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Old 10-09-2018, 08:41 AM
 
Location: Spain
12,722 posts, read 7,533,782 times
Reputation: 22633

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
Unless you have a third world type train system then trains far out preform buses
Right, but since billions of people have third world train systems it seems a bit silly to just dismiss it as something that doesn't exist.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
I really don't know what planet you live on but buses in the US are generally not a great experience, and generally consist of some dodgy bus station with people sleeping all over the place and trying to beg people to pay for tickets. Buses are often delayed and overbooked, and the main bus operators are not some luxury service, indeed the biggest oerators are Greyhound and Megabus, wth some other regional opertaors such as Peter Pan.
This comment has nothing to do with the fact that there are many routes in the world where luxury bus services are as fast as trains and have seats that are as nice or nicer, contrary to what you claimed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
Lets face it posting some pics of some Japanese buses such as the Willer Express services, does not mean these buses are the norm in the US and in Japan they have a train service that is among the best in the world. The other company you posted LimoLiner does offer a service between NYC and Boston on it's three buses with prices starting at $99, and I think the other pictue is Vamoose Gold as it has a large 'V' on the seat. These services kind of defeat the object of the bus in most countries, however the US rail system seems to be quite poor.
I never said they were the norm in the US. There is more to the world than the US.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
In terms of where I live the train is twice as fast and you can walk around, get something to eat or even have a few beer or glasses of wine.
Great info. This does not make your blanket statements that trains are 2-3x faster and have better seating true. Depends on the bus, and the train.
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Old 10-09-2018, 09:08 AM
 
Location: Great Britain
27,043 posts, read 13,295,225 times
Reputation: 19266
Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
Right, but since billions of people have third world train systems it seems a bit silly to just dismiss it as something that doesn't exist.
Billions of peple do have good train lines, and lots more countries are looking to invest in them.

List of high-speed railway lines - Wikipedia

Planned high-speed rail by country - Wikipedia

Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang

This comment has nothing to do with the fact that there are many routes in the world where luxury bus services are as fast as trains and have seats that are as nice or nicer, contrary to what you claimed.
There are some really luxurious trains and train journeys, and even standard train jorneys are better than bus in my opinion. The ferry and plane are also better in terms of ammenities in relation to modern ferries and in terms of speed in terms of the plane.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang

I never said they were the norm in the US. There is more to the world than the US.
In other words most people's experience is waiting around in some bus station surrounded by people sleeping on benches and the homeless waiting for a Greyhound. I suppose there's always the Megabus.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang

Great info. This does not make your blanket statements that trains are 2-3x faster and have better seating true. Depends on the bus, and the train.
I did state in Europe and parts of Asia, although the train is still the better option in countries where it isn't as fast such as India, due to the roads being notoriously bad.

If you like taking the bus then good luck to you and if I were to take a bus I would rather it be as confortable as possible, the real problem is long bus journeys rather than just a few hours, indeed the longer the bus journey or the more changes the more intolerable it becomes. The train, especially if it's a good intercity service or eurostar service is much more pleasant in my view, you can stand up, walk about, get a meal, get a drink and the factthe train is faster in many countries means you don't have to spend as long on it, although if you do there are sleeper cabins.

I would take a long train or ferry journey over a long bus or even plane journey any day. Although the plane is definately the fastest mode of transport.

Last edited by Brave New World; 10-09-2018 at 09:46 AM..
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Old 10-09-2018, 03:47 PM
 
Location: Prince William County, VA
722 posts, read 1,918,729 times
Reputation: 468
Parents who bring their babies as "lap children" are horribly selfish. If you "can't afford" a seat for your baby, don't fly.
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Old 10-09-2018, 04:45 PM
 
