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Old 01-12-2008, 12:49 PM
 
582 posts, read 1,854,309 times
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the u.s is not the only one suffering from immigrants working for nothing and not many jobs for our own people.puerto has had thousands of dominicans immigrate each year making the island extremely overcrowded and very limited opportunities for their people.opinions please.
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Old 01-13-2008, 11:49 AM
 
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Employment opportunities are not scarce because of Dominicans, employment opportunities are scarce because it is an island economy and an artificial one at that, mostly funded by federal subsidies and whose major employer is the state government. The only fundamental effect worth noting about the prescence of illegal Dominicans in the island is the overburdening of the welfare system, which is quite the same as illegal Mexicans in the mainland. Dominicans who do work in the island take up manual labor jobs, and "chivero" jobs i.e. jack-of-all trade type jobs; mostly paid a marginal wage and under the table...just like illegal mexicans. For dominicans it is a matter of getting a better income, even though to us domestics it seems inconsequential since we know we cannot possibly live in America (and that includes PR, which has a higher cost of living than all of the southeast and midwest CONUS, sans FL and big cities) on those wages and remain on the black line. They do it in the same fashion illegal mexicans do it up here: rooming 20 to a house and not paying income or property taxes. It is what it is.

That said, it is a stretch to suggest they impact the job market in such a way that they hinder uneducated puertoricans from having these jobs. Domestics won't do it for that wage, they opt for welfare CONSTANTLY, and there won't be any true immigration enforcement either because businesses don't have any incentive to raise wages on these jobs when they have a willing work force across the shore. In theory, if the govt could keep all illegals out then these jobs would have to raise wages, but you'd pay a markup on all products and services (in PR the impact would be in cost of construction and health care). In reality, it just won't happen.

As to the overcrowding issue, yes PR is a 3500 square mile island populated by more than 4 million people, so its dense. However, the problem is exacerbated by the fact that close to 50% of that population gravitates to the San Juan metro area, which makes San Juan a royal pain in the @ss to get aorund, hence giving the impression one cannot breathe in the island. When I was a little kid (80s) you could distinguish San Juan from Bayamón, Guynabo, Cataño, Carolina, and Caguas. Today, they consider Toa Alta and Dorado part of the metro San Juan area to west, past Carolina to the East and Caguas is also part of the de facto San Juan area. Mileage like that is still nothing in terms of a CONUS city, but when you take into account the road system in PR, those distances are ridiculous and it does reflect on the sense of overpopulation. I sure wouldn't want to commute in PR these days...
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Old 04-13-2009, 04:29 PM
 
1 posts, read 7,812 times
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Default dominicans in PR

yo hindsight2020--

i'm going to PR with a bunch of latino activists from philadelphia. do you know of any good community organizations we can meet with?

-louis
LMBPR@hotmail.com
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Old 04-15-2009, 08:39 AM
 
Location: Scranton
1,384 posts, read 2,799,082 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hindsight2020 View Post
In theory, if the govt could keep all illegals out then these jobs would have to raise wages, but you'd pay a markup on all products and services (in PR the impact would be in cost of construction and health care). In reality, it just won't happen.
I have to agree with you with most of your post. However, there is already a big markup in the cost of construction, or else how do you explain an average sized home on a small lot in a subdivision selling for $200-300K? For that amount, you can buy a bigger house in the mainland US, with a backyard twice its size and central AC.

In terms of healthcare, there are not many illegals working there. I worked from 1994-1999 in PR as a Paramedic in San Juan. The only dominicans that I met were imported physicians usually in the smaller clinics (CDT's) and a few nurses which probably entered PR legally, since these are skilled positions that require a license.

