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I don't think Toronto feels mid-sized either at its current state. Not sure where you read into that. Although certain aspects of TO feel like they were designed for a city smaller than what it has evolved into. Both Chicago and Toronto more than qualify as "large" cities, but not "mega" cities, at least in North America. Both also bring some limelight to the Great Lakes region as well, as they are both the major anchors.
In red and don't mean to be abrasive here but clearly you haven't read all the posts in this thread lol.....
Speaking of Megacities - If growth continues over the next 30-40 as it has in the last the GTA will be Canada's first Megacity.
I am not sure if Toronto is close to being a magacity, but it is doing quite well.
Today, I was walking from Dundas/Yonge to Queen's park, and there is so much construction going on. Near the College/Yonge intersection alone, there is like 4-5 mega projects going on, probably to bring 3000+ residents to the core. Not to mention other parts of Toronto.
I know I criticized Toronto a lot, at least in the past. But the fact is, at least in North America, it is doing exceptionally well. I particularly LOVE the pro-growth approach the city is adopting, very pragmatic and progressive. If there is a demand, let the market to meet it. The city is definitely on the right path in increasing density in the city centre as well as long major avenues such as St Clair and Eglinton, not without setbacks of course. We are forging ahead without looking back, leaving others in the dust.
You wouldn't know it if not compared with some of other similar sized cities. For example, San Francisco is like the king of NIMBY, and the few times I posted on the SF forum, it is filled with people claiming SF is "the second densest city in America" and therefore "there is no need to add density/supply", and "those who can't afford it should just leave", in order to "protect the urban fabric and characters" (as if those hideous slabs in Bayview or cookie cutter houses in Sunset have any characters) etc etc. People tend to romanticize cities like San Francisco, but in reality except for weather and the natural landscape (which is beyond human control), Toronto in comparison is doing so well and will leave it behind if it hadn't done so. Those cities become so elite-minded and don't think they need to grow or change any more, and are "fine" with their boring low density suburbs whose existence they refuse to admit, and think high housing price is a result of success not requiring any solution.
Toronto may never become as great as NYC, but if the current trend continues, I can totally see it becoming powerful enough to leave Chicago/San Fran/Boston etc behind and challenge Los Angeles. I don't meant to put down other cities, but the growth momentum, especially the focus on the city centre, is of different levels.
I am not sure if Toronto is close to being a magacity, but it is doing quite well.
Today, I was walking from Dundas/Yonge to Queen's park, and there is so much construction going on. Near the College/Yonge intersection alone, there is like 4-5 mega projects going on, probably to bring 3000+ residents to the core. Not to mention other parts of Toronto.
I know I criticized Toronto a lot, at least in the past. But the fact is, at least in North America, it is doing exceptionally well. I particularly LOVE the pro-growth approach the city is adopting, very pragmatic and progressive. If there is a demand, let the market to meet it. The city is definitely on the right path in increasing density in the city centre as well as long major avenues such as St Clair and Eglinton, not without setbacks of course. We are forging ahead without looking back, leaving others in the dust.
You wouldn't know it if not compared with some of other similar sized cities. For example, San Francisco is like the king of NIMBY, and the few times I posted on the SF forum, it is filled with people claiming SF is "the second densest city in America" and therefore "there is no need to add density/supply", and "those who can't afford it should just leave", in order to "protect the urban fabric and characters" (as if those hideous slabs in Bayview or cookie cutter houses in Sunset have any characters) etc etc. People tend to romanticize cities like San Francisco, but in reality except for weather and the natural landscape (which is beyond human control), Toronto in comparison is doing so well and will leave it behind if it hadn't done so. Those cities become so elite-minded and don't think they need to grow or change any more, and are "fine" with their boring low density suburbs whose existence they refuse to admit, and think high housing price is a result of success not requiring any solution.
Toronto may never become as great as NYC, but if the current trend continues, I can totally see it becoming powerful enough to leave Chicago/San Fran/Boston etc behind and challenge Los Angeles. I don't meant to put down other cities, but the growth momentum, especially the focus on the city centre, is of different levels.
No worries botti - I enjoy reading all your posts and understand what you like about a city and what you don't.. We all know that no city is going to be all pro's - just not going to happen in real life..
As for Toronto becoming a megacity - by 2041 it is projected that the population of the GTA will be 9.4 million.. If 10 million is a megacity than the GTA will most likely hit that mark by 2050.. We aren't even talking Golden Horseshoe or U.S style CSA measure - just an urban area like the GTA
With that said, the GTA won't be the only urban area that isn't a megacity in 2015 that will be before and in 2050 so megacities will become more of the norm globally as urbanization is increaingly taking hold.
I am not sure if Toronto is close to being a magacity, but it is doing quite well.
Today, I was walking from Dundas/Yonge to Queen's park, and there is so much construction going on. Near the College/Yonge intersection alone, there is like 4-5 mega projects going on, probably to bring 3000+ residents to the core. Not to mention other parts of Toronto.
I know I criticized Toronto a lot, at least in the past. But the fact is, at least in North America, it is doing exceptionally well. I particularly LOVE the pro-growth approach the city is adopting, very pragmatic and progressive. If there is a demand, let the market to meet it. The city is definitely on the right path in increasing density in the city centre as well as long major avenues such as St Clair and Eglinton, not without setbacks of course. We are forging ahead without looking back, leaving others in the dust.
