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Old 01-03-2017, 10:24 PM
 
Location: PRC
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I believe that the essence of us comes in and gives us conscious life from some place 'out there', the large bucket for spirits without physical bodies. So I think it is quite possible that we take the same road out as we took to come in. That may appear to us in our dying moments as if we are travelling down a tunnel towards a white light.

However, I dont think that time is the same here as it is there, so a period of days experienced here could be any amount of time or none to the spirit. That of course makes things very difficult to explain what is really going on when we experience something which is not of our world.

I dont see any reason why there should be any differences between our world and any other world so beings may be 'bad' or may be 'good' depending on our perspective.

Is there anything to fear? Maybe not but we are handicapped by not being able to see, feel, and experience the energies of other worlds so it is rather like going into a completely dark room where we cannot see but the other being can. Of course that will cause us some fear because it is going into the unknown at a disadvantage.

The problem is that we think everything which appears horrible to us is 'bad' because we are used to a human shape, size, and - within limits - looks too. Of course, that is not necessarily true.
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Old 01-04-2017, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocpaul20 View Post
Ahh.. dreaming of what might be, rather than the reality of what is?

Assuming that our concept of an afterlife is correct is a pretty dodgy business, as there is no proof at all. It all boils down to our belief system and if we have backed the wrong horse and the afterlife does not exist (or is not how we expect,) then the years of our life spent dreaming of what it will be like have been wasted. Dont you agree? :-)

Better to get on with living and at the same time try to be good bunnies so that we get any afterlife benefits as a result. If there is an afterlife, of course.
You state there is no proof of an afterlife, so how do you account for the many events concerning EVP?

Bob.
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Old 01-04-2017, 07:40 PM
 
Location: PRC
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I am just saying there does not appear to be, nor will there be, any proof which one person can give to another, to prove an afterlife. The 'proof' we are able to gather is our OWN proof by whatever means we can obtain it.

Playing devil's advocate here, EVPs are no different from radio content except we have a radio receiver to receive them and a transmitter to transmit them. If you did not know about the transmitter/receiver, they would be the same if you picked up radio frequencies with a chance happening using a long wire and a loudspeaker. The only difference is that you know radio content is radio content, it still makes sense and sometimes you could pick out phrases or parts of a program which are relevent to what you had just been saying.
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Old 01-05-2017, 10:22 PM
 
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I don't think that empirical truth exists because the universe is so flexible. It will not conform to what we deem to be proof. It is so contradictory that there is no way to quantify it.

There is personal experience which is subjective. We have our personal proof and that has to be good enough. I believe in subjective experiences and I know they are real and can leave traces of evidence, but that evidence isn't conclusive so we are left with nothing. Many subjective experiences share similarities but conclusions can't be made, only suppositions can be made. Many people think their experience is literally as they perceive it to be, but the laws of matter and something else are not the same.

There cannot be proof because that game is played with a different rulebook.
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Old 01-06-2017, 06:50 AM
 
Location: Greenville, SC
5,785 posts, read 4,501,379 times
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Originally Posted by Veronicka View Post
I don't think that empirical truth exists because the universe is so flexible. It will not conform to what we deem to be proof. It is so contradictory that there is no way to quantify it.
If that were the case, we wouldn't be able to target worlds on the other side of the solar system with probes, navigate to them remotely, and complete complex missions. Or research and design surgery and other treatment for diseases.
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Old 01-06-2017, 07:20 AM
 
Location: between Mars and Venus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by molukai View Post
If ghosts are real, God is real. End of story.

Oh, and I don't believe in ghosts.

You don't have to believe in ghosts, you experience it.

God is only real because people pray to him
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Old 01-06-2017, 01:02 PM
 
997 posts, read 694,850 times
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Originally Posted by Vasily View Post
If that were the case, we wouldn't be able to target worlds on the other side of the solar system with probes, navigate to them remotely, and complete complex missions. Or research and design surgery and other treatment for diseases.
We aren't talking about the same thing.
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Old 01-10-2017, 04:44 AM
 
Location: Louisville KY
4,584 posts, read 4,508,795 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocpaul20 View Post
I am just saying there does not appear to be, nor will there be, any proof which one person can give to another, to prove an afterlife. The 'proof' we are able to gather is our OWN proof by whatever means we can obtain it.

Playing devil's advocate here, EVPs are no different from radio content except we have a radio receiver to receive them and a transmitter to transmit them. If you did not know about the transmitter/receiver, they would be the same if you picked up radio frequencies with a chance happening using a long wire and a loudspeaker. The only difference is that you know radio content is radio content, it still makes sense and sometimes you could pick out phrases or parts of a program which are relevent to what you had just been saying.
The irony is all the spirits and spiritual beings people run across should be proof of an afterlife and other plains, yet they are usually waved off as lense flares, fog madness, and eating before bedtime. Some people aren't sure of an afterlife, yet don't believe in spirits that people encounter, that are proof it exist. Kinda like that Christain story of a guy lost at sea, praying for god to help him...three boats and his drowning death later, god tells him he sent three boats.
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Old 01-10-2017, 05:05 AM
 
Location: Louisville KY
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Originally Posted by Vasily View Post
I've experienced hauntings in two different houses. "Ghosts" might be interdimensional beings, or energy traces left by our activities. Some of them may be what a Jungian writer called "negative psychoid elements" -- what the major religions call demons. Or, some might be spiritually neutral beings from the multiverse (assuming such a thing exists) that appear here for their own purposes. All these are possible alternatives to the explanation that they're the spirits of the dead. None of these proposals require a belief in a permanent afterlife, or a god.

For the record, I'm an Orthodox Christian who believes in God, and I tend to believe some of these manifestations are demonic, and others are "stone tape" type manifestations rather than demonic. A small number of them are visitations by spirits of the dead (some saints have appeared after death, for example). There is an old tradition that the soul hangs around for 40 days after death, which is why there are several services for the departed in that period -- as well as another tradition that the soul passes through "celestial tollhouses" on the way to the afterlife, no doubt a hangover from the belief system of the gnostics.
There is a long list of spiritual beings, the fae themselves have quite a few different species, though they are of the fae, they aren't all fairies., some are just nasty things, some are good or nuetral, some have the propensity to do devastating things, even if they aren't enheritly evil. Some...like fairies are just mischievious, not always intendeding harm, but you don't want to anger them either. Like all the stories of poltergiest, aren't always poltergiest, sometimes it's something else and it may not even be bad, it just rivals the abilities of a poltergiest, as many spiritual beings can do a lot of the same things, like domovois. Domovois are actually peacefull, helpful things, yet they feed off the energies of the home, so bad home means stressed out domovoi, that is going to eff stuff up.

They all have their ways of getting in your home, mirrors alone are portals, but there's other things, like bringing in those seed pods from magnolia trees- those attracts fairies, and other fae. Windchimes were originally used to scare them off. A friend of mine hates them, and has told me how the dark fairy in my house has tried to enter his dreams, shes messed with other people too. She doesn't bother me, but she is enamored with me, and usually just watches me intently.
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