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Old 09-17-2014, 09:30 AM
 
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Territories are Americas wording for colonies. Therefore for Americans the U.S. doesn't have colonies. Tomorrow there will be a referendum on whether Scotland wants to remain united with England or not. I personally think the NO will win by a small margin because, similar to Puerto Rico, the folks on welfare and new immigrants won't kill the swan that lays the golden eggs. Nonetheless, at the last moment, London is offering autonomy in certain areas to placate the YES vote. Different from Puerto Rico , Scotland has full representation in parliament, the majority speaks English, the economy is in fairly good shape and the population is liberal, vs. Puerto Rico's rabidly dependent conservative welfare prone population.

Years ago when Quebec almost won an independent vote, but lost by a small margin because the new immigrants became a swing vote, and didn't want their kids to learn French. Canada gave Quebecois reforms to keep them in the fold. It made the nation officially bilingual, all provincial parliaments had to be bilingual, and the flag dropped the Union Jack to adopt a generic maple leaf.

Washington has refused to even consider changes in all its territories and its disenfranchised population in Washington DC. There was a hearing last week on giving Washington statehood, but nothing came of it. Puerto Rico voted 62% for statehood in 2012 but Puerto Rico hasn't been able to get a hearing despite Washington having 3.5 million American citizens disenfranchised.

The following article, although, not 100% applicable to the American colony in the Caribbean and its colonies in the pacific, might eventually give us some light on what may happen if they keep ignoring our pleas for equality. As of today PR statehood in Washington seems to be going no where. Different from Scotland, if Washington ever came to the choice of keeping Puerto Rico or give us statehood, Washington, as it appears, will offer a package and send us on our merry way and say, GOOD RIDENCE! NEXT!


http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/18/op...t&emc=rss&_r=0
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Old 09-17-2014, 12:05 PM
 
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Washington D.C. is not a territory. Is a federal district. The U.S. Constitution provides for a federal district under the exclusive jurisdiction of congress and the District is therefore not a part of any U.S. State or it can't have state's rights because it would be a conflict of interest with the federal government . The states of Maryland and Virginia each donated land to form the federal district.

Again, you would know this if they teach proper American Civics in the public schools in Puerto Rico.


Quote:
Different from Puerto Rico , Scotland has full representation in parliament, the majority speaks English, the economy is in fairly good shape and the population is liberal, vs. Puerto Rico's rabidly dependent conservative welfare prone population.
LMAO!!!! Puerto Rico has nothing conservative when it comes to government and social programs. Democrats outnumber Republicans 3 to 1 in P.R.....both parties that have ruled in P.R. for the past 60 years the PPD and NPP parties have been very liberal of big government, big spending, high debt, high taxes and pro dependent on federal aid.


Maybe you need a lesson between the difference a liberal and conservative in American politics.

Last edited by Hellion1999; 09-17-2014 at 12:34 PM..
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Old 09-17-2014, 12:33 PM
 
Location: On a Long Island in NY
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The Scottish pro-independence campaign can be summed up in one sentence: high on emotion (much like Puerto Rican separatists) but low on facts (again, much like Puerto Rican separatists).

The delusional pipe dreams of Alex Salmond and the Scottish Nirvana Party sound very similar to those of the soberanistas and independenistas in Puerto Rico.

Clip get your facts right, the Canadian flag was changed from the Red Ensign to the Maple Leaf in the 1960s under the "creeping republicanism" of then PM Lester Pearson, and the bilingualism was in force for years before 1995. The Quebec of 2014 is solidly pro-federalist ... a far cry from 1995. The pro-federalist Liberals and CAQ trounced the pro-separatists PQ and Quebec Greens/Solidarity in April's election.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quebec_...election,_2014
Quote:
The Quebec Liberal Party under Philippe Couillard won a majority government of 70 seats, while the incumbent Parti Québécois finished second with 30 seats, becoming the first single-term government since Jean-Jacques Bertrand's Union Nationale government was defeated in 1970. It marked the lowest seat total for the Parti Québécois since 1989 and its smallest share of the popular vote since its inaugural run in 1970, as Premier Pauline Marois lost her own riding. The Coalition Avenir Québec under François Legault made minor gains in terms of seats despite receiving a smaller share of the popular vote than in the previous election. Québec solidaire won an additional seat, though co-spokesperson Andrés Fontecilla failed to win his riding.
At the outset of the campaign, the Parti Québécois had a modest lead in the polls and appeared to have a realistic prospect of winning a majority government. However, the party's support began to collapse rapidly after the party announced Pierre Karl Péladeau, the president and CEO of media conglomerate Quebecor, as a star candidate.[1] Péladeau's conservative and anti-union business background was widely criticized as being at odds with the party's social democratic history;[2] and his outspoken support for a third referendum on Quebec sovereignty quickly sidelined the issues — including the Charter of Quebec Values and the corruption allegations against the Liberals, the latter of which had contributed to the defeat of Jean Charest's government in the 2012 election — which the party had identified as its primary campaign themes, alienating many voters who had little desire to revive the sovereignty issue.
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Old 09-17-2014, 04:55 PM
 