1,584 posts, read 975,620 times
Reputation: 2609
Quote:
Originally Posted by HereinVA View Post
Parents who bring their babies as "lap children" are horribly selfish. If you "can't afford" a seat for your baby, don't fly.
Agreed. And that goes double for your phony service animal who should be in a carrier, if on board at all.
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Old 10-09-2018, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Spain
12,722 posts, read 7,533,782 times
Reputation: 22633
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
Billions of peple do have good train lines, and lots more countries are looking to invest in them.
Exactly, which is why all the blanket statements you keep applying are false. Some people have better train options, some don't. Someone in a third world country looking for the biggest seat isn't going to make a choice based on their country planning on investing in better rail, so it's not relevant.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
There are some really luxurious trains and train journeys, and even standard train jorneys are better than bus in my opinion. The ferry and plane are also better in terms of ammenities in relation to modern ferries and in terms of speed in terms of the plane.
Absolutely! It doesn't even have to be luxurious, when the wife and I go from DC to NYC we always take the train. When in Europe I (almost) always take the train, last long distance bus was from Cluj Romania to Budapest which I'm pretty sure took about same amount of time as the train. It fit our schedule a little better.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
In other words most people's experience is waiting around in some bus station surrounded by people sleeping on benches and the homeless waiting for a Greyhound. I suppose there's always the Megabus.

I did state in Europe and parts of Asia, although the train is still the better option in countries where it isn't as fast such as India, due to the roads being notoriously bad.
Funny disparage poor bus station experiences then talk up India, you ever been to the Delhi train station? Scammers out front latching on (literally) to any tourist trying to guide them to the "ticket office" that is actually one of the travel agencies they tout for. Little kids everywhere who's fingers find a way into your pockets. An army of beggars either sitting blocking the way or crabbing about on polio limbs.

You seem to love youtube videos, check out this tourists' experience of the glorious Indian train system:

https://youtu.be/6jBfAllb820?t=273

If you want to judge by station experience that sure doesn't help your case a Greyhound station versus Delhi.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
If you like taking the bus then good luck to you .
This is what you can't seem to get, I'm not talking about a preference and am not in this discussion as a big fan of one or the other. I'm just disputing the misinformation that is being spread saying trains have better seating and are 2-3x faster. It depends on the train, and on the bus. You being a big fan of trains doesn't make the blanket statement true, nor do every third world country seeming to have plans to improve their rail system someday.
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Old 10-09-2018, 11:25 PM
 
Location: Northern California
4,498 posts, read 2,934,972 times
Reputation: 8237
Default train vs bus

Sure, a train is more comfortable than a bus... but if you actually want to get to your destination on schedule, take the bus. On my two recent trips on Amtrak,
the lateness was measured in hours, not minutes. On one of those trips I overheard a train crewman telling a passenger: "this is not the way to travel if you
expect to be at a certain place at a certain time."
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Old 10-10-2018, 03:35 AM
 
Location: Great Britain
27,043 posts, read 13,295,225 times
Reputation: 19266
Quote:
Originally Posted by lieqiang View Post
Exactly, which is why all the blanket statements you keep applying are false. Some people have better train options, some don't. Someone in a third world country looking for the biggest seat isn't going to make a choice based on their country planning on investing in better rail, so it's not relevant.

Absolutely! It doesn't even have to be luxurious, when the wife and I go from DC to NYC we always take the train. When in Europe I (almost) always take the train, last long distance bus was from Cluj Romania to Budapest which I'm pretty sure took about same amount of time as the train. It fit our schedule a little better.

Funny disparage poor bus station experiences then talk up India, you ever been to the Delhi train station? Scammers out front latching on (literally) to any tourist trying to guide them to the "ticket office" that is actually one of the travel agencies they tout for. Little kids everywhere who's fingers find a way into your pockets. An army of beggars either sitting blocking the way or crabbing about on polio limbs.

You seem to love youtube videos, check out this tourists' experience of the glorious Indian train system:

https://youtu.be/6jBfAllb820?t=273

If you want to judge by station experience that sure doesn't help your case a Greyhound station versus Delhi.

This is what you can't seem to get, I'm not talking about a preference and am not in this discussion as a big fan of one or the other. I'm just disputing the misinformation that is being spread saying trains have better seating and are 2-3x faster. It depends on the train, and on the bus. You being a big fan of trains doesn't make the blanket statement true, nor do every third world country seeming to have plans to improve their rail system someday.
In countries that have poor train services, the roads are often poor as well and bus services are often poor and take a very long time.

