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It is becoming old hat, but once again, I recommend you read "The Spirits' Book by Alan Kardec.
It answers all these questions you have asked, an much, much more
There are a few links to that book in this forum.
Do a search, "The Spirits' Book", and you can read the book online if you don't want to purchase it.
Much of the book is in a question/ answer format.
The author, among others, are the ones asking the questions, and the spirits are responding to those questions asked.
Very interesting and knowledgeable read for sure.
I guarantee after reading this book, you will have a much better understanding of spirits, the afterlife, and your own existence here on earth.
Bob.
I have read it. I understand that you base all of your beliefs on it. Which is fine...I'm not judging you for what you believe. But you are no different than others who believe in certain writings that were written hundreds or thousands of yeas ago. It is your right to believe what you wish. But the problem is, you state it as fact that others should believe. Just like people who have a certain interpretation of the bible and go around telling other people that they have the absolute truth and anything else is a lie.
Those people believe a certain book and will tell you that what you believe is a lie. You believe a certain book and tell everybody else that is the book of truth. With all due respect, you want to believe it and so you do. But you can not prove any of it. If you have some provable truth that unequivocally proves what happens in the afterlife, you could be a rich man. But all you really have is your opinion based on a book that you Believe (not absolutely know) holds the truth.
Again, I know you believe it. I understand you think it is the truth. But just because you put your trust in a book doesn't make it truth and doesn't mean others have to believe it. The problem is you want others to believe exactly like you, based on a book you read. But you don't want to believe like others who's truth is based on book that is different from yours. Can't you see that?
I have read it. I understand that you base all of your beliefs on it. Which is fine...I'm not judging you for what you believe. But you are no different than others who believe in certain writings that were written hundreds or thousands of yeas ago. It is your right to believe what you wish. But the problem is, you state it as fact that others should believe. Just like people who have a certain interpretation of the bible and go around telling other people that they have the absolute truth and anything else is a lie.
Those people believe a certain book and will tell you that what you believe is a lie. You believe a certain book and tell everybody else that is the book of truth. With all due respect, you want to believe it and so you do. But you can not prove any of it. If you have some provable truth that unequivocally proves what happens in the afterlife, you could be a rich man. But all you really have is your opinion based on a book that you Believe (not absolutely know) holds the truth.
Again, I know you believe it. I understand you think it is the truth. But just because you put your trust in a book doesn't make it truth and doesn't mean others have to believe it. The problem is you want others to believe exactly like you, based on a book you read. But you don't want to believe like others who's truth is based on book that is different from yours. Can't you see that?
You present a fair assessment, and I respect your opinion, however you stated I have no proof that what is stated in that book is true.
You stated you have read the book.
That being the case, have you actually taken the time to fully understand what is being put fourth in that book?
I will site just one example, and if you can offer another logical explanation to the point I bring up, I would welcome it.
In one section of the book, it makes reference to spirits seeking to be pure to the point they obtain ultimate purity, which is the only way to spend eternity with the creator in what we humans loosely term "heaven".
In an effort to obtain purity, the spirit must undergo many re-incarnations.
Many of these re-incarnations are well thought out before the spirit will embark on a particular re-incarnation.
In perhaps a previous life, the spirit was less than commendable,and upon re-entry to the spirit world, was judged as such, again, in an effort to obtain purity, it has chosen to do penance for the mistakes of a previous live, and in doing so has decided the life it will re-incarnate into, will be one of physical, and emotional stress for it's entirety.
I believe that spirits DO have the ability to know a human existence long before they re-incarnate into it.
They know every facet of that life, from beginning to end, and knowing that, better helps them in their search for penance.
Let's take just one spirit.
It had a less than desirable former existence in the human form, and now seeks penance for that life.
Depending on the level of penance it feels necessary, it looks forward to another existence, and searches for the right body to incarnate into.
This spirit has chosen to incarnate into a child that will be blind, and mentally challenged from birth, and this spirit knows this human will live for 80 years with this affliction.
Incarnating into this "deliberate" mentally, and physically challenged being is the penance the spirit will endure in an effort to show it's remorse for past behavior in a previous life.
If you can offer another plausible explanation why a harmless child would be born this way, I would like to hear it.
You can't offer the old excuse of genetics.
Genetics are God given, and these God given genetics are just another "tool" at the disposal of spirits.
Why are so many humans different from one another?
The answer is Genetics.
A physically challenged person was deliberately born that way, or programmed that way for a later time in life, based on the need for penance by the soul that incarnates into a particular body.
As humans we do not ,and can not, understand the reasons behind what we as humans sometimes must deal with.
We are not equipped mentally to understand this act of penance, and what is required to achieve it.
I have said over and over, we humans are nothing more than a tool at the disposal of the soul.
Again, if you can offer a viable explanation as to why some people must suffer their entire lives with debilitating afflictions, I would love to hear it.
I have many more examples, but this one is one of the best, and requires thought.
Bob.
You present a fair assessment, and I respect your opinion, however you stated I have no proof that what is stated in that book is true.
You stated you have read the book.
That being the case, have you actually taken the time to fully understand what is being put fourth in that book?
I will site just one example, and if you can offer another logical explanation to the point I bring up, I would welcome it.
In one section of the book, it makes reference to spirits seeking to be pure to the point they obtain ultimate purity, which is the only way to spend eternity with the creator in what we humans loosely term "heaven".
In an effort to obtain purity, the spirit must undergo many re-incarnations.
Many of these re-incarnations are well thought out before the spirit will embark on a particular re-incarnation.
