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Old 12-30-2013, 05:34 AM
 
137 posts, read 246,113 times
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When I visited Roanoke VA I was so happily surprised by how it looked and how it felt with mountains around the city. It felt cozy to me.

Tucson is surrounded by mountains, but I never seen video from the ground that turns around 360 to show what it looks like there. Nor a series of pictures.

Do tell me if Tucson feels all nestled in.

Have you ever seen any video or pictures that can place a person ground level to look around to help me?

For the second question.

Albuquerque though I love it in many respects really doesn't feel middle class, it feels poor. Don't know if the actual numbers can prove that out, it is just how it feels.

In Tucson you have fancy shmancy shopping and it seems that Tucson would feel more affluent then Albuquerque. If you know both places then comment, and if you only know Tucson still comment.

Would you say that if you are lower middle class Tucson affords a better lifestyle then Albuquerque?

And a buried comment I am smitten with the idea of fabulous rainbows and hummingbirds. Your unique plantlife, only found there. Really I thought ABQ was the land of magic but I think Tucson and your state might be it. Besides you having way more watery places.

Thank you

Last edited by TULSA2ABQ; 12-30-2013 at 06:50 AM..
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Old 12-30-2013, 12:21 PM
 
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We have real mountains in Tucson. Roanoke, VA has rolling hills. It sure is a curvy drive there. Beautiful area. Tucson area has mountains over 10,000 ft. There are mountains every where you look just about. The Catalina mountains are most spectacular to look at and you can drive to the top. It is about 9,157 ft at the top.

There is a nice mix of cultures here. Rich, poor and middle class. Depends on the neighborhood. The people are some of the most friendly in the USA. Over 1,000,000 people yet it has a small town atmosphere. You will Love it.
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Old 12-30-2013, 12:46 PM
 
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Tucson proper certainly has nice parts and middle class areas on the fringes. But realistically large swaths and sections of Tucson are old, poor and dilapidated. Downtown could use some work (lots of homeless). To be honest Tucson doesn't feel middle class to me, it feels incredibly blue collar or poor with incredible wealth in certain pockets and as you get closer to the mountains on the N, E and W sides.
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Old 12-30-2013, 03:07 PM
 
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Without really looking at the two cities closely I would guess Alburquerque has a more vibrant economy than Tucson. The Tucson school district has lost 13,000 kids over the past 12 years. There are areas that feel middle class like Tanque Verde and in the Catalina Foothills. Tucson doesnt have a vibrant middle class that for example the suburbs east of Seattle has. I live in a neighborhood that used to have a few children. Now its 169 homes and one child.

The housing market really collapsed in Tucson compared to Alburquerque and that tells you there wasnt much underlying growth except building houses. Tucson home prices fell from $196,000 to average $108,000 while Alburquerque only fell from $195,000 to $176,000. The market has recovered some but their are still a lot of bargains out there and Tucson is cheaper than Alburquerque.

You can easily drive through Tucson without leaving your computer. You can go to google maps and drag the yellow man onto almost any street and get a pretty good view in all directions.
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Old 12-30-2013, 03:52 PM
 
137 posts, read 246,113 times
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Great responses! I thank you.

Google maps and drag the yellow man! I never thought of that! Big Duh, I'm gong to do that right now.

Oh my gosh, just going around for a bit ( I will spend hours "driving' around, but it feels like SW Florida! Low flat houses and palm trees. Thank you so much for the Google man idea! I knew about it but it never clicked for me. Now I gotta go find the mountains!
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Old 12-30-2013, 04:35 PM
 
4,201 posts, read 12,958,169 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TULSA2ABQ View Post
Now I gotta go find the mountains!

gee, that should be easy to do!.....from 2400' to 9200' right at the edge of town!!....(you're not confusing Tulsa with Tucson, are you??!!)

Tucson and ABQ are pretty similar in size and vibe, I think....both are very laid-back and unpretentious....ABQ might have a bigger middle-class, maybe....the Sandias and the Catalinas are right next door to each city....
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Old 12-30-2013, 07:19 PM
 
Location: Tucson for awhile longer
8,875 posts, read 14,960,887 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZFLHigh View Post
... There is a nice mix of cultures here. Rich, poor and middle class. Depends on the neighborhood. The people are some of the most friendly in the USA. Over 1,000,000 people yet it has a small town atmosphere. You will Love it.
I would dispute a few of these statements with facts that don't bear them out. First, the Census Bureau lists the 2012 population of all of PIMA COUNTY as 992,394, and remember that's fewer than a million people spread out over an area the size of the entire STATE OF CONNECTICUT. So, no, "Tucson" does not have "over 1,000,000 people" and no one coming here would perceive that. The population of the City of Tucson (2012) was 524,295.

