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Old 04-08-2009, 05:24 PM
 
Location: Center of the universe
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crisp444 View Post
Most certainly. Many people in Puerto Rico have Italian, French, and English surnames due to their ancestors being from those countries. Though most white Puerto Ricans are Catholic and of Spanish origin, you are correct that there are some Jews and Protestants as well. Contrary to what many mainlanders believe, observing Puerto Ricans in the Bronx (mostly mulatto, poor) is NOT very representative of all of the Puerto Ricans on the island.

I'm amazed at how many Puerto Ricans (Dickie Thon, Mike Lowell) have German and/or Irish heritage.
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Old 04-08-2009, 09:57 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Sunil's Dad View Post
True that Loiza (and Carolina) are known for being the "dark country" of PR........but Afro Boris are all over the island, at least the coastal area. In Ponce and the West, such as Aguadilla (where Delgado is from), lots of black people are seen.
I figured as much. I was sure about Loiza and knew about Carolina and Ponce, but I haven't heard about the other community or that the Western part of the island had quite a few too.

I think Mayaguez has a high Black population too.
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Old 04-08-2009, 11:53 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckhthankgod View Post
Much of that African ancestry is in Loiza though. From what I'm told they are so Black, you would think many of them just came from Africa. People like Carlos Delgado and Orlando Vega come to mind when I think of Puerto Ricans that are no doubt about it in terms of being Black/of African descent.
What about all the black Dominicans that have emmigrated to Puerto Rico, where do they live?
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Old 04-09-2009, 08:57 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Latina7 View Post
What about all the black Dominicans that have emmigrated to Puerto Rico, where do they live?
The downtown core of Rio Piedras. This is the southern enclave of the municipality of San Juan and used to be its own municipality before annexation with San Juan. I grew up and went to school in Rio Piedras, there is no doubt 'downtown' Rio piedras is the dominican mecca in PR. Barrio Obrero in the Santurce district also displays a large dominican presence. The rest are scattered in housing projects (a paradox given these folks are illegal immigrants still for the most part) and then the rest of the island.
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Old 04-10-2009, 04:44 PM
 
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In bringing this discussion back to ethnicity, to my recollection, the issue of color or ancestry was very little discussed as I grew up in Puerto Rico. As a matter of fact, I became exposed to this issue - and all it's negative aspects - after we moved to the U.S. mainland.

My mother is a pale white woman with jet black hair. Some of her brothers have blue eyes and blond hair. On my father's side "estan to' los prietos!" His mother had Taino features; his dad had distinct African features.

I mention this because my father was always loved and welcomed by my mother's side of the family, and vice-versa. There was never a hint of dislike towards him despite the fact that he was called "El Negro" by everyone, both white and black. As every good Puerto Rican knows, calling someone "Negro" or "Negtrito" is considered a term of endearment. It's a 180 degree departure from the connotation it carries here in the states.

I am thankful and proud that the land of my birth did not teach me to dislike a person because of what they looked like or where their ancestors came from. ¡Boricua hasta la muerte!
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Old 04-10-2009, 04:59 PM
 
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Um, I hate to burst your bubble, but being black in Puerto Rico carries no more positive social significance than being black in the States. Granted, the scale under which African-Americans must cope with the heterogeneity between white and black culture in the CONUS is much bigger than that of a black puerto rican who enjoys rather homogenic cultural construct, but this by no means signify that Puerto Rican culture embraces nor provides partity to black features as a social currency.

