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12-14-2021, 06:32 AM
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Location: Newburyport, MA
8,605 posts, read 5,525,742 times
Reputation: 10643
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cvetters63
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All of those prototypes/early production vehicles make a dramatic visual statement for sure! |
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12-14-2021, 09:17 AM
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Location: In the heights
34,942 posts, read 34,271,222 times
Reputation: 19211
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Woof, I hope they gave a long heads up to their partners Mazda and Subaru.
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12-14-2021, 09:24 AM
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Location: Maryland
3,378 posts, read 1,482,801 times
Reputation: 5738
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OyCrumbler
Woof, I hope they gave a long heads up to their partners Mazda and Subaru.
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Considering how long it took to build those prototypes, and how long they've been working on solid state batteries (including showing running, driving prototypes) I"m sure that both partners know it well enough (and have versions already lined up). I mean, this year we're getting a couple of those EVS already:
Lexus RZ, Toyota bZ4X and Subaru Soltarra.
https://www.subaru.com/solterra-ev
https://www.toyota.com/upcoming-vehicles/bz4x/
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a3...-ev-confirmed/ |
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12-14-2021, 12:22 PM
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10,521 posts, read 4,570,993 times
Reputation: 14042
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The Japanese are getting into EV only because competition is forcing them to. Notice that they didn't make a 100% commitment like GM did. Toyota, Mazda, etc. are all laggards on green vehicles and are way behind the Americans, the Europeans, the Chinese and the Koreans. Toyota's star has dimmed.
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12-19-2021, 09:15 PM
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14,419 posts, read 14,811,517 times
Reputation: 7582
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliott_CA
Toyota's star has dimmed.
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An interesting statement to make about a company that may take the record for US sales away from GM that has had it since 1931.
What price would you like to see to make Toyota's star less dim?
2022 RWD Tesla Model 3 st.+ : 272 miles | MSRP: From $44,990
2022 FWD Toyota BZ4x : ~ 250 miles | $$$
2022 FWD Nissan LEAF S PLUS : 226 mi | MSRP: From $32,400
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliott_CA
Notice that they didn't make a 100% commitment like GM did.
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They didn't even make anywhere near a nationwide 50% commitment for BEVs by 2035 (except Lexus will go fully electric by 2035). |
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12-21-2021, 08:38 PM
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6,539 posts, read 3,780,109 times
Reputation: 7828
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I think there will be a forecast shock when they realize most consumers don't want an EV.
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12-27-2021, 09:27 AM
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Location: Maryland
3,378 posts, read 1,482,801 times
Reputation: 5738
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyHobkins
I think there will be a forecast shock when they realize most consumers don't want an EV.
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Most consumers haven't been given many choices. Either an expensive Tesla sedan, or a cheap Bolt hatchback. That's not the category of cars people are buying. But as the Model Y chows, an EV crossover will sell, and the manufacturers (after they come out of the supply shortage) have a slew of them lined up. Just like the waiting list for the Ford Lightning and Chevy Silverado EV pickups show, you build them in the categories people are already buying and you will sell a ton.
You want to talk market share RIGHT NOW? Ok. There are close to 100 different car/crossover/SUV/truck models. One of those models can represent 1% of the market. If 1-2 of those models are EVs, they will necessarily represent 1-2% of the market. If you increase the number to 5 models, you can increase that to about 5% market share at current production capacities. Guess what There are about 5 affordable models on the market and they represent about 7% of the new car market share. About what you'd expect. But when you look at actual model breakdowns vs their ICE competition, you see that EVs do quite well. Cars like the Tesla Model 3 compete in the same bodystyle/price bracket as the BMW 3 series, Audi A4/5 and the Mercedes C class and handily outsells all of them. The Bolt competes against the MINI Cooper, Golf/GTI and Hyundai Veloster and seems to outsell them, too. (well not this year as there was a stop sale on the new ones while LG fixed the battery problem).
Ford is increasing production plans for the F150 due to way more pre-orders than they were going to make originally, and the Mach E is outselling the traditional Mustang handily, with a waiting list for it, as well.
So your "fact" is actually false. |
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12-27-2021, 03:27 PM
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14,419 posts, read 14,811,517 times
Reputation: 7582
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cvetters63
Most consumers haven't been given many choices.
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The indications from Norway are a "snowball" effect where once BEVs and PHEVs become the majority they begin to overtake gasoline vehicles very rapidly. BEV's started increasing by 10% per year.
This graph doesn't go into 2021, but there has been a huge change this year. For November 2021
BEVs: 73.8% market share
PHEVs: 17.4% market share
Most people aren't old enough to remember homes converted from coal to some other form of central heat. But the change was rather rapid. People didn't debate the cost per BTU of heat. They simply did it because coal was filthy and difficult to shovel or it was annoying to keep the automated feeders working. |
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