The reason why healthcare is so inexpensive in Puerto Rico is because the justice system sucks, and that in turn deters people from filing frivolous lawsuits.
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Old 04-22-2009, 11:15 AM
 
Location: Philly
10,026 posts, read 14,479,561 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trucker7 View Post
The reason why healthcare is so inexpensive in Puerto Rico is because the justice system sucks, and that in turn deters people from filing frivolous lawsuits.
huh, a positive side effect of a poor justice system.
San Juan desperately needs a rapid transit system (which tren urbano does not make). It's not bad that people are crowing SJ but roads are never going to solve that issue. Certainly it woudl be nice to see some prosperity return to Ponce but PR can't even find enough people to pick the coffee it does grow (it's excellent coffee but PR is actually a coffee importer, a sign of the imbalance in the economy).
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Old 04-22-2009, 11:40 AM
 
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I am very intreseted in getting involoved in puertorico issues and wonder what is it your doing ? and if I can become involved
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Old 09-16-2009, 01:58 PM
 
Location: SOCAL
2 posts, read 15,341 times
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Dominicans probably make Puerto Rico better. Think about it, they work, they stimulate the economy, they stay, built, become, and introduce good traditions from DR. It is really not a bad exchange. Now I would not let them build a drug emporium in PR like the Dominicans have done in NYC. I would keep it Chicago Style, where only you own can deal in unlawful activities.
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Old 09-16-2009, 02:16 PM
 
Location: SOCAL
2 posts, read 15,341 times
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Default Why Puerto Ricans in Chicago are better off than Puerto Ricans in New York City

I have an interesting angle that I would like discuss with all of my Latino's. I am a Puerto Rican living in San Diego, CA. I am active in the Puerto Rican functions here is SOCAL. We are a small community but have a real effective commerce sense in our districts. We work in conjunction with the Mexican American community which has been very instrumental in our success. Mexicans are usually our number 1 consumer base in SOCAL. Because of my initiatives I have taken alot of advise from my contemporaries in both Chicago, and New York City. I have also been in contact with some high profiled activist from Philadelphia, and Orlando, FL. When I visit these cities I notice that other Latino's in those cities seem to be more organized and on a higher economic plain that the Puerto Ricans living in the aforementioned communities other than Chicago. In Chicago by sheer numbers the Mexican community has more access to businesses but by no stretch do they out do the Puerto Rican community per capita.

I also notice that all of the bodegas in the Three Puerto Rican communities in Chicago were owned by Puerto Ricans, including bodegas near Wrigley Field and in some Mexican communities. When I went to New York all of the bodegas and I mean all of the bodegas were owned by Dominicans, Asians, and Arabs. I thought that maybe I was just in the wrong places in Brooklyn, Queens, and Manhattan. But my freinds and family state that the Puerto Rican bodegas sold their stores to the Dominicans in the 1970's and 80's. Why would the Puerto Rican community in New York not have self representation, when you include our census, and presence? Me and my wife went to Orlando and wanted to eat some Puerto Rican food, in a city that has over 100,000 Puerto Ricans. We only found one Puerto Rican restaurant who was owned by Dominicans. I went to Chicago and we had about 150 Puerto Rican restaurants to choose from, Chicago even invented the Jibarito sandwich and made it a popular food to eat in Chicago. Chicago I believe on Division Street has two large steel Puerto Rican Flags called a Paseo Boricua, and boy the Puerto Ricans there have that locked down to a tee. So my question is why is it that Puerto Ricans in Chicago have it better than the Puerto Ricans in New York. I read that Chicago has deep rooted Puerto Rican gangs that were supported by middle class to rich Puerto Ricans. So maybe is dirty money converted into clean money, like the Irish and Italians did. This is weird and I am lost on the answer. Also some Puerto Ricans in New York say that they are proud to be Puerto Rican and don't try to immulate other races or cultures, and one guy said that the Puerto Ricans in New York try to be black, a culture that is not one to mirror. Give me your feedback.
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Old 09-16-2009, 04:29 PM
 
Location: Milwaukee, Wisconsin
174 posts, read 533,996 times
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The puerto rican commnity in Chicago today is actually very small compared to what it was years ago. The areas where most of them lived today have become big havens for ilegal Mexicans. Most of the puerto ricans that I grew up with moved back to the island, moved to florida or passed away due to old age. The days of the locally owned puero rican grocery store or other small business are long gone. This is why Congressman Luis Gutierrez is such a big supporter of mexican ilegals. His district use to be mostly puerto rican. Today it's about 80-90 % mexican. He needs the mexican vote to get elected every two years to the congress.
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Old 09-16-2009, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Bronx, NY
4,476 posts, read 8,628,495 times
Reputation: 5530
Quote:
Originally Posted by edmprchitown View Post
I have an interesting angle that I would like discuss with all of my Latino's. I am a Puerto Rican living in San Diego, CA. I am active in the Puerto Rican functions here is SOCAL. We are a small community but have a real effective commerce sense in our districts. We work in conjunction with the Mexican American community which has been very instrumental in our success. Mexicans are usually our number 1 consumer base in SOCAL. Because of my initiatives I have taken alot of advise from my contemporaries in both Chicago, and New York City. I have also been in contact with some high profiled activist from Philadelphia, and Orlando, FL. When I visit these cities I notice that other Latino's in those cities seem to be more organized and on a higher economic platform than the Puerto Ricans, living in the aforementioned communities other than Chicago. In Chicago by sheer numbers the Mexican community has more access to businesses but by no stretch do they out do the Puerto Rican community per capita.