Your implication that Puerto Ricans are less euro-centric by proxy is not accurate and only serves to support the thought that compared to those 'racist mainland americans', PR is the land of milk and honey where everybody gets along and signs koombaya as whites and blacks date freely. The mere fact that PR people overwhelmingly label themselves as white is indication of very different feelings than the proposed idea of race indifference and tolerance. Furthermore, talk to a dominican in the island and see what he thinks about your argument of the island as a race-embracing garden of eden. Make no mistake, do not misread cultural homogeneity for race tolerance. They are far far far from synonyms.....
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Old 04-10-2009, 06:03 PM
 
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Originally Posted by hindsight2020 View Post
Um, I hate to burst your bubble, but being black in Puerto Rico carries no more positive social significance than being black in the States. Granted, the scale under which African-Americans must cope with the heterogeneity between white and black culture in the CONUS is much bigger than that of a black puerto rican who enjoys rather homogenic cultural construct, but this by no means signify that Puerto Rican culture embraces nor provides partity to black features as a social currency.

Your implication that Puerto Ricans are less euro-centric by proxy is not accurate and only serves to support the thought that compared to those 'racist mainland americans', PR is the land of milk and honey where everybody gets along and signs koombaya as whites and blacks date freely. The mere fact that PR people overwhelmingly label themselves as white is indication of very different feelings than the proposed idea of race indifference and tolerance. Furthermore, talk to a dominican in the island and see what he thinks about your argument of the island as a race-embracing garden of eden. Make no mistake, do not misread cultural homogeneity for race tolerance. They are far far far from synonyms.....
Listen dude! You obviously have not been exposed to the experiences of those of us who grew up there, and what we live and experience each and every time we visit the homeland. I don't care what your stats say! Your stats mean nothing when compared to my and the experiences of others!

The fact is that the great mayority of Boricuas get along just fine despite the differences in skin color or ethnicity. We share a firm, solid and unshakable culture which binds us with a common pride. Our experience is unique and it makes one out of us all. If you haven't lived it, then obviously, you are NO Boricua!

As for the dominicans, please! Most of the ones I've met do not consider themselves black no matter how obvious their African features. So please, don't bring them in to this discussion. That's a whole other subject.

Again I repeat, if you don't understand the Boricua experience then obviously, you are not one of US!

Hasta la proxima papacito! Tu eres mio y tu lo sabes!
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Old 04-10-2009, 06:57 PM
 
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First off, I did grow up there, managed to soak up all the culture I could stand, and promptly left for the States upon graduation from high school. My parents reside in the island and will continue to do so until their deaths, therefore I'm inherently tied to traveling extensively to the island and interact with the idiosyncrasies of the place to a greater extent than a nostalgic cursory tourist stint. Provided most people define their formative years by that amount of time spent in K-12, I humbly submit I'm no less "boricua" than your garden variety Puerto Rican flag waver. That I don't hold my ethnicity as a social crutch, maybe that's the difference between you and me.

I'm not interested in picking a fight about who is a genuine puerto rican and who isn't, like I said before, I'm not handicapped by my ethnicity, unlike many of my 'compueblanos'. My only point is that from MY anectdotal experince (since we're in the chest thumping realm now) Puerto Ricans in the states hold a romanticized ivory tower view of the concept of "living back in the island". Such constant allegory to the fable-like representation of race relations down there, along with the over-emphasis of folklore as justification and exculpation of the ills of an island colony, is nothing but a social crutch by those "boricuas" sitting on the mainland fat dumb and happy complaining how bad it is up here and how great things are down there. If things were that great down there, all you "boricuas de verdad!" would finally put away the bumper stickers and lower the volume on your gilberto santa rosa greatest hits and move back to the island where such displays of folkloric pride are of no consequence since you're no longer a token down there. But of course that ain't happening now is it? It's easier to blame it on the "gringos" for being so intolerant of your inherent cultural insight (yeah right...) while you scream to the four winds that life in the island is utopia. I wouldn't have a problem with that if your were screaming it from the island, but doing it from the mainland? As a Puerto Rican I'll call you out on it to the gringos (black, brown and white alike), every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
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Old 04-10-2009, 07:22 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hindsight2020 View Post
First off, I did grow up there, managed to soak up all the culture I could stand, and promptly left for the States upon graduation from high school. My parents reside in the island and will continue to do so until their deaths, therefore I'm inherently tied to traveling extensively to the island and interact with the idiosyncrasies of the place to a greater extent than a nostalgic cursory tourist stint. Provided most people define their formative years by that amount of time spent in K-12, I humbly submit I'm no less "boricua" than your garden variety Puerto Rican flag waver. That I don't hold my ethnicity as a social crutch, maybe that's the difference between you and me.

