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The link also discusses and compares costs, projected ridership, length etc.
What do you think? Is the subway is good idea? Is the LRT a good idea? Are they both good/bad ideas? Should the money be spent elsewhere, or is one of these plans ideal?
Scarborough subway extension to STC makes sense on paper but not if that stops LRT construction elsewhere or We also have to pay for it and we can't do it simply by cutting "gravy" or expecting the private sector to come in and build one as some of our political leadership seems to think.
If they can't get the money, we revert back to the old plan.
I agree... if all of the finances can be secured they should do it asap.... Otherwise get back the the old plan. The Scarborough RT is basically at its end life and something needs to be done. But I do prefer the subway option over the LRT one.
If by LRT you mean people have to get off at Kennedy and change to a different train, then I vote for the subway.
Although I think getting the DRL from Sheppard and Don Mills station directed to downtown across King or Queen st is more important than anything, including the Eglinton LRT under construction.
I don't understand why Scarborough is even part of Toronto. Why can't they join Pickering and become a new city. All this talk about Scarborough is extremely tiring.
I'll just say that I strongly believe that Metrolinx's Big Move Plan is the best way to extend the most and best rapid transit across Toronto in the least amount of time, with a price tag that subways in lower density inner suburbs can never match. The Sheppard Stubway has shown the city that below-ground trains in parts of the city outside the most densely-populated areas cannot sustain ridership numbers to justify the expense. People living in most of Toronto's inner suburbs need to realize that well-executed light rail will serve their interests much better than subways. They can be built faster and cheaper, which makes it much more likely that the lines will get built in the first place, because Toronto does not have a good record of actually building the subway lines it proposes.
And besides, why do people think a below-ground subway will be so much better than a re-built, above-ground RT with a great new design? It will certainly cost more to go underground, but it won't necessarily make the RT any better for riders. However, its cost will make it more likely that other proposed Scarborough LRT routes will not get built, or that any of the planned light rail lines across Toronto will come to fruition. If there's any subway line that needs to get built NOW it's the Downtown Relief Line. But that doesn't sell well for a mayor whose constituents are mostly from inner suburbs like Scarborough. Well-planned, modern light rail like what was proposed by Metrolinx to connect much of the inner suburbs to the subway makes the most sense when one considers population densities, ridership levels, and costs.
It's all quite frustrating. I'm glad that there's at least a couple projects going on in the ground. It's some progress.
I'll just say that I strongly believe that Metrolinx's Big Move Plan is the best way to extend the most and best rapid transit across Toronto in the least amount of time, with a price tag that subways in lower density inner suburbs can never match. The Sheppard Stubway has shown the city that below-ground trains in parts of the city outside the most densely-populated areas cannot sustain ridership numbers to justify the expense. People living in most of Toronto's inner suburbs need to realize that well-executed light rail will serve their interests much better than subways. They can be built faster and cheaper, which makes it much more likely that the lines will get built in the first place, because Toronto does not have a good record of actually building the subway lines it proposes.
And besides, why do people think a below-ground subway will be so much better than a re-built, above-ground RT with a great new design? It will certainly cost more to go underground, but it won't necessarily make the RT any better for riders. However, its cost will make it more likely that other proposed Scarborough LRT routes will not get built, or that any of the planned light rail lines across Toronto will come to fruition. If there's any subway line that needs to get built NOW it's the Downtown Relief Line. But that doesn't sell well for a mayor whose constituents are mostly from inner suburbs like Scarborough. Well-planned, modern light rail like what was proposed by Metrolinx to connect much of the inner suburbs to the subway makes the most sense when one considers population densities, ridership levels, and costs.
It's all quite frustrating. I'm glad that there's at least a couple projects going on in the ground. It's some progress.
I do agree with this.
Though I like subways better, LRTs are cheaper and are quicker to construct. What I hate about LRTs though are what they do to the streets and what obstacles they face (weather, construction, taking away a lane from cars on certain parts of avenues, etc). Also they are slower than subways.
But with subways, those they are faster and all, they take forever to build, and you get less track than you do with LRTs.
What do/did you think about the Transit City plan from when Miller was in office?
What do/did you think about the Transit City plan from when Miller was in office?
Transit City is a half-assed plan to start with. People have mistaken it to be anything close to rapid transit, not to mention subways. Miller wanted to make it part of his legend, but if implemented, Toronto will be stuck with a half-efficient system for years.
For a system to work like a real rapid transit, it has to have the following features, no matter what is called (subway, LRT, streetcar, at grade, below grade, I don't care).
1) Do NOT stop for traffic signals. (or at least seldom. Otherwise, it is not really "rapid" transit)
2) separated from cars
3) Do NOT have a stop every 300 meters. The minimum distance should be 800m-1km in a suburban area such as North York or Scarborough.
Transit City only satisfies #2, I think.
I am so sick taking the 510 and 501 which stops at every red light, plus every 200 meters for one or two persons to get off. Heck, there is a Victoria st stop on 501, which is like 100 meters from Yonge stop. I have never seen anywhere else where transit stops so fr**king frequently. It takes forever for someone to go from Yonge/Queen to Trinity Bellwood, easily 30 minutes, slower than walking sometimes.
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