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Old 04-24-2012, 03:37 PM
 
Location: Lovely swampy humid Miami!
1,973 posts, read 3,976,594 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitlock View Post
George and Kathy claimed there was one morning "pig Jody" tracks in the snow around the property. According to meteorologist records there was no snow in Amityville on that day. And even if there were why not a White-Tailed Deer aren't those supposed to be common in the area?

On a sidenote I'm open to paranormal but there is just too many inconsistencies in George and Kathy's account of the events.
A meteorological report would not tell us if there was snow ON THE GROUND.

It would only tell us if there was PRECIPITATION IN THE FORM OF SNOW that day.

There could easily have been snow that was several days old.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Annuvin View Post
The one thing that has always bothered me about the DeFeo homicides is how Ronald DeFeo was able to systematically murder his entire family with an unslienced Marlin 336 rifle, and not have even a single family member awake to the sound of gunshots. That has always made zero sense to me.

See also


Quote:
Originally Posted by whitlock View Post
That's a good and crucial point. No neighbors heard anything either.
That is indeed crucial, and there's no way that anybody can say that the DeFeo shootings are a "hoax" since he went to jail, had a public trial, etcetera. It is absolutely remarkable that this took place without anyone hearing it!
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Old 04-24-2012, 03:38 PM
 
Location: Lovely swampy humid Miami!
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It is also remarkable that all the victims were found in the same position when they were shot.
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Old 04-24-2012, 04:24 PM
 
14,079 posts, read 20,318,605 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reptoid Humidian View Post
That is indeed crucial, and there's no way that anybody can say that the DeFeo shootings are a "hoax" since he went to jail, had a public trial, etcetera. It is absolutely remarkable that this took place without anyone hearing it!
No one denies there are murders. I think it's important to seperate one - the murders, from the other - claims of supernatural manifestations. The murders occured, that is beyond doubt.

But the claims of supernatural occurances are supported by absolutely no evidence except one, and only one - the claims by George and Kathy Lutz that they occured. To balance that out we have boatloads of evidence supporting and claims that the occurances simply did not occurr, from all over - metiorological reports, neighbors, police denying they were ever called, future residents saying no supernatural occurances and the damage claimed by the Lutz's were no visible. I mean, they had a public garage sale the day they claimed to have fleed the house in distress. And then we have there lawyer sealing the nail in the coffin by stating Lutz and him came up with the idea over a bottle of wine.
It's pretty damning and overwhelming evidence that indeed the events of Amityville were fictional, and I don't see how anyone can believe this is an actual supernatural event. I mean guys, I know it's fun, but how can anyone consider all the evidence and think this was NOT a hoax. The Lutz's based their whole life on this, they turned it into a business, even copyrighting the name "Amityville Horror". The number of lawsuits regarding this and involving the Lutz's were staggering, and that is telling in that this is not a ghost story, but a business venture (by the way, even judges involved in these cases even declared the Amityville events as fictional). Good for them, they made a living off of it, but they fooled you.

I suggest the OP change the title of this post to
"The Amityville Hoax Case - my perspectives..." and if the subject is only murder, then this be moved to the true crime forum and moved out of this forum.

Last edited by Dd714; 04-24-2012 at 04:49 PM..
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Old 04-24-2012, 08:19 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dd714 View Post
No one denies there are murders. I think it's important to seperate one - the murders, from the other - claims of supernatural manifestations. The murders occured, that is beyond doubt.
Agree.

Quote:
But the claims of supernatural occurances are supported by absolutely no evidence except one, and only one - the claims by George and Kathy Lutz that they occured.
Agree, plus their kids.

Quote:
I mean, they had a public garage sale the day they claimed to have fleed the house in distress.
Not true. The auction took place almost 3 months later, and the Lutzes were not present. This is backed up by the March investigation where all the furniture is still present. Plus the Lutzes nemisis, Stephen Kaplan, was at the auction and gives the date as April 10th in his book, The Amityville Horror Conspiracy.

Quote:
And then we have there lawyer sealing the nail in the coffin by stating Lutz and him came up with the idea over a bottle of wine.
He wasn't their lawyer, William Weber represented Defeo, the killer.

By then Weber had sold the Lutzes story - without their permission - to a Sunday newspaper and Good Housekeeping magazine. His claims of helping concoct the story only came about when Lutz sued him over, and he counter-sued, wanting profit from Jay Anson's book.

Which gives him motive to lie. Meaning it's not clear-cut just because he came forward and declared a hoax.

If you watch the Amityville documentary from 1999-2006, he's increasingly put under pressure to explain his actions during this time - even the Judge said “There is a very serious ethical question when lawyers become literary agents.”

Quote:
The Lutz's based their whole life on this
Not really... and they never ended up getting rich from it.

Quote:
even copyrighting the name "Amityville Horror".
George did that later in life, probably to stop anyone making "official" Amityville movies with his name in it.

Quote:
by the way, even judges involved in these cases even declared the Amityville events as fictional
That was Judge Weinstein's opinion in the Weber Vs. Lutz case. As it was settled out of court, with no legal conclusion reached, it remains an opinion.


...so essentailly this is why the topic is still worthy of debate... despite what the one-sided Snopes article would have you believe!
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Old 04-25-2012, 01:39 AM
 
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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It's difficult to discuss the Amityville haunting without bringing the murders up...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Reptoid Humidian View Post
It is also remarkable that all the victims were found in the same position when they were shot.

Face down, somekind of Indian ritual some say.
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Old 04-25-2012, 02:08 AM
 
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Too bad George and Kathy are dead. They should be interrogated by Mossad!
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Old 04-25-2012, 02:37 AM
 
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reptoid Humidian View Post



That is indeed crucial, and there's no way that anybody can say that the DeFeo shootings are a "hoax" since he went to jail, had a public trial, etcetera. It is absolutely remarkable that this took place without anyone hearing it!
No dogs barking either...or cats miaouing.
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Old 04-25-2012, 07:19 AM
 
14,079 posts, read 20,318,605 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitlock View Post
It's difficult to discuss the Amityville haunting without bringing the murders up...


Face down, somekind of Indian ritual some say.
No one says. You are simply repeated myths. Any connection with Indian practices or graveyards or anything of that nature with the Amityville haunting hoax or the murders has been dismissed by native american historians.
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Old 04-25-2012, 07:45 AM
 
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitlock View Post
That's a good and crucial point. No neighbors heard anything either.
This can not be refuted. Thick walls in dutch colonial houses? No, a rifle is loud as hell.
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Old 04-25-2012, 07:45 AM
 
Location: The western periphery of Terra Australis
24,682 posts, read 49,206,486 times
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I read the book and watched both the original 70s movie and the recent re-make. I actually own the 70s version on DVD.

The book is pretty sensational reading...from what I've read about it, I'm inclined to be skeptical of pretty much all of the Lutz's story, but I find it interesting how it captured the popular imagination.
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