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Old 03-05-2020, 06:34 AM
 
Location: Maine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocpaul20 View Post
Science does NOT give extraordinary evidence for things which are weird.
Yes, it does.
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Old 03-05-2020, 06:47 AM
 
Location: Maine
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
I get what you are saying, but realistically how many reports are there where people claim to see 'reptilians'...(not that many), and the reports that do exist, they are so far off the wall, its almost got to be someone making the whole thing up....but when you compare it to 'werewolf/dogman', there are 1000s of encounters, sightings, etc, from all over the world, going back over 200+ yrs, its not even in the same ball park!
And it is ALL hearsay. No other evidence whatsoever.

Now, I don't think that means we should immediately dismiss eyewitness testimony. 99.9999% of history is based on eyewitness testimony. If we are going to dismiss something just because it came from an eyewitness, then everyone burn your history books, because they are now worthless.

The question then becomes: Is the witness trustworthy? If someone I have known for forty years who has unimpeachable character and is honest to a fault tells me that he saw a ghost in his upstairs bedroom or a dogman in the woods, do I immediately believe him? Don't know. I'm going to ask if he'd been drinking, had been sick, had woken from a nightmare, or any other adverse conditions were going on. Did anyone else see it? How good a look did he get? Did he hear anything? What else happened? If all that checks out ... well, at the very least I am going to keep an open mind.

But if a stranger I have never met tells me over the Internet that he saw a dogman in a New Orleans alleyway or knows his mayor is a reptiloid ...? Yeah, I'm gonna need a lot more than this stranger's word before I buy in.


Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
I will also refer to my 'vampire' comparison again...vampires are very popular movie monsters too...it makes sense if people are making up sightings of werewolves, there would be people making up encounters with real vampires too...(but again, its not even in the same ballpark compared to werewolf reports).How do you explain that?
I don't know. I haven't done a comparison of werewolf/vampire sightings.

But I do think people's DESIRE to believe explains a lot of it. There are people in Iceland today who believe in elves. When I was a kid, I belonged to THE LORD OF THE RINGS fanclub. This was before the Internet, so we got a newsletter every few months. Mostly letters from members. And in every issue was at least one letter from a fan claiming to have seen Black Riders in the woods while on a camping trip, or hobbits in a distant glen of the Berkshires.

Were they outright lying? Not entirely, I think. They so wanted it to be true that they had convinced themselves.

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Old 03-05-2020, 08:18 AM
 
Location: Sheffield, England
2,056 posts, read 430,973 times
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Don't under-estimate the power of human stupidity. Every year we get dozens of "big cat" sightings in the UK, for example, which always turn out to be actually a domestic cat in the distance, or in some cases even a toy tiger or lion which has been in the same position for weeks, yet some idiot actually thinks it is real, even if the proportions are off and it actually looks nothing like a real tiger. Given how stupid many people are, I am not surprised you get believers in werewolves etc.., in the slightest bit.
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Old 03-05-2020, 10:39 AM
 
14,724 posts, read 3,918,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UpstateJohn View Post
I refuse to believe a human being can miraculously change forms physically in the light of a full moon, or any time it suits them. Mentally, yes! A person can be fine one second, a total raging lunatic the next. I could see a person changing appearance over time, meaning moths to years, but within a few moments, no. And no offence, if anybody does believe that, yall need to get out more.
the moon has nothing to do with this as far as I can tell, that is pure hollywood fiction.


The 2 local people that have claimed to see this happening, said it was a slow process, and both of these were in different states, but within about 5-10 yrs of each other.


Have you read about the documented case that happened in NYC in 1911? that is a very strange report!


If this is all made up, how do you all explain the strange aspects to the police report from the incident that happened in my city in 2008? if this was just 4 people claiming to see something strange...why did a higher agency take possession of the case (police report no longer available), according to my dispatcher friend, the only time a higher agency takes over a local case, is when it is very serious, or involves multiple states...id love to hear someone realistically explain how an alleged 'werewolf sighting' could reach a level where the feds get involved and take over the case!! There was no crime actually committed here, it was just 4 people who claimed to see something that looked like a werewolf.