In perhaps a previous life, the spirit was less than commendable,and upon re-entry to the spirit world, was judged as such, again, in an effort to obtain purity, it has chosen to do penance for the mistakes of a previous live, and in doing so has decided the life it will re-incarnate into, will be one of physical, and emotional stress for it's entirety.
I believe that spirits DO have the ability to know a human existence long before they re-incarnate into it.
They know every facet of that life, from beginning to end, and knowing that, better helps them in their search for penance.
Let's take just one spirit.
It had a less than desirable former existence in the human form, and now seeks penance for that life.
Depending on the level of penance it feels necessary, it looks forward to another existence, and searches for the right body to incarnate into.
This spirit has chosen to incarnate into a child that will be blind, and mentally challenged from birth, and this spirit knows this human will live for 80 years with this affliction.
Incarnating into this "deliberate" mentally, and physically challenged being is the penance the spirit will endure in an effort to show it's remorse for past behavior in a previous life.
If you can offer another plausible explanation why a harmless child would be born this way, I would like to hear it.
You can't offer the old excuse of genetics.
Genetics are God given, and these God given genetics are just another "tool" at the disposal of spirits.
Why are so many humans different from one another?
The answer is Genetics.
A physically challenged person was deliberately born that way, or programmed that way for a later time in life, based on the need for penance by the soul that incarnates into a particular body.
As humans we do not ,and can not, understand the reasons behind what we as humans sometimes must deal with.
We are not equipped mentally to understand this act of penance, and what is required to achieve it.
I have said over and over, we humans are nothing more than a tool at the disposal of the soul.
Again, if you can offer a viable explanation as to why some people must suffer their entire lives with debilitating afflictions, I would love to hear it.
I have many more examples, but this one is one of the best, and requires thought.
Bob.
I don't discount reincarnation, but that doesn't prove that the spirits book is true. Several religions believe in reincarnation. There are bible believing Christians that claim they have spoken with Jesus or had a NDE and met him and it confirms their belief in the bible. Others claim they saw their religious icons and it confirmed their beliefs. And so it goes.
I'm not saying the spirits book isn't the truth. But no one can claim they know or can prove with absolute 100% certainty that what they believe about the the afterlife is true. I believe in an afterlife, but how it works, what happens, what it's all about, I can't say. I believe we are more than our physical bodies, and I believe there is an afterlife. That just seems the most logical to me. I even lean toward reincarnation. But I am open to different beliefs. If someone believes that they are just their physical organs and a mass of cells and nothing else, then I can't convince them of what I believe. To me, that doesn't seem logical. But if that's what they want to believe, I realize I can't provide absolute physical proof that it is not true.
I will site just one example, and if you can offer another logical explanation to the point I bring up, I would welcome it....
I have many more examples, but this one is one of the best, and requires thought.
Bob.
Not much thought. Genetic variations, including mental and physical birth defects, happen in all species. It comes with the evolutionary territory.
The idea that the only reason a child is born with birth defects is so some naughty spirit can seek penance is absurd.
The notion that some "god" would create children so his naughty spirits can seek penance is just more proof that human beings fashioned their "god" in their own image.
I would say, as a general rule, that anyone claiming to know for certain the nature of "god" or any other non-corporeal entity is a fraud, and anyone believing him is a fool.
Not much thought. Genetic variations, including mental and physical birth defects, happen in all species. It comes with the evolutionary territory.
The idea that the only reason a child is born with birth defects is so some naughty spirit can seek penance is absurd.
The notion that some "god" would create children so his naughty spirits can seek penance is just more proof that human beings fashioned their "god" in their own image.
What else do you have?
OK, have it your way,if that is what you believe, but did you ever stop to wonder why these genetic faults occur in the first place?
If they are there, there has to be a reason why they are there.
Nothing in this universe is without reason.
They were implanted for a reason.
Bob.
OK, have it your way,if that is what you believe, but did you ever stop to wonder why these genetic faults occur in the first place?
If they are there, there has to be a reason why they are there.
Nothing in this universe is without reason.
They were implanted for a reason.
Bob.
Of course, who doesn't wonder?
It's natural to want to make some sense out of senseless happenings. We tell ourselves soothing things to make the incomprehensible easier to grasp. Pushing it as gospel is the problem. No better than the door knocking religious folks.
Superstition and the pseudo-science of "seers" and other self proclaimed experts will always trump science for many people because it's so much quicker and doesn't take near as long. PT Barnum was right.
Of course, who doesn't wonder?
It's natural to want to make some sense out of senseless happenings. We tell ourselves soothing things to make the incomprehensible easier to grasp. Pushing it as gospel is the problem. No better than the door knocking religious folks.
Superstition and the pseudo-science of "seers" and other self proclaimed experts will always trump science for many people because it's so much quicker and doesn't take near as long. PT Barnum was right.
As I have stated in previous post, I am not one to push my beliefs on anyone. Heck, no one has the answers to what happens after we die, and that Includes Science. So much as I am against people pushing their faith or beliefs on others as if it were fact, I am also against people pushing science as if science had all of the answers.
Science changes all of the time. Science would have considered us crazy hundreds of years ago, for believing some of the things we now know as fact. Some things we just don't have answers for. And science, just like faith, may have an opinion about it, but it doesn't make either one fact.
Besides, this is a paranormal board, not the science board. I welcome all points of view and l love to hear different opinions. That's how we learn. The problem comes, when people state their opinion about the unknown as fact. That includes a blind faith in unproven scientific beliefs.
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