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Old 10-01-2013, 11:18 AM
 
396 posts, read 331,473 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clip314 View Post
Is dumbing down learning in Spanish? There is fetish among some Puerto Ricans, specially those who live in the U.S. and many of a Pitiyanki persuasion on the island, that English is the holy grail to educate kids. If this were so then why is the Puerto Rican community who lives in the states the least accomplished in school among all Latino groups? They all are taught in English, aren't they? Why is the U.S. falling behind in eduaction among all industrialized nations. They all are taught in English aren't they?

As if by magic Puerto Ricans were changed into English speakers tomorrow we would be no better off than the Nuyoricans in the United States, mostly unaccomplished and many living off the dole!

What we should strive for is GOOD EDUCATION , no matter what language its taught in. Kids in Spain , Mexico , Argentina, Cuba etc etc are taught in Spanish and they produce poets, writers, doctors, you name it they have them. They are also taught in English as a foreign language and they learn it because they and don't have the politics of language that we have. Bottom line , If learning in Spanish were so bad all Spanish speaking nations would be like Somalia. However the English language fetish among some Puerto Ricans hides something else, and its not about Education.

The ideal is that we can produce bilingual children but not the bilingualism that has stunted the growth of most Puerto Ricans in the United States.




typical view from a soberanista PPD apologist like you are.


1) Who said anything that learning proper Spanish is dumbing down? please dont make stuff up to make an argument. The fact is in the public schools in Puerto Rico, they don't teach proper SPANISH or proper ENGLISH for the many reasons discussed above. They don't even have a proper athletic program in the public schools. They don't even have a proper science program.


2) To your argument that the MINORITIES in inner cities in the U.S. don't accomplish in school on the level of the national standard has to do about many things that you didn't even bother to discuss. You put all Puerto Ricans in the states as all one category which is not doing your research properly. They are over 5 million Puerto Ricans living in the 50 states and they all don't live in New York City or the inner cities.


3) If you think like the Populares that mastering the English language is not the key to opportunities under the U.S. system and getting out of poverty than you are repeating the same kool aid as the populares have sold to keep the status quo that have Puerto Rico education system dumb down.



4) Mastering English is NOT the only necessity to get out of poverty in the U.S. but is one key element with other elements to be successful, something you didn't even mention when you made your inner cities comments and Nuyoricans living in poverty.


5) Nobody in this forum made the argument that the ONLY thing you need to do to get out of poverty and be successful in the U.S. system and global economy is just learn English. ...................but the fact is the overwhelming majority of Puerto Ricans in the states and in the island that are successful and have good careers do master the English language well something the Public Schools in Puerto Rico has failed.

How many Puerto Ricans that don't speak English that you know have successful careers in the U.S.? the only opportunities guarantee for those Puerto Ricans are cleaning jobs and manual labor and being on welfare for life.
In Puerto Rico you might get by barely not mastering English but your opportunities are very limited and gets smaller and smaller with the global economy.
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Old 10-01-2013, 12:03 PM
 
107 posts, read 280,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rush71 View Post
In Puerto Rico you might get by barely not mastering English but your opportunities are very limited and gets smaller and smaller with the global economy.
I agree with some of your points, particularly that even in Puerto Rico, many of the best paying jobs and executive positions require you to be bilingual, even if you use Spanish the majority of the time. Very interesting as there does seem to be a divide - those who believe that English is the answer for schools in Puerto Rico and those who believe the opposite and would promote Spanish, not even bilingualism. I personally hold that if one does not have a base in being able to read well in their native tongue (in this case Spanish), then learning a second language may be more challenging. I believe education should be taught in the native language first, and the English program should be revamped to have teachers who speak English well and who are not just translating English back to Spanish to make it easier on students. They should be fully immersed in the time that they are in English class to get them to start talking and using English daily.
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Old 10-01-2013, 12:54 PM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
7,801 posts, read 9,332,333 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boricuarosa View Post
I agree with some of your points, particularly that even in Puerto Rico, many of the best paying jobs and executive positions require you to be bilingual, even if you use Spanish the majority of the time. Very interesting as there does seem to be a divide - those who believe that English is the answer for schools in Puerto Rico and those who believe the opposite and would promote Spanish, not even bilingualism. I personally hold that if one does not have a base in being able to read well in their native tongue (in this case Spanish), then learning a second language may be more challenging. I believe education should be taught in the native language first, and the English program should be revamped to have teachers who speak English well and who are not just translating English back to Spanish to make it easier on students. They should be fully immersed in the time that they are in English class to get them to start talking and using English daily.
The problem is finding these teachers.