My dispatcher friend also thought the fact they brought in the police sketch artist to render a drawing was odd in itself, the only time this is done is when a serious crime has been committed and they are actively searching for a suspect, she thinks there was likely something to this case that made police take it as seriously as they did, maybe it was the surv video from the gas station.
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Old 03-05-2020, 12:32 PM
 
Location: Gray Court, SC
3,502 posts, read 2,609,049 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
the moon has nothing to do with this as far as I can tell, that is pure hollywood fiction.


The 2 local people that have claimed to see this happening, said it was a slow process, and both of these were in different states, but within about 5-10 yrs of each other.


Have you read about the documented case that happened in NYC in 1911? that is a very strange report!

No. See no need in it.


If this is all made up, how do you all explain the strange aspects to the police report from the incident that happened in my city in 2008? if this was just 4 people claiming to see something strange...why did a higher agency take possession of the case (police report no longer available), according to my dispatcher friend, the only time a higher agency takes over a local case, is when it is very serious, or involves multiple states...id love to hear someone realistically explain how an alleged 'werewolf sighting' could reach a level where the feds get involved and take over the case!! There was no crime actually committed here, it was just 4 people who claimed to see something that looked like a werewolf.


Just someone looking for attention!

My dispatcher friend also thought the fact they brought in the police sketch artist to render a drawing was odd in itself, the only time this is done is when a serious crime has been committed and they are actively searching for a suspect, she thinks there was likely something to this case that made police take it as seriously as they did, maybe it was the surv video from the gas station.
A slow process, huh? I still dont see hows it physically possible for a human being to change forms, no matter how slow the process is, unless its over months or years. Maybe with some outside interference, like a doctor modifying a bodt part or something, but for a human to physically change into something else, nope.
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Old 03-05-2020, 12:45 PM
 
Location: Maine
17,755 posts, read 21,691,954 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
the moon has nothing to do with this as far as I can tell, that is pure hollywood fiction.
Nope. Full moon goes back to the earliest folklore. Even back to prehistory. The whole "full moon ain't got nuttin' to do with it" mostly comes from Hollywood --- specifically Dick Miller's speech in The Howling. Read that book I suggested above. You'll get the whole story.

The thing Hollywood gets wrong: The transformation being curse. Again, nope. According to myth and folklore, the transformation was almost always done on purpose. The whole "tortured soul" and "curse" of the werewolf is more Hollywood by way of Sigmund Freud. Werewolves in myth and folklore like being werewolves. They choose it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
The 2 local people that have claimed to see this happening, said it was a slow process, and both of these were in different states, but within about 5-10 yrs of each other.
If it was so slow, how come none of these witnesses have managed to snap a photo? At least Bigfoot moves fast. He's got an excuse.


Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
If this is all made up, how do you all explain the strange aspects to the police report from the incident that happened in my city in 2008? if this was just 4 people claiming to see something strange...why did a higher agency take possession of the case (police report no longer available), according to my dispatcher friend, the only time a higher agency takes over a local case, is when it is very serious, or involves multiple states...id love to hear someone realistically explain how an alleged 'werewolf sighting' could reach a level where the feds get involved and take over the case!! There was no crime actually committed here, it was just 4 people who claimed to see something that looked like a werewolf.
Got any documentation to back that up? I'd love to read it.
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Old 03-05-2020, 09:48 PM
 
14,724 posts, read 3,918,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UpstateJohn View Post
A slow process, huh? I still dont see hows it physically possible for a human being to change forms, no matter how slow the process is, unless its over months or years. Maybe with some outside interference, like a doctor modifying a bodt part or something, but for a human to physically change into something else, nope.
From the descriptions of the two people that messaged me, I am assuming about an hour.


The first guy that saw this as a kid replied back to me today, he said from what he saw, it looked like real 'flesh and blood body parts' changing/growing, he said it was just like the movies depict it (just not as quick, and he didnt think the guy was growing in height or in 'bulk'), The last werewolf movie I saw was one of the Underworld movies and in that movie the people change into 'Lycans' in about 3 minutes or less.


He also reiterated it didnt look to be 'supernatural' at all.


I dont think its scientifically explainable, I think its OLD, (whatever it is) and it doesnt effect that many people, it may be demonic in origin, but I dont think its 'demonic possession'.


