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Typical Canadian who needs to put us Torontonians 'in our place' lol..
Anyway I posted some links a few page back with some great pics of the city from street level.. I think you in particular would enjoy them!
Will look at the link.
Quote:
Originally Posted by maclock
No problem here, P London. I wished only to disabuse you of a misconception on your part.
The T.O. boosters were only too quick to rush in and agree with your suggestion that Toronto might be something like London, which it isn't. You'll note that it's the plucky Torontonians who rushed in to agree with you. I was polite to you, for you're a stranger who has no reason to know the difference. They know the difference, however, and they're all too ready to agree with people's misconceptions that Toronto is like somewhere like London. Be well, mon vieux. Be well.
As another poster said not everyone sees the world like you, for me Toronto is very much like London in the inner city bit of both cities.
As I live in London I have a right to compare if I lived in neither then maybe not..
As another poster said not everyone sees the world like you, for me Toronto is very much like London in the inner city bit of both cities.
As I live in London I have a right to compare if I lived in neither then maybe not..
And I've lived in Toronto. And I've visited London a number of times over the years.
I didn't say that you don't have the right to compare the two, P London. I don't have any quarrel with you. You don't yet know that the two aren't alike because you haven't visited Toronto.
When you do get a chance to check out Toronto in person, then please do share your impressions with us. I'd be very interested to hear what you have to say about this matter once you've had your boots on the ground.
Toronto will not even surpass Chicago in any of our lifetimes. It's economy is around that of Boston, Philly, Houston, Dallas and Atlanta, and badly trails that of Chicago, DC and SF. Then there's LA, which smashes all North American economies excepting NYC.
And NYC has three times the economy of Chicago, and around five times the economy of Toronto.
Saying Toronto will surpass a city with five times the economy makes about as much sense as saying Buffalo will surpass Toronto's economy.
Several issues with your post
1) you have to take into account regarding GDP is that U.S GDP numbers that are often cited are based on inflated CSA/MSA population stats that other countries like Canada don't use. If we were to compare things on an apples to apples (which isn't easy crossing borders) basis than the GDP of a CSA/MSA metro Toronto would substantially increase the GDP of the city. The latest GDP for the GTA is about 330 Billion - factoring in the 7-8 million it would have in a CSA/MSA it would be over 400 Billion so the difference isn't as much as you think. Additionally one would have to be a bit weary in comparing GDP between different countries - i'm sure there would be some accounting issues there.
2) GDP on its own isn't the only factor in making a city a 'global city' - For instance, Sydney is now an Alpha plus global city ranking it higher than Toronto and Chicago yet it has a smaller GDP than Toronto and Chicago. Houston and Dallas each have a larger GDP than Hong Kong, Milan and Frankfurt yet they are only considered Beta class world cities while HK, Milan and Frankfurt are Alpha Plus. Something to consider and you may want to broaden your definition on what constitutes a 'global city' to something more than just GDP. I mean would you really consider Houston to be a greater global city than Hong Kong or even D.C and S.F because it has a larger GDP than them.
I'm sure in the 1950's many would have said that Toronto would never exceed Chicago in city proper population.. Chicago was 3 times the population.. You know what happened in 2013 so if Toronto closed such a large gap in 60 years and is inching closer to Chicago in more ways than one I think 10 years a lot more can change than you give credit for and this could also be towards Chicago's favour btw and the tides could start to shift.
BTW - Buffalo's GDP is 46 Billion.. Toronto's MSC/CSA GDP would be 400 Billion and most likely even greater - there's a heck of a bigger gap between Buffalo's GDP and Toronto's versus Toronto's GDP and Chicago's - your comparison is way off the mark there.
Quite similar to Chicago. Although multiple high-rise neighborhoods like NYC. And Canadians doesn't give Toronto enough love.
The greater primacy a city has the less love it seems to get in most countries generally speaking. Having said that I agree with you, Toronto is seemingly much maligned by the rest of Canada and the explanations for such border on the absolute ridiculous. They are usually rooted in petty emotions as opposed to anything rational.
The "haters" won't "bash" Toronto this much if the city is always placed against its real peers, such as Chicago in the US, Madrid or Berlin in Europe. It is simply no comparison to cities like London but some keep making such analogies just to feel good, and blame others who don't agree "haters".
I think if you look at the context of the posts in this thread - any comparisons between Toronto and London weren't at all meant to mean the two were equal or that they are substantially similar - it was simply similarities that certain individuals see. Obviously there are differences. I also find it odd that you would say that people making comparisons were only doing such to make themselves feel better - I didn't get that at all.. You've been in Toronto for over 5 years now from what I remember, go ask your colleagues and friends what they think about Toronto vs cities like NYC, Tokyo and London.. I think you'll get most saying Toronto isn't on their level and they would largely be quite humble about Toronto's perch in the global arena of 'great' cities.
Well you seem pretty obsessed with Toronto, and you almost always have to counter anything good that someone says about the city. I just don't understand your constant need to attack the city and its residents. No one in Toronto thinks it's the greatest city on earth, many are just very proud of the amazing growth and the way the city is maturing. The Toronto homers have every right to counter the constant attacks from others who think they know the city. I see a lot of Toronto posters putting actual data out there, and it's still questioned and dismissed instantly, I just don't get it.
I think you are quite right in this post actually.. Certain CD forummers who don't have much of a connection to the city make an unusually high number of posts about it in practically every vs thread about it. By and large these few individuals are largely knocking the city and the commentary is far from being balanced.
Please point us to this "data" that shows Toronto has a comparable economy to NYC. Heck, show us data that shows it has one comparable to that of Chicago, or the Bay Area, or Washington.
The onus isn't on anyone to provide data that doesn't exist... Canadian cities don't have CSA's or MSA's.
This is probably true but the gap has been closing in terms of global importance. If you look at GAWC and respect that source (its not the be all and end all of global city rankings but it is one of the more credible out there) than both Chicago and Toronto are alpha class global cities. Toronto has also closed the gap with Chicago in other areas also ie Finance and actually has a larger creative arts industry.
I like Toronto... don't get me wrong (I live just across the border in New York), but Chicago is its big brother. It is inferior in nearly every aspect other than crime. Chicago is just.... the **** really. Chicago is probably the Best City in America IMO, especially considering its price. It is the best bargain in the world, with an unmatched waterfront.
The big thing that will hamper Toronto is poor city planning going forward. Lack of adequate subway, sprawling overstressed highways, housing bubble brewing, and an inadequate Airport option for U.S. bound flights (although Pearson is huge, half of Southern Ontario shouldn't be crawling to Buffalo to use ours all the time).
The onus isn't on anyone to provide data that doesn't exist... Canadian cities don't have CSA's or MSA's.
In other words, you have no argument. You're arguing "I can claim whatever, just because".
Obviously every country has its own method of metro area classification. Germany doesn't do metro areas like France, Mexico doesn't do metro areas like Brazil. The variability in data collection procedures across national lines doesn't mean that cities can't be compared across national lines.
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