The obvious solution would be to have a sort of exchange program where a mainland Spanish class teacher would go to Puerto Rico and teach English, while the Puerto Rican English teacher would go teach Spanish in a mainland school. We could also try language class "Facetime" chats between island and mainland students - sort of like virtual penpals.
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Old 10-01-2013, 03:08 PM
 
396 posts, read 331,473 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boricuarosa View Post
I agree with some of your points, particularly that even in Puerto Rico, many of the best paying jobs and executive positions require you to be bilingual, even if you use Spanish the majority of the time. Very interesting as there does seem to be a divide - those who believe that English is the answer for schools in Puerto Rico and those who believe the opposite and would promote Spanish, not even bilingualism. I personally hold that if one does not have a base in being able to read well in their native tongue (in this case Spanish), then learning a second language may be more challenging. I believe education should be taught in the native language first, and the English program should be revamped to have teachers who speak English well and who are not just translating English back to Spanish to make it easier on students. They should be fully immersed in the time that they are in English class to get them to start talking and using English daily.




English alone is NOT the answer to reform the public school system in P.R. but a must in any reform with other things that we talked about above that you also included.

If you can't read and write in English coming out of high school at the level in Puerto Rico, how can you handle the college books which the majority are in English at a higher level or compete for good paying jobs in this global market?
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Old 10-01-2013, 06:02 PM
 
107 posts, read 280,841 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rush71 View Post
English alone is NOT the answer to reform the public school system in P.R. but a must in any reform with other things that we talked about above that you also included.

If you can't read and write in English coming out of high school at the level in Puerto Rico, how can you handle the college books which the majority are in English at a higher level or compete for good paying jobs in this global market?
This is true...however, PR is caught in a state of limbo between being a US colony and a Latin American country. PR is American on its surface, but very much a Latin American country at heart. How can we fault a country or expect them to produce that which is not spoken daily...English is a second language, not a first and that is why there are so many variants of skill levels from those who teach English to students themselves. It reminds me of the saying, "Use it or lose it!" If students aren't using it, save an hour or so during a 7-hour school day, it's the same reason why students in the US who study Spanish or French normally do not leave high school speaking fluently.
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Old 10-03-2013, 03:56 PM
 
107 posts, read 280,841 times
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Update: My friend arrived in Puerto Rico and is living in the Dorado/Toa Baja area. She enrolled her children in la Escuela Elemental Cristóbal Santana Melecio in Río Lajas, and also la Escuela Intermedia Ricardo Arroyo Laracuente, both in Dorado...not sure about what reputations or level of academics they offer, but so far she is pleased. Her children have only been at those schools for one week, so time will tell how they adjust. Thank you for all those who offered suggestions. This is a very good topic, one I believe is far overlooked on the forum. I decided to put my children in private school, just because that is what I'm used to. They were in private school in the states as well, so it made sense, but I understand the need for public education and I hope her children's experiences are better than what has been discussed here. Perhaps since they already have a foundation in English, they can build other skills if that department is not running optimally. Or, maybe, we'll be surprised....all it takes is a dedicated, well-prepared teacher to make all of the difference...
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Old 10-12-2013, 02:00 PM
 
18 posts, read 70,236 times
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Good public school are very limited. Are the one focused in an area
Santurce/ San Juan Area - Central High School ( 7-12) Art school
San Juan Area - Julian blanco - Dance school
Old San Juan Area - Jose Julian Acosta - Theater/ live performance
University Gardens - San Juan Rio Piedras area- Science and Math
University High Schoool UHS- 7-12 Good in most classes and good sport program
University elementary - k-12

Out of this, the school system and and the security is not recommended.
Private school, Catholic average $400 per Month; good one will find
lower band De La Salle $225 Month ( good academic)
$450 month- Marista
$600-850++++ San Ignacio, Perpetuo, Maria Reina
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Old 12-25-2013, 08:57 PM
 
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There are many good public schools in PR. I come from a big family in PR. We all went to public schools, and not 1 of us is on drugs, gangs, have been shot, and half of us went to collage with the education we got from a PUBLIC SCHOOL. So please, don't compare the public schools of PR with the ones in United States. That's an embarrassment to Puerto Rico.

Trust me, your friend's kids are way safer in a public school in PR than in U.S. At least she wont have to worry about her kids getting killed inside the school, as they do in U.S. Her kids wont have to worry about racist attacks, cuz we aint racist like North Americans are.
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Old 12-25-2013, 09:07 PM
 
3 posts, read 3,006 times
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Oh shut it!!! The Governor of PR don't even speak English. In PR you don't need English to be successful.
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Old 12-25-2013, 10:26 PM
 
351 posts, read 350,273 times
Reputation: 106
yeah what are the odds of 99.9% of Puerto Ricans becoming governor of Puerto Rico?


yeah listen to the guy above, don't learn English, ......your future is very bright. ....he sure learned English but tells others they don't need it......do what I say not what I do syndrome....LOL


There is a reason why they built the public schools in Puerto Rico like a penitentiary with barb wire fences around the school with 1 big iron gate to go in and go out only and on lock down during school hours......I'm sure they do that because it's a safe environment. LMAO!



I should have put the post on ignore :

Last edited by Sunscape; 12-31-2013 at 03:44 AM..
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