U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Unexplained Mysteries and Paranormal
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 08-02-2011, 06:17 AM
 
5,460 posts, read 6,215,641 times
Reputation: 1806

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88 View Post
What gets me is how alot of people describe the same exact thing.
Yep, good evidence of an underlying physiological cause for the experience. Common biology = common experience when that biology stops working correctly.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 08-02-2011, 09:40 AM
 
49,034 posts, read 30,546,901 times
Reputation: 6614
Quote:
Originally Posted by KCfromNC View Post
Yep, good evidence of an underlying physiological cause for the experience. Common biology = common experience when that biology stops working correctly.
Equally good evidence for a common reality as the basis of the experience . . . same old ambiguity.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-02-2011, 10:32 PM
 
223 posts, read 241,582 times
Reputation: 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88 View Post
What gets me is how alot of people describe the same exact thing.
That's not surprising, since Evolution gave most humans brains that develop and die in much the same way, with lobes that do the same things.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-02-2011, 10:36 PM
 
223 posts, read 241,582 times
Reputation: 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
Equally good evidence for a common reality as the basis of the experience . . . same old ambiguity.
What's more likely: (a) Two people's brains -- with near-total biological similarities insofar as how they control perception -- providing similar visions/sounds to those 2 people; or (b) some parallel reality that only a tiny sliver of humanity has ever seen and reported back existing and awaiting by way of some mystical, unverifiable soul escape.

There is biological evidence and reasoning to support a, there's just bulls*** for B.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2011, 01:35 AM
 
7,801 posts, read 5,672,397 times
Reputation: 2979
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88 View Post
What do you think this phenomena is? How is it that so many people who have had a near death experience have all described the same thing? If it isn't " divine" then what causes it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88 View Post
What gets me is how alot of people describe the same exact thing.
I am not sure why you are surprised that many people in the same situation would experience the same things.... It should be more surprising if they did NOT do so no? For example the fact that most people falling asleep have experienced a falling sensation that has jerked them awake is due to the fact that all those people are undergoing the same things while falling asleep. It is not evidence that when we sleep we are all going to a magical astral plane where we all appear to trip and fall a lot.

However let us answer your question all the same....

A similar question is to ask how come everyone who reports visitations from ufos always seem to describe the same short bubble headed creature with enormous black shiny eyes.

The reason is simple. Culture. Culture has put into the minds of people what they should experience in certain situations. Spielberg has shown us what "aliens" look like and so that is what people see when they think they have seen aliens.

Such culture and folklore has also put into our minds ideas such as the "white light" and so that is what people see when they are in similar situations themselves.

It really does come down to the power of suggestion.

To compound this problem we ask questions of people in the wrong way. Quite often we ask questions in a way to get the answers we want and the right kind of questioning can actually make people remember things in ways they never happened and even doubt what they thing they remember. A patient who did not see any "white light" if asked "come on, are you sure there was no light?" enough times might actually start to doubt whether there was or wasn't. Another patient who describes a mere tiny flash of "white light" might cause a questioner to tick the "Was there a white light" box on their questionare.

I am sure it is helped along by other factors however. Many of the procedures we use to revive the nearly dead can cause create stress to the body and brain. Pumping electricity through a person to restart their heart for example will cause an overload of signals in the human brain. Such overloads likely stimulate the senses of sound, sight and so on and over load them. That they would see/hear bright colors, lights and cacophony of sound is hardly surprising therefore.

The religious of course love to jump on such shared experiences and use it to suggest that this is somehow evidence of a god or magical realms such as heaven. You can see this in posts like that from "MysticPhD" above who will try to convince you that there is some "other reality" out there and that such shared experiences can be used as evidence for such a thing despite the lack of any other evidence that such realities exist.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2011, 03:49 AM
 
Location: S. Wales.
49,642 posts, read 15,001,350 times
Reputation: 5778
It's evident that we can't be sure what's going, on only that something is being experienced. We know that the mind and body produces effects, perceptions and sensations which are common to us and indeed many other animals. Thus the 'materialist' explanation has something going for it.

The other explanation - 'something outside us' is doing it - is a possibility and as yet no more than an unproven supposition, despite all the as yet unchecked and unverified anecdotal claims.

I would like to see more research done and I have no fears about what it might discover.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2011, 03:19 PM
 
49,034 posts, read 30,546,901 times
Reputation: 6614
Quote:
Originally Posted by OreNative78 View Post
What's more likely: (a) Two people's brains -- with near-total biological similarities insofar as how they control perception -- providing similar visions/sounds to those 2 people; or (b) some parallel reality that only a tiny sliver of humanity has ever seen and reported back existing and awaiting by way of some mystical, unverifiable soul escape.

There is biological evidence and reasoning to support a, there's just bulls*** for B.
The problem is that biological evidence and reasoning is always there . . . even for thing you clearly wouldn't credit or give reality to . . . solipsism notwithstanding. Everything we consider evidence of reality comes through those same biological processes and reasoning . . . why do these receive different treatment?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2011, 03:31 PM
 
Location: Here
2,280 posts, read 1,739,307 times
Reputation: 1664
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88 View Post
What do you think this phenomena is? How is it that so many people who have had a near death experience have all described the same thing? If it isn't " divine" then what causes it?
I'd sure like this phenomenon to be divine, but I sincerely doubt it is. I think it's the brain in early stages of a shutdown. The other day I took a relatively gentle hit to the head by a closing door. I saw what has been referred to as "fireflies" and "stars". But of course neither fireflies or stars are actually being seen. The illusion is the brain reacting to a mild impact.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2011, 03:56 PM
 
223 posts, read 241,582 times
Reputation: 109
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticPhD View Post
The problem is that biological evidence and reasoning is always there . . . even for thing you clearly wouldn't credit or give reality to . . . solipsism notwithstanding. Everything we consider evidence of reality comes through those same biological processes and reasoning . . . why do these receive different treatment?
Because of peer-review, and reliability in numerous instances. The visions and NDEs are transitory, infrequent, subjective. Biological study is sustained, long, repetitive, objective.

Sorry, but I can scarcely believe you didn't already know the answer to your question. Were you being serious?
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 08-03-2011, 04:58 PM
 
49,034 posts, read 30,546,901 times
Reputation: 6614
Quote:
Originally Posted by OreNative78 View Post
Because of peer-review, and reliability in numerous instances. The visions and NDEs are transitory, infrequent, subjective. Biological study is sustained, long, repetitive, objective.

Sorry, but I can scarcely believe you didn't already know the answer to your question. Were you being serious?
Yes . . . I knew the answer to my question . . . but you apparently didn't understand the question. ALL evidence is processed through our biological processes which can be traced very specifically to activity of the brain . . . ALL evidence has the same correlates. Why dismiss these as "just brain function" . . . everything IS just brain function no matter how much or how little consensus (processed through the same brain functions) exists.
Rate this post positively Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:

Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Unexplained Mysteries and Paranormal
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2021, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top