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Old 01-20-2022, 11:38 PM
 
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The strange 'UFOs/UAPs' people see today (and in the past) are imo, from THIS planet....they are a much more advanced 'group' (for lack of a better word), that likely reside in a place on this planet, that mankind is either not aware of, or cannot access.


The movie 'Midnight Special' with Michael Shannon, Adam Driver depicts it pretty well I think.
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Old 01-21-2022, 12:52 AM
 
Location: Midwest City, Oklahoma
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheArchitect View Post
I think that if the odds were so low it shouldn't have happened at all........it wouldn't have happened at all.

That it is proven to have happened and can happen means that it is something that does occur in nature. The only real question is frequency. Even in the most pessimistic, hypothetical "rare Earth" scenario, such that it only happens once or twice per galaxy, per billion years, there would have been trillions of worlds with life in the history of the universe.
What are the odds that an entire universe will blink into existence from nothing and have the exact finely-tuned attributes necessary for life? I mean, it happened once, so there must be billions of them. Right?

Maybe our universe will collide into another universe that is moving towards us faster than the speed of light and we won't even see it coming until it is already slamming into us.

Or maybe another universe will just blink into existence on top of ours and its initial explosion/expansion will engulf the entire Milky Way.

Point is, just because something happened once, doesn't mean it will happen again, unless there is infinite, and there isn't.
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Old 01-21-2022, 12:58 AM
 
Location: Midwest City, Oklahoma
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Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
Hahaha .... my calculator doesn’t display enough digits .... so here are the rough figures

In our Milky Way galaxy, there are an estimated 100 Billion Stars.

In our visible universe it is estimated to be 2 Trillion Galaxies, with an estimated number of stars of 200 Billion Trillion.

From data collected from the Kepler space telescope, there are estimated to be 300 Million habitable planets in just our galaxyalone.

So, as a comparative example, winning the Power Ball Jackpot is estimated to be 292 Million to 1 odds. So just using the 300 Million habitable planets in just our galaxy, knowing there is at least one planet actively sustaining intelligent life (ours), the odds of no other planet with said life existing is 300 Million to 1, or roughly the same odds as winning the Power Ball Jackpot.

But then we have 2 Trillion galaxies! So the odds of no life existing in the entire Universe would be 2.333 Trillion to 1, or roughly the odds of winning the Power Ball jackpot every day for the next 2,739 years in a row, or 34 generations of your offspring.

In plain non-mathematical language, Moderator cut: rude word IMPOSSIBLE.
I'm trying to do some calculations for you, but I have a problem. While I know the number of galaxies, and the number of stars, and the number of planets. I'm missing one thing. What are the odds that a planet will have life?

Do you know? Because without that I cannot do any calculations and I don't want to sound stupid. Thanks in advance.
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Old 01-21-2022, 01:50 AM
 
Location: UK
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It seems to me that the mathematicians and scientists like playing with numbers because it keeps them happy. They dont have to focus on the real world where stuff happens, they can stay in their heads and talk numbers, probabilities, calculations and percentages. This is just avoiding the issue and living in a fantasy land. But, acording to them we who believe in UFOs are also living in a different fantasy land because we cannot provide what they need in order to believe.

The thing is neither of us can prove anything until we come face-to-face with the occupants and ask them and then, even then, no-one else will believe us. In fact, that is what has happened multiple times throughout history and still no-one believes it because it is too "out there" for others to accept. However good a witness, however good a character some guy has, it just doesn't matter if they are telling us something we do not believe is possible.

In the late 19th or early 20th century, there were a number of aliens who landed and introduced themselves as "Wilson" to different independent people and this was before the invention of flying machines. Now, how likely is that, but it has been reported multiple times and always "Wilson"?
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Old 01-21-2022, 05:58 AM
 
8,005 posts, read 7,111,981 times
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Originally Posted by Tallysmom View Post
Let’s not get stuck in hyperboleland. There’s a whole lot of atheists who don’t believe in UFOs, crypto’s and ghosts. I can think of two right now — Penn and Teller.
Make that three.
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Old 01-21-2022, 06:46 AM
 
8,578 posts, read 9,047,409 times
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Originally Posted by Redshadowz View Post
I'm trying to do some calculations for you, but I have a problem. While I know the number of galaxies, and the number of stars, and the number of planets. I'm missing one thing. What are the odds that a planet will have life?