You wouldn't know it if not compared with some of other similar sized cities. For example, San Francisco is like the king of NIMBY, and the few times I posted on the SF forum, it is filled with people claiming SF is "the second densest city in America" and therefore "there is no need to add density/supply", and "those who can't afford it should just leave", in order to "protect the urban fabric and characters" (as if those hideous slabs in Bayview or cookie cutter houses in Sunset have any characters) etc etc. People tend to romanticize cities like San Francisco, but in reality except for weather and the natural landscape (which is beyond human control), Toronto in comparison is doing so well and will leave it behind if it hadn't done so. Those cities become so elite-minded and don't think they need to grow or change any more, and are "fine" with their boring low density suburbs whose existence they refuse to admit, and think high housing price is a result of success not requiring any solution.
Toronto may never become as great as NYC, but if the current trend continues, I can totally see it becoming powerful enough to leave Chicago/San Fran/Boston etc behind and challenge Los Angeles. I don't meant to put down other cities, but the growth momentum, especially the focus on the city centre, is of different levels.
When it comes to growth, Toronto has already left SF and Boston behind. SF and Boston are NIMBY infested places and I pretty much despise that about them both. Toronto is already poised to pass up Chicago as well, not only in terms of growth but also overall importance. Considering many of the things Chicago does well are also where Toronto performs well overall. So it makes sense that the growth will push it ahead of Chicago, some day very soon.
As far as SF and Boston are concerned, while they are backwards when it comes to pro growth policies they are significantly more innovative and forward thinking than Toronto in other ways. Innovation and research based industries are poised to explode for the foreseeable future and both are better positioned to take advantage of that than Toronto. Now if Toronto can find a way to match their pro growth policies and become more innovative at the same time, watch out!
When it comes to growth, Toronto has already left SF and Boston behind. SF and Boston are NIMBY infested places and I pretty much despise that about them both. Toronto is already poised to pass up Chicago as well, not only in terms of growth but also overall importance. Considering many of the things Chicago does well are also where Toronto performs well overall. So it makes sense that the growth will push it ahead of Chicago, some day very soon.
As far as SF and Boston are concerned, while they are backwards when it comes to pro growth policies they are significantly more innovative and forward thinking than Toronto in other ways. Innovation and research based industries are poised to explode for the foreseeable future and both are better positioned to take advantage of that than Toronto. Now if Toronto can find a way to match their pro growth policies and become more innovative at the same time, watch out!
To add to the last part Canada in general in terms of a innovation, research and technology driven economy to balance our immense resource wealth - this way when the price of oil or other resources tank the value of our dollar won't be as susceptible to fluctuation.
To add to the last part Canada in general in terms of a innovation, research and technology driven economy to balance our immense resource wealth - this way when the price of oil or other resources tank the value of our dollar won't be as susceptible to fluctuation.
Agreed. Alot of what is holding Toronto back in those departments is due to Federal policies that are severely dated. In addition to this present government showing no interest in scientific research.
I don't think Toronto feels mid-sized either at its current state. Not sure where you read into that. Although certain aspects of TO feel like they were designed for a city smaller than what it has evolved into. Both Chicago and Toronto more than qualify as "large" cities, but not "mega" cities, at least in North America. Both also bring some limelight to the Great Lakes region as well, as they are both the major anchors.
I stand by my conclusion. If cities are categorized into big, mid sized an small, then Toronto is unquestionably a mid sized one.
It appears small in comparison with Tokyo, New York, London, shanghai,Beijing, Seoul, istanbul, Rio de Janeiro, Sao Palau, Paris, Moscow, Wuhan, Guangzhoy, Mumbai, Osaka, Mexico City etc. it is about the worlds 50th largest.
In terms of feel, it feels smaller than Rome, Madrid, buenos aires, or hangzhou, although with similar population. It hardly feels bigger than Barcelona actually.
I am not trying to put down Toronto because being big doesn't necessarily mean better. I would not want to live most of the big cities I mentioned above (maybe except Paris). But the truth is Toronto is not such a big city.
I stand by my conclusion. If cities are categorized into big, mid sized an small, then Toronto is unquestionably a mid sized one.
It appears small in comparison with Tokyo, New York, London, shanghai,Beijing, Seoul, istanbul, Rio de Janeiro, Sao Palau, Paris, Moscow, Wuhan, Guangzhoy, Mumbai, Osaka, Mexico City etc. it is about the worlds 50th largest.
In terms of feel, it feels smaller than Rome, Madrid, buenos aires, or hangzhou, although with similar population. It hardly feels bigger than Barcelona actually.
Botti, maybe you've lived in downtown for too long? I mean there are so many different neighborhoods and commercial centers throughout the city of toronto, not to mention GTA. I drive to many companies in the GTA area for consulting projects all the time, and the city does not feel small at all. Not just because it's spread out, but because there are many densely populated neighborhoods and commercial centers even outside downtown core, Yonge/Bloor arteries. Just saying.
Botti, maybe you've lived in downtown for too long? I mean there are so many different neighborhoods and commercial centers throughout the city of toronto, not to mention GTA. I drive to many companies in the GTA area for consulting projects all the time, and the city does not feel small at all. Not just because it's spread out, but because there are many densely populated neighborhoods and commercial centers even outside downtown core, Yonge/Bloor arteries. Just saying.
I am biased.
If I can't walk comfortably with plenty of retail and pedestrians in sight, those areas simply don't exist to me because they are not part of the "city". For example Lawrence/Bayview doesn't count, nor does dufferin/Eglinton.
Nothing in Markham or Mississauga adds to the bigness of Toronto, or 90% of North York for that matter.
And yes you are right. I spend 95% of my time south of Bloor, 75% south of college/Carlton. I absolutely hate to walk 200 meters From one building to the next!
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