I think the best way to start looking at this, is first, try to determine which higher agency took possession of the Erlanger bowling alley incident, and why a higher agency took the case, (Im assuming this is a reasonable request for information), there is nothing 'national security' involved, so I cannot think of any reason they would deny my request.


Going out on a limb, Im assuming its the FBI, that took over this case..? IDK?


I SO wish I had saved the incident details when it was all over the internet back in the early 2010s, Im pretty sure it listed the 4 people by name.
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Old 03-05-2020, 09:55 PM
 
14,724 posts, read 3,918,213 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark S. View Post
Nope. Full moon goes back to the earliest folklore. Even back to prehistory. The whole "full moon ain't got nuttin' to do with it" mostly comes from Hollywood --- specifically Dick Miller's speech in The Howling. Read that book I suggested above. You'll get the whole story.

The thing Hollywood gets wrong: The transformation being curse. Again, nope. According to myth and folklore, the transformation was almost always done on purpose. The whole "tortured soul" and "curse" of the werewolf is more Hollywood by way of Sigmund Freud. Werewolves in myth and folklore like being werewolves. They choose it.




If it was so slow, how come none of these witnesses have managed to snap a photo? At least Bigfoot moves fast. He's got an excuse.




Got any documentation to back that up? I'd love to read it.
What kind of documentation are you wanting? Ive already mentioned the details of this CANNOT be found anymore online, there are a few places that do refer to it and I believe there is a paranormal radio show that talked about it on one of their episodes, but I have not found it yet, other than that, Im not sure what I can provide.


Im not sure if there is a way for the public to request information about a city police report that has been taken over by a higher agency? Im assuming, since this was just a 'monster sighting' there is nothing security or crime related, so they should have no reason to deny a request for the original report. I live in Erlanger and pay taxes here...this happened in Erlanger, so I do have a right to read that report.
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Old 03-06-2020, 04:29 AM
 
Location: Gray Court, SC
3,502 posts, read 2,609,049 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rstevens62 View Post
From the descriptions of the two people that messaged me, I am assuming about an hour.


The first guy that saw this as a kid replied back to me today, he said from what he saw, it looked like real 'flesh and blood body parts' changing/growing, he said it was just like the movies depict it (just not as quick, and he didnt think the guy was growing in height or in 'bulk'), The last werewolf movie I saw was one of the Underworld movies and in that movie the people change into 'Lycans' in about 3 minutes or less.


He also reiterated it didnt look to be 'supernatural' at all.


I dont think its scientifically explainable, I think its OLD, (whatever it is) and it doesnt effect that many people, it may be demonic in origin, but I dont think its 'demonic possession'.


I think the best way to start looking at this, is first, try to determine which higher agency took possession of the Erlanger bowling alley incident, and why a higher agency took the case, (Im assuming this is a reasonable request for information), there is nothing 'national security' involved, so I cannot think of any reason they would deny my request.


Going out on a limb, Im assuming its the FBI, that took over this case..? IDK?


I SO wish I had saved the incident details when it was all over the internet back in the early 2010s, Im pretty sure it listed the 4 people by name.
In an hours time, I could mutilate my body enough to make you think Im crazy as hell too! But I don't think I could grow claws, more hair and a snout in that length of time. And I agree with whoever said it, an hour and noone took pics. Please. I may believe in Bigfoot, but a werewolf, nah!
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Old 03-06-2020, 09:34 AM
 
Location: The Commonwealth of Virginia
690 posts, read 413,232 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UpstateJohn View Post
In an hours time, I could mutilate my body enough to make you think Im crazy as hell too! But I don't think I could grow claws, more hair and a snout in that length of time. And I agree with whoever said it, an hour and noone took pics. Please. I may believe in Bigfoot, but a werewolf, nah!
So, I would say (not being a believer in Werewolves) that if you are going to believe that Werewolves exist, and that the human body undergoes that kind of transformation, you'd almost have to believe that that kind of transformational capability would have to be of supernatural origin. So it kind of misses the point to argue that the human body couldn't really do that.

Not having read the book Mark S. cited earlier, I'd venture a guess and say that most "werewolf" legends cite the supernatural, or some kind of witchcraft, as an origin for most Werewolf/Skinwalker myths. I know most Navajo Indians believe in "Skinwalkers," or humans who can turn into animals, and they think witches (and black magic) are the cause.

--
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