Location: Canada
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The CAQ is not a federalist party, its position is neutrality on the subject, and many federalists consider things like Legault's past membership in the PQ rather suspect. But yeah, the referendum didn't really lead to concessions for Quebec, the things that made the federation better, like bilingualism and the devolution of many powers, is why the referendum failed, they were not a reaction that happened after the result.
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Old 09-18-2014, 11:11 PM
 
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I really like the territories (beautiful islands, unique cultures), but in reality they don't bring much to the US anymore except a drain on the treasury. Guam still has big military installations/ strategic value, but the rest are pretty expendable. We're not using them to coal our battleships anymore, and the big installation on Vieques has long since closed. I don't see the US kicking any of them out, but if any of them wanted to vote for independence, I think the US response would be "Don't let the door hit you on the way out."
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Old 09-19-2014, 01:34 AM
 
Location: Macao
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Texamichiforniasota View Post
I really like the territories (beautiful islands, unique cultures), but in reality they don't bring much to the US anymore except a drain on the treasury. Guam still has big military installations/ strategic value, but the rest are pretty expendable. We're not using them to coal our battleships anymore, and the big installation on Vieques has long since closed. I don't see the US kicking any of them out, but if any of them wanted to vote for independence, I think the US response would be "Don't let the door hit you on the way out."
I have the opposite feeling. But I'm an American who lives over here in Asia, and see the enormity of the American military machine.

I also feel that whatever welfare recipients in Guam or somewhere might get some leftovers, the real bulk of the expensive is on all of the very expensive military operations running all over the world right now.
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Old 09-19-2014, 03:01 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
I have the opposite feeling. But I'm an American who lives over here in Asia, and see the enormity of the American military machine.


You don't see the military machine of China and North Korea and Russia's Putin from where you live?


You ever wonder if the U.S. military machine didn't exist if the world would be a better place and if other players would take their place?
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Old 09-19-2014, 03:36 AM
 
Location: Macao
16,182 posts, read 39,302,800 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hellion1999 View Post
You don't see the military machine of China and North Korea and Russia's Putin from where you live?

You ever wonder if the U.S. military machine didn't exist if the world would be a better place and if other players would take their place?
I'm not making some anti-military comment, I am simply saying that the U.S. will NOT let go of territories so easily, because of the extensive military that we have.

I'm also inputting a counterargument in there when people say 'yeah, but they give welfare to the locals of those islands, and the U.S. is going to get sick of doing that'. No, they are a drop in the financial bucket, comparatively.
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Old 09-19-2014, 06:41 AM
 
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They are a drop in the financial bucket, but if some States received the per capita dole than, for example, the Virgin Islands receives (and squanders on nepotism and corruption) for about 105,000 population on 3 islands, that State would be RICH.
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Old 09-28-2014, 01:35 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger Beer View Post
I have the opposite feeling. But I'm an American who lives over here in Asia, and see the enormity of the American military machine.

I also feel that whatever welfare recipients in Guam or somewhere might get some leftovers, the real bulk of the expensive is on all of the very expensive military operations running all over the world right now.
Yes, the US has a large military, but except for Guam the territories are strategically obsolete. They might have made sense when we needed places to stop for coal in the early 20th century, but now our ships have nuclear reactors. Again, if they want to stay part of the US, I think the US will continue to support them. But it's not just the expense of the overwhelming levels of nepotism and corruption that would lead the US to let them go if they voted for independence, it's the international black eye that keeping them against their will would give the US that would lead to them being let go.
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