In terms of the Indian train system I wasn't being disparaging, indeed I stated it was the lifeblood of India and preferable to the roads (which can be dangerous) and that I would rather take the train even in India. It's also amusing that you accuse me of being disparaging and then post a disparaging video regarding Indian trains.

I also dispute your assertion that a train from Romania to Bulgaria would take the same time as a bus, indeed Eastern Europe and Russia have relatively good train services.

High Speed Railroad Map of Europe - Wikipedia

If you like to be stuck on a bus then that's up to you, I prefer trains where you can walk about, go to the buffet car, get some food, enjoy a meal, enjoy a few cans of beer or some wine and have a pleasant fast journey. Equally ferries are very good facilities including cafes/restaurants, bars, duty free shops, cinemas, and on longer routes have sleeping cabins, spas, swimming pools/gyms, live entertainment, casinos and nightclubs.

Entertainment Onboard Our Ferries | DFDS

Ferry Facilities | Liverpool to Belfast | Stena Line

Facilities & entertainment on board Bretagne - Brittany Ferries

Your Onboard Experience With P&O Ferries | P&O Ferries - UK

Travel Info - Food on board | Eurostar

On board our trains – Great Western Railway

Onboard Our Trains - Experience - Virgin Trains

Food Options on Our Trains | LNER

As for buses they are often late due to heavy traffic, especially when travelling in to busy cities.

Mopst countries have a sense of pride in their rail system, the Europeans, many Asian countries, even Russia are immensly proud of their rail systems of course you have Great Train Journeys of the World and the BBC's Great Railway Journeys, however I have never heard of Great Bus Journeys.

Great Railway Journeys - Wikipedia


Last edited by Brave New World; 10-10-2018 at 04:21 AM..
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Old 10-10-2018, 04:41 AM
 
Location: Spain
12,722 posts, read 7,533,782 times
Reputation: 22633
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
In countries that have poor train services, the roads are often poor as well and bus services are often poor and take a very long time
Indeed, the bus can take as long as the train. That is why you cannot claim the train is 2-3x faster like you did, because it depends and yes there are countries with poor train service and poor roads where the bus is faster.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
In terms of the Indian train system I wasn't being disparaging, indeed I stated it was the lifeblood of India and preferable to the roads (which can be dangerous) and that I would rather take the train even in India. It's also amusing that you accuse me of being disparaging and then post a disparaging video regarding Indian trains.
You completely misunderstood. You were disparaging bus travel by pointing out the poor condition of some Greyhound stations in USA, yet somehow the state of India train stations (which can be far worse) are given a free pass. If we're criticizing a method of transportation because of poor stations then include the poor train stations all over the world too.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
I also dispute your assertion that a train from Romania to Bulgaria would take the same time as a bus, indeed Eastern Europe and Russia have relatively good train services
Here is the bus schedule from Cluj to Budapest (which isn't in Bulgaria):



Here is the train:



Clearly similar trip times can be achieved with the bus, and high speed rail map of Europe you posted shows this route (and many others) as the gray "less than 200 km/h" speed which of course would include a train moving along at a crawl. It doesn't bolster your case here.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
If you like to be stuck on a bus then that's up to you, I prefer trains where you can walk about, go to the buffet car, get some food, enjoy a meal, enjoy a few cans of beer or some wine and have a pleasant fast journey. Equally ferries are very good, the longer ferry jouney usually have cafes/restaurants, duty free shops, cinemas and even live entertainment, casinos and nightclubs.
I never mentioned a preference. Pointing out you have your facts wrong when saying trains are 2-3x faster and always have better seating options doesn't mean I endorse one method of traveling over the other. Some trains are faster, some are not. Some trains have better seating, some do not.

I do not prefer buses over trains. This is a recording.
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Old 10-10-2018, 04:46 AM
 
16,390 posts, read 12,405,212 times
Reputation: 59501
For crying out loud ... please stop.
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Old 10-10-2018, 06:24 AM
 
Location: Spain
12,722 posts, read 7,533,782 times
Reputation: 22633
Good idea, let's let this one go.
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