I'm not interested in picking a fight about who is a genuine puerto rican and who isn't, like I said before, I'm not handicapped by my ethnicity, unlike many of my 'compueblanos'. My only point is that from MY anectdotal experince (since we're in the chest thumping realm now) Puerto Ricans in the states hold a romanticized ivory tower view of the concept of "living back in the island". Such constant allegory to the fable-like representation of race relations down there, along with the over-emphasis of folklore as justification and exculpation of the ills of an island colony, is nothing but a social crutch by those "boricuas" sitting on the mainland fat dumb and happy complaining how bad it is up here and how great things are down there. If things were that great down there, all you "boricuas de verdad!" would finally put away the bumper stickers and lower the volume on your gilberto santa rosa greatest hits and move back to the island where such displays of folkloric pride are of no consequence since you're no longer a token down there. But of course that ain't happening now is it? It's easier to blame it on the "gringos" for being so intolerant of your inherent cultural insight (yeah right...) while you scream to the four winds that life in the island is utopia. I wouldn't have a problem with that if your were screaming it from the island, but doing it from the mainland? As a Puerto Rican I'll call you out on it to the gringos (black, brown and white alike), every day of the week and twice on Sunday.
Bendito papito! Te desviastes del tema inherente! Chacho, te enrredastes y tropezastes con tus mismas palabras.

Where in my post did I write anything regarding pointing fingers at gringos? No brodercito! Yo no soy de esos. In addition, this discussion has nothing to do with Anglo-Americans.

Handicapped by ethnicity? You are not...and neither am I. But again, this had nothing to do wit the discussion. It must be some thorn on your side which you've yet to pluck out.

Mira mija, the topic was about who those who supposedly consider themselves "white" in Puerto Rico. You pulled out stats. I pulled out experience!!!

And now all of the sudden you claim to be this "super-enlightned Boricua" who is apparently ashamed of other Boricuas out here who wave our flag and play our music and yell "¡Viva Puerto Rico!!!" ja! ha!

Hey, as long as Boricuas like that are going to work each day and making a positive contribution to society, I will applaud them (and not call them out) each and every day of the week. Es mas, yo les cargo la bandera y le compro la primera cerveza despues de su dia de trabajo!

Chacho...¡tu eres mio y tu lo sabes, y lo que te espera!
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Old 04-10-2009, 07:22 PM
 
60,444 posts, read 85,521,430 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chacho_keva View Post
In bringing this discussion back to ethnicity, to my recollection, the issue of color or ancestry was very little discussed as I grew up in Puerto Rico. As a matter of fact, I became exposed to this issue - and all it's negative aspects - after we moved to the U.S. mainland.

My mother is a pale white woman with jet black hair. Some of her brothers have blue eyes and blond hair. On my father's side "estan to' los prietos!" His mother had Taino features; his dad had distinct African features.

I mention this because my father was always loved and welcomed by my mother's side of the family, and vice-versa. There was never a hint of dislike towards him despite the fact that he was called "El Negro" by everyone, both white and black. As every good Puerto Rican knows, calling someone "Negro" or "Negtrito" is considered a term of endearment. It's a 180 degree departure from the connotation it carries here in the states.

I am thankful and proud that the land of my birth did not teach me to dislike a person because of what they looked like or where their ancestors came from. ¡Boricua hasta la muerte!
I think it's that way because Negro means Black in that language, whereas here it is too close to another term and it comes from a time that wasn't good for Black people here in the US.
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