I also notice that all of the bodegas in the Three Puerto Rican communities in Chicago were owned by Puerto Ricans, including bodegas near Wrigley Field and in some Mexican communities. When I went to New York all of the bodegas and I mean all of the bodegas were owned by Dominicans, Asians, and Arabs. I thought that maybe I was just in the wrong places in Brooklyn, Queens, and Manhattan. But my freinds and family state that the Puerto Rican bodegas sold their stores to the Dominicans in the 1970's and 80's. Why would the Puerto Rican community in New York not have self representation, when you include our census, and presence? Me and my wife went to Orlando and wanted to eat some Puerto Rican food, in a city that has over 100,000 Puerto Ricans. We only found one Puerto Rican restaurant who was owned by Dominicans. I went to Chicago and we had about 150 Puerto Rican restaurants to choose from, Chicago even invented the Jibarito sandwich and made it a popular food to eat in Chicago. Chicago I believe on Division Street has two large steel Puerto Rican Flags called a Paseo Boricua, and boy the Puerto Ricans there have that locked down to a tee. So my question is why is it that Puerto Ricans in Chicago have it better than the Puerto Ricans in New York. I read that Chicago has deep rooted Puerto Rican gangs that were supported by middle class to rich Puerto Ricans. So maybe is dirty money converted into clean money, like the Irish and Italians did. This is weird and I am lost on the answer. Also some Puerto Ricans in New York say that they are proud to be Puerto Rican and don't try to immulate other races or cultures, and one guy said that the Puerto Ricans in New York try to be black, a culture that is not one to mirror. Give me your feedback.
You have made a great post. There are so many Puerto Ricans in NYC that many people may think that Puerto Ricans in NYC are not doing anything for themselves. For example, lets look at Sonia Sotomayor she is a Puerto Rican from The Bronx NY. She is doing big things. Also other Puerto Ricans have joined the Military and have moved to other states. For example, the first Puerto Ricans to arrive to the US arrived to NY. They lived in Spanish Harlem back in the 1940's. From there and on, they started to move to other states/cities. They moved to Chicago, PA, NJ, FL. This is why you see a great amount of PRicans in the East of the US, because they Emigrated to NY, and then from there, they moved to other states on the East.

On the other hand, there are many Puerto Ricans in The Bronx that have houses. So many Puerto Ricans are doing something. When you comment on that a friend of yours stated that Puerto Ricans from NYC trying to be black, that is a lie. The thing is that Puerto Ricans and Blacks live in the same neighborhoods, and in the same Ghetto's. So of course Puerto Ricans are going to dress baggy and sometimes may act ghetto. It is because Puerto Ricans live in the ghetto. It is not because they are trying to be black. It is similar to Eminem. He is from the Ghetto. When he started to rap. People were saying that he was trying to be black just because of the way he carried himself, and because he rapped. This is pure ignorance. Nobody is trying to be like anybody else. It is just that if you live in a neighborhood that is ghetto, you will act according to your neighborhood. Therefore, You will have street knowledge etc... Not all the times you will act ghetto, because not all people from the ghetto acts this way. And many of them are college-educated. I am just making a point that Puerto Ricans are not trying to act Black in NYC. Also, Puerto Ricans in NYC are very proud of being Puerto Ricans so why would they try to act something else. For example, lets take a look at Big Pun. He was from the Bronx NY and was Puerto Rican. Some may say that he was trying to be Black, but he was not. He always represented the Puerto Ricans and The Bronx to the fullest.
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