There is,indeed, a nice mix of cultures here. I live in a close-in suburb and we have white, Latino, and African American people owning homes in my subdivision. I personally find the Native American and Latino cultural influences to be interesting, just as I found the Eastern European, Irish, and Italian influences when I lived in Pittsburgh, PA, or the African-American influences when I lived in Washington, DC, interesting.

Related to the OP's question about poverty, nearly 25% of Tucson residents live BELOW the Federal poverty line. In fact, that figure is 17% for Albuquerque and 21% in Roanoke. If Albuquerque looks poorer than Tucson, it's an illusion. The median household income in Albuquerque is $47,399 compared to $36,939 in Tucson. Tucson is the poorest of the particular places under discussion here.

For example, the Tucson Unified School District has a dismal reputation and, as someone here already pointed out, has lost more than 10,000 students recently. In general, Arizonans' proclivity not to pay any more taxes than absolutely necessary results poor education from elementary school on up. The amount spent on education per student here, at every level of schooling, is MUCH lower than any place I have ever lived before. In fact, only Oklahoma, Idaho, and Utah spend less per student on public education than Arizona does, according to the U.S. Department of Education. And Arizona's spending dropped 2.3% between 2010 and 2011! New Mexico spends almost the same per-pupil as California does. Also, this area has far fewer college graduates than any place I've lived before. To me personally, the poverty of education is one of the most negative aspects of living here. And I firmly believe it's one of the major factors that will inhibit Pima County's future economic growth for anything but low-income jobs.

One of the more interesting statistics I find about Pima Co. is the age of residents. Living here, I get the idea that we have a huge number of retirees. It certainly seems to me that much of life here is geared toward our older residents. But that may just be because they are the ones with the money. In fact, only 16.6% of Pima Co. residents are over 65 and in the city of Tucson it drops to 12% (probably due to the presence of the university and the higher proportion of Latino residents). That 16% is EXACTLY the same as the percentage in Allegheny Co., PA, where I lived before I moved here. And while that's hardly the epicenter of hipsterism, I never perceived Allegheny Co. as having nearly the number of retirement communities Pima Co. has.

Our residents must not be aging in place because 20% of people in Pima Co. have lived at their current address for less than a year. Allegheny Co., PA, for comparison with an equal number of seniors, has only 13% of recent movers. That transient rate is even higher in the City of Tucson, probably because of students.

And finally, I'd like to sound a note about the friendliness of Tucsonans. No, I do not contend they are unfriendly. But friendlier than anywhere else? I've spent most of my career working with members of the public and I see generally no difference here than anywhere other place. One thing I will point out, areas with a high percentage of transient residents — not to mention places where the economy is dependent on tourists — tend to be more welcoming to newcomers and visitors than places where people have deep roots. For example, I used to live in our nation's capital, a place where thousands of people go for jobs that they believe to be temporary, be it political, military, or government employment. As a result, they are very social with other newcomers. On the other hand, Pittsburgh is filled with people who have lived there for generations and their social life is geared toward their families. People, therefore, have a much harder time making friends in Pittsburgh. I think many people who move to Tucson from far-away places move to the university community or retirement locations, both of which are filled with people willing to make friends with other newcomers. So it seems friendly. Which is great, but it doesn't mean the people here are different than elsewhere.

Last edited by Jukesgrrl; 12-30-2013 at 07:34 PM..
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Old 12-30-2013, 08:50 PM
 
Location: Tucson, AZ
175 posts, read 292,306 times
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Tucson's problems are far greater than the stingy mentality you mentioned concerning taxes. It is natives and long term resident's sick and tired of throwing money into the black hole of the city and county. The streets are crumbling, yet both governments dump money into "feel good" projects that benefit very few. The town in loaded with freeze dried hippies, ex-pat California greenies and other beyond the pale lefties who could not make it from where they came from. This is one of the worst places in the country to try and start a small business. I have been here over 25 years and can say this was a great place to live and in many ways, it still is. However, due to the idiots in the city/county governments, we are running down the same rabbit hole that Detroit, Buffalo and other cities that pander to the lunatic fringe have done.

With that said, Tucson is actually a jewel if you know where to live in the city. There are numbers of really nice neighborhoods in town. If moving to Tucson, think neighborhood, not area. Crime is actually not that bad. There is crime, but what city does not have that? Most shootings are gang related and actually do not involve "civilians".

I do agree that Tucson is no more or less friendlier than anywhere else. If you like Asian or Mexican food, this is heaven.
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Old 12-31-2013, 07:52 AM
 
1,500 posts, read 2,644,540 times
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I have never felt nestled in, in a good way or bad way. The only mountains that seem 'close' to where I live are the Catalinas. I have not gotten tired of seeing the Catalina mountains turn pink at that magical moment before sunset. I have not gotten tired of amazement at *completely* cloudless days. I have not gotten tired of the days that do have a cloud or two, knowing the sunset will be spectacular.

