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Whatever picture gun fanatics in the States are trying to paint about violent crime in the UK the simple fact of the matter is you are FAR more likely to be murdered in the USA, the amount of murders by shootings in the US is astronomical for a developed country and this 'you are far more likely to have a 'punchup in the UK' argument is laughable!
The link I put up is a British link and there are lots more besides that one.
The issue of U.K. violence has appeared in British publications with no input from "gun fanatics" in the U.S.
And you seemed to have missed that most of the gun violence is criminal-on-criminal, or gang-on-gang in the U.S., so the chances of being murdered in the U.S. is not really as great as you think.
In spite of the recent mass shootings that grab headlines, MOST U.S. gun violence is criminal-to-criminal in the U.S. The "War on Drugs" is a dismal failure and increases criminal activity, drug gangs, and gun crimes, in the same way Prohibition increased crime.
I think this is why we can have more gun deaths, yet paradoxically feel safer and less exposed to violence in day-to-day life.
There was a brilliant documentary tonight on that very subject and one of the most astonishing statistics relayed to the viewer was the percentage of prisoners America incarcerates. Although America makes up 5% of the global population apparently American prisoners make up 25% of the prison population. Not sure how accurate this statistic is as I haven't checked the source.
It was a very insightful documentary and it was called 'The House I live In' on BBC 4 with contributions from amongst others David Simon creator of 'the Wire' and 'Treme'.
In the areas where drug activity is high it appears the police incentives for making drug bust after drug bust are also increasingly based around finance i.e seizure of money, vehicles and assets. One border patrol Cop in New Mexico conceded as much.
Now when they were in Miami this one Cop said that vast swathes of the whole neighbourhood were connected to drug crime in one way or another with the intense targeting in these areas focused on arrests. On the flip side targeted neighbourhoods appear to find it a struggle to break the chains that the drug trade have them shackled by. Especially in these areas where the drug trade is so prevalent and children idolise the only role models they see growing up on the streets.
I think this has probably been aired in the US already but if it hasn't I'd look out for it. A very powerful documentary although to be balanced it was a very deliberately weighted perspective from a writer whose views on this topic are well known. Well worth viewing.
, so the chances of being murdered in the U.S. is not really as great as you think.
Yes they are. If it was 70 years ago NO because those gangsters were pretty good shots. See Chicago Tribune files. These gangbangers today couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with a howitzer from 10 feet. Most of the deaths are innocent bystanders.
historically , britain is a violent country and very good at it , i would say its more agressive and hard nosed than the likes of france or italy
I have heard of more violent things going on in Britain than I have in France or Italy. France has started to be in the news more with unrest in the suburbs of Paris. I never knew there was that much despair in greater Paris, especially as a tourist who takes a train from CDG to the heart of the city. Italy and Greece are now making the news because people are pissed with conditions and they are rioting. The normally laid-back Greeks are really besides themselves lately.
I have heard of a lot of "Brit versus outsider" riots and showdowns. One time, some locals in Liverpool and some Portuguese immigrants went at it, and the Portuguese lost ... and there were some fatalities. It happened at the same time I was in Porto PT. One lady, a vendor at the train station in Porto threw my ticket at me, something I've never seen before in that country, since they initially think I'm from the UK, given that most of their tourists are Brits and Germans, though that is changing.
Last edited by robertpolyglot; 01-14-2013 at 09:47 PM..
Yes they are. If it was 70 years ago NO because those gangsters were pretty good shots. See Chicago Tribune files. These gangbangers today couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with a howitzer from 10 feet. Most of the deaths are innocent bystanders.
Again, it's kept in their own areas, where the vast majority of Americans do not live.
They don't have shoot outs in nice areas of the city or in the suburbs.
There was a brilliant documentary tonight on that very subject and one of the most astonishing statistics relayed to the viewer was the percentage of prisoners America incarcerates. Although America makes up 5% of the global population apparently American prisoners make up 25% of the prison population. Not sure how accurate this statistic is as I haven't checked the source.
It was a very insightful documentary and it was called 'The House I live In' on BBC 4 with contributions from amongst others David Simon creator of 'the Wire' and 'Treme'.
In the areas where drug activity is high it appears the police incentives for making drug bust after drug bust are also increasingly based around finance i.e seizure of money, vehicles and assets. One border patrol Cop in New Mexico conceded as much.
Now you're talking.
One of the greatest problems in the U.S. is that many of the prisons have become privatized. This is a tragedy because any private industry wants to grow and now prisons are a money-making venture.
Ever since prisons became privatized, the incentives to put more people away has gone off the rails.
The whole thing is dirty.
And yes, you can buy all sorts of luxury goods that were confiscated in drug busts. Illegal drugs are very profitable ... for more than just the criminals.
So you're saing that bystanders in poor areas are not that innocent because they don't live in a nice suburb?
NO.
I'm saying that the MAJORITY of people don't live in poor crime-ridden areas, therefore are not as statistically likely to get shot as you would think.
I don't know what else to say to make this concept any clearer.
I can see that point of view and I've heard it from relatives and friends in the United States but it is hard to gauge an accurate picture on the violent crime statistics when the recording measures used vary so drastically between crime fighting agencies in the UK and the US.
What we do know for certain is that the worst the US has to offer makes the UK look pretty tame by comparison. But perhaps the mildest town centres in the UK would be more raucous and boisterous than their counterparts in the USA.
Today, I read that homicides are by far the least occurring of all violent crimes nationally in the U.S., according to F.B.I. figures.
We know the U.S. has a higher homicide rate than the U.K., and that makes people assume it has a higher crime rate overall. But the assumption doesn't hold up when you look at violent crime other than homicides.
So many people from overseas write that they are terrified of visiting the U.S., as if we are living in the Wild West. Zero crime would be better of course, but this is not the scary place it's portrayed to be outside of specific areas. I'd be far more afraid of areas in South America, for instance.
BTW, in spite of recent major headline events, I've also read that both the U.S. and the U.K. have declining violent crimes rates and have had for several years. At least it's going in the right direction.
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