby Painesville is Holden Arboretum, one of the best in the U.S.
You can search for dog parks, but Lake Metroparks Farmpark has a good one. The Farmpark reportedly is one of the best in the U.S.
Two Lake Country Metroparks -- Beaty Landing and Helen Hazen Wyman -- are either in or immediately adjacent to Painesville.
Mentor, adjacent to Painesville, is the sixth largest commercial district in Ohio with most big box stores, a major mall, and numerous shopping centers.
Johnson Apartments is located directly on Painesville's town square, which hosts many events including a weekly farmers' market in season.
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