I live in Oro Valley and it doesn't feel remotely poor to me. (I wasn't sure how to word that without sounding awkward. OV is well-off but still has property crime). The regular working class areas of Tucson do not feel poor to me either. There is a distinct difference between areas where people have to work to make ends meet - I am one of those people! - and 'bad' neighborhoods. There are very few parts of Tucson that make me feel uncomfortable, but every city has them and Tucson is no exception.

My experiences with Tucson being friendlier than other places I've lived is that more older folk live here, and they tend to be a bit more relaxed. I mean, if they were in a hurry they would drive faster, right? Compared to New England, no question, this place seems like Prozac-land. But compared to the southeast, deep south or Texas? Pretty equivalent IMO.
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Old 12-31-2013, 11:06 AM
 
Location: Tucson, AZ
64 posts, read 129,210 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jukesgrrl View Post
I would dispute a few of these statements with facts that don't bear them out. First, the Census Bureau lists the 2012 population of all of PIMA COUNTY as 992,394, and remember that's fewer than a million people spread out over an area the size of the entire STATE OF CONNECTICUT. So, no, "Tucson" does not have "over 1,000,000 people" and no one coming here would perceive that. The population of the City of Tucson (2012) was 524,295.

There is,indeed, a nice mix of cultures here. I live in a close-in suburb and we have white, Latino, and African American people owning homes in my subdivision. I personally find the Native American and Latino cultural influences to be interesting, just as I found the Eastern European, Irish, and Italian influences when I lived in Pittsburgh, PA, or the African-American influences when I lived in Washington, DC, interesting.

Related to the OP's question about poverty, nearly 25% of Tucson residents live BELOW the Federal poverty line. In fact, that figure is 17% for Albuquerque and 21% in Roanoke. If Albuquerque looks poorer than Tucson, it's an illusion. The median household income in Albuquerque is $47,399 compared to $36,939 in Tucson. Tucson is the poorest of the particular places under discussion here.

For example, the Tucson Unified School District has a dismal reputation and, as someone here already pointed out, has lost more than 10,000 students recently. In general, Arizonans' proclivity not to pay any more taxes than absolutely necessary results poor education from elementary school on up. The amount spent on education per student here, at every level of schooling, is MUCH lower than any place I have ever lived before. In fact, only Oklahoma, Idaho, and Utah spend less per student on public education than Arizona does, according to the U.S. Department of Education. And Arizona's spending dropped 2.3% between 2010 and 2011! New Mexico spends almost the same per-pupil as California does. Also, this area has far fewer college graduates than any place I've lived before. To me personally, the poverty of education is one of the most negative aspects of living here. And I firmly believe it's one of the major factors that will inhibit Pima County's future economic growth for anything but low-income jobs.

One of the more interesting statistics I find about Pima Co. is the age of residents. Living here, I get the idea that we have a huge number of retirees. It certainly seems to me that much of life here is geared toward our older residents. But that may just be because they are the ones with the money. In fact, only 16.6% of Pima Co. residents are over 65 and in the city of Tucson it drops to 12% (probably due to the presence of the university and the higher proportion of Latino residents). That 16% is EXACTLY the same as the percentage in Allegheny Co., PA, where I lived before I moved here. And while that's hardly the epicenter of hipsterism, I never perceived Allegheny Co. as having nearly the number of retirement communities Pima Co. has.

Our residents must not be aging in place because 20% of people in Pima Co. have lived at their current address for less than a year. Allegheny Co., PA, for comparison with an equal number of seniors, has only 13% of recent movers. That transient rate is even higher in the City of Tucson, probably because of students.

And finally, I'd like to sound a note about the friendliness of Tucsonans. No, I do not contend they are unfriendly. But friendlier than anywhere else? I've spent most of my career working with members of the public and I see generally no difference here than anywhere other place. One thing I will point out, areas with a high percentage of transient residents — not to mention places where the economy is dependent on tourists — tend to be more welcoming to newcomers and visitors than places where people have deep roots. For example, I used to live in our nation's capital, a place where thousands of people go for jobs that they believe to be temporary, be it political, military, or government employment. As a result, they are very social with other newcomers. On the other hand, Pittsburgh is filled with people who have lived there for generations and their social life is geared toward their families. People, therefore, have a much harder time making friends in Pittsburgh. I think many people who move to Tucson from far-away places move to the university community or retirement locations, both of which are filled with people willing to make friends with other newcomers. So it seems friendly. Which is great, but it doesn't mean the people here are different than elsewhere.
I work for Comcast cable and my job entails going to 30-35 homes per week 5 days a week. I moved here from S. Florida. I can say with pretty good confidence that I find (IN GENERAL, there are bad apples everywhere) Tucsonans friendlier than people in Miami/ Ft. Lauderdale. It's my real world experience. For some reason, I find people living in the zip codes 85757 and 85746 the friendliest, easiest to deal with. Not sure why.
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