Do you know? Because without that I cannot do any calculations and I don't want to sound stupid. Thanks in advance.
Use our solar system. Of nine planets (Pluto lover here), we know what planet has life and Earth's attributes that allowed life to evolve and thrive.
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Old 01-21-2022, 06:52 AM
 
Location: Maine
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Originally Posted by Redshadowz View Post
As I said, there could certainly be life elsewhere in the universe. I NEVER claimed I know the answer. What annoys me is when people claim to know.
Yup. Agreed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz View Post
You don't know. Why? Because it is literally unknowable.
Now? Yes. I certainly have never seen any conclusive evidence. But knowing what we know about the state of the cosmos and all we have discovered over the past 30 years ... I certainly can't say I know for certain there is life beyond Earth. But I think the chances are pretty good.

And that was the original point. We're speculating. That is a lot of what goes on in this forum. I roll my eyes a lot at the True Believers, though I definitely enjoy their arguments.

The thing is ...

We don't know it all. Humans just figured out flight a little over a century ago. We cracked the atom less than a century ago. The Internet and computers in homes happened in my lifetime. So one thing I do know for certain: We don't have it all figured out yet. If the knowledge of the entire cosmos could be put into a library of a hundred trillion books, each with a hundred trillion pages, I'd say we are well into Chapter 3 of the first book.

Here is one you're gonna love: I have seen a UFO. I promise you I did. Do I think it was an alien spacecraft or invaders from the Hollow Earth? No. I have no idea what it was. It was an unidentified flying object, but it behaved in a way that no human aircraft can at our current level of technology.
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Old 01-21-2022, 09:07 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Mark S. View Post
Here is one you're gonna love: I have seen a UFO. I promise you I did. Do I think it was an alien spacecraft or invaders from the Hollow Earth? No. I have no idea what it was. It was an unidentified flying object, but it behaved in a way that no human aircraft can at our current level of technology.
Yet for millions of people, that is enough evidence to leap all the way to alien visitors, which is probably the least likely explanation.
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Old 01-21-2022, 09:26 AM
 
Location: Maine
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Originally Posted by 1insider View Post
Yet for millions of people, that is enough evidence to leap all the way to alien visitors, which is probably the least likely explanation.
“If everyone is thinking alike, then somebody isn't thinking.” (George Patton)
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Old 01-21-2022, 01:39 PM
 
14,815 posts, read 8,458,266 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redshadowz View Post
I'm trying to do some calculations for you, but I have a problem. While I know the number of galaxies, and the number of stars, and the number of planets. I'm missing one thing. What are the odds that a planet will have life?

Do you know? Because without that I cannot do any calculations and I don't want to sound stupid. Thanks in advance.
No, no, no, you can’t sound stupid, because there are factors that cannot be known, so assumptions and speculations are unavoidable. The fact that you’re trying to calculate the odds is a greater sign of intelligence, compared to someone who immediately dismisses the possibility of life existing on another planet other than this one. Let me explain.

I believe the question answers itself, based on known factors, if the question is, does life exist on other planets, yes or no?

The previous Power Ball Jackpot example may be a poor example leading us astray here, because it is just a probability calculation of chance, based on the number of possible lottery combinations. And while 292 Million to 1 are astronomical odds working against you personally winning that jackpot, people do win these jackpots periodically, so there is no longer a yes-no question ... the answer is a resounding yes. Multiple people have and will continue to win. Therefore, the odds don’t predict an yes/no, but an if/when, with a virtual certainty of an eventual winner.

Let’s use another example because we’re working in the other direction, by attempting to calculate the odds that life does not exist on any another planet. Let’s examine an ocean beach. A nice fluffy white sandy beach. When you look broadly at the beach it looks almost Snow White. But if you look closely at the individual grains of sand, you’ll see many other colors and shades. So you scoop up a handful, and closely examine the individual grains and you you find one blue grain amidst the dominant colors of white, beige and pink. Just one tiny grain that’s blue. OK? The question is, do you think that one handful of sand you randomly scooped up, captured the ONLY blue grain of sand that exists on that entire beach? Or, would you naturally conclude that among the trillions of handfuls of sand that comprise the entire beach, there would be many more?

At this point, and setting aside any other considerations or biases, the position that no life exists elsewhere other than here on Earth is not just mathematically improbable, but irrational. The odds of Earth being the only planet for which life exists are so astronomically remote, as to render the question itself, rather foolish. Put it this way, it’s Billions of TRILLIONS to ONE odds against Earth being the lone example of life in our universe.

There are some who dismiss life on other planets from religious perspectives, but I would suggest that it’s unlikely that God would create trillions of planets, only to use one of them for creation. A farmer with 1000 acres isn’t going to plant one acre and leave the other 999 unused.

From a scientific perspective which does not embrace “creation” or a “Creator”, but believes only in natural evolutionary processes, it would seem equally foolish to think that those natural process only occurred here on earth, out of Trillions of other places in our universe.

So, in my opinion, the probability of life on other planets is so high, the basis for believing otherwise is not even there.

But I have an open mind, and willing to consider other opinions.
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