I have been doing some reading on the history of cities in the US (suburban, market)

[sweat209]

From some of the reading I have been doing here is rough outline .


The history of cities in the US goes like this.

• mix use before 1920

• one story storefront 20's ,30's , 40's and little in the 50's

• Americana roadside strip late 30's , 40's , 50's to mid 60's

Typical of ( Americana roadside strip late 30's , 40's , 50's to mid 60's) are bars ,restaurants and fast food ,ice cream ,donuts ,hot dog , diners, car wash ,used cars ,car parts ,discont stores , U-hall ,cash shop ,storage ,auto body ,bicycle service ,computer store ,Beauty shop ,Jamaican food , Caribbean , Cuban food , car sales ,tire sales ,rent a car ,windows ,beauty salons , Jewellers , cleaners , pet store , car parts , part and transmission , supper mart ,used cars , laundry mat ,nails and hair cut ,oil filters for cars ,motors for cars ,car sales , Hasty mart, 711 ,supply shop , furniture and mattress so on ..

• malls and plazas late 50's to mid 80's
• box stores and power centers mind 90's to now

• grid system before 1950 and some other cities still where putting in the grid system in the 50' thus some cities before 60's

• street hierarchy in place and face of subdivision 60's to now where some other cities 70's to now like the picture below.

Note The small parking,small plazas ,small lot ,parking on the side or in the back ,commercial strip like hot dog stands ,diners ,used car lots ,ice cream stands ,car dealers ,gas stations ,motels ,drive-in theaters ,fast food places ,restaurants are from the late 30's to mid 60's.

The Roadside hot dog stands and diners were big trend of the day in the 1930s and 1940s



Note cities in Canada copied more the European system and big on mix use before indoor malls took of in the late 50's with the exception of towns and towns part of the city now do to take over of the towns and some cities in the west cost allowing some non mix use like the pictures above showing one story storefronts and Americana roadside strip .

Note not big like it is in the US or the sun belt cities in the US the non mix use the one story storefronts and Americana roadside strip .


Note I'm doing some more reading on suburbs and the history of cities in the US I will post soon.


I just wanted to post rough outline of what I have been reading .

[MrRational]

Originally Posted by sweat209

I just wanted to post rough outline of what I have been reading

I hope you get a good grade on your report.

[sweat209]

Originally Posted by MrRational

I hope you get a good grade on your report.

You cannot trust every book or page on the internet to be 100% right .

The rough outline may be 100% right or 80% right or 60% right.

But base on the books I read and stuff on the internet this is the rough outline .

I'm sure there are other people here that know this really well and would reply if some of the information is little off.

[wburg]

What books have you been reading, sweat209?

[Lamplight]

It seems pretty accurate. What I'm wondering is why did it all develop that way? In many if not most towns in the U.S., you can find the oldest part of town and as you work your way outward toward the newest areas, everything becomes low, wide, and spread out. I'm assuming it's partly due to the increased prevalence and speed of the automobile, but is that the only reason?

[wburg]

The differences happened because people's ideas of how cities should function changed. 19th century cities were dirty and polluted, and many wanted to escape that dirt and pollution, and figured the best way was to physically separate uses from each other. That wasn't really practical when most people got around on foot, but streetcars allowed greater physical mobility and horizontal expansion. In the 20th century, these ideas about separating uses became laws, called "zoning," that mandated separation of uses. At the same time, other civic improvers calling for paved roads to cut down on urban dust and dirt were joined by companies interested in promoting automobiles, which weren't very useful on unpaved or cobbled streets and nearly useless on dirt interstate roads. Governments began programs of road building that allowed greater distances between uses--not really due to greater speeds, but due to the automobile's greater flexibility, which is only possible if there are roads to drive them on.

This government-subsidized transportation mode started to force out other modes--streetcar and railroad companies were private entities who maintained their own right-of-way, while roads were a public resource paid for indirectly by the taxpayer. As cities grew outward, they turned their backs on these other transit modes, which really weren't any older (electric streetcars were invented 1 year before the automobile, diesel-electric locomotives decades after the automobile) but had lost the battle for public subsidy and public opinion.

The automobile city has to be low, wide and spread out because so many parking spaces are needed for automobiles--not just one parking space per car, but multiple parking spaces per car (surveys suggest somewhere between 4-8 parking spaces per car in the US.) That adds up to a lot of real estate. Engineering standards err in favor of wideness wherever possible, assuming that faster traffic is safer traffic, and the fewer pedestrians the better things are for cars, the #1 priority.

I have a tough time figuring out what sweat209 is saying sometimes, but I am still curious what actual textbooks he is reading about the history of US cities.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by wburg

The automobile city has to be low, wide and spread out because so many parking spaces are needed for automobiles--not just one parking space per car, but multiple parking spaces per car (surveys suggest somewhere between 4-8 parking spaces per car in the US.) That adds up to a lot of real estate. Engineering standards err in favor of wideness wherever possible, assuming that faster traffic is safer traffic, and the fewer pedestrians the better things are for cars, the #1 priority.

Say something often enough and people will believe it. We discussed this before. A car doesn't really even need a parking space at one's own house; one can park on the street. All the other spaces are shared spaces, at the grocery store, the mall, even the workplace to a certain extent, especially if you work somewhere that does shift work.

[nei]

Originally Posted by Katiana

Say something often enough and people will believe it. We discussed this before. A car doesn't really even need a parking space at one's own house; one can park on the street. All the other spaces are shared spaces, at the grocery store, the mall, even the workplace to a certain extent, especially if you work somewhere that does shift work.

We have discussed this before and there was disagreement. You can support automobiles without using up lots of space for automobiles, but most auto centric does use up space in effort to maximize driving convenience, do use up lots of parking. A neighborhood where large amount of locals park on the street is not your typical suburban auto centric region.

In most auto centric development, each store builds parking to support its customers / workers for the maximum amount. A restaurant might build enough parking for the amount of customers on a Friday night, an office park (at least one that doesn't have shift work) builds enough parking for the amount of workers and visitors in the middle of a weekday, and so on. A more efficient way would be have parking in common in mixed use districts and relying on street parking as an overflow for high demand times.

It would be nice to see actual studies on how much parking is built compared to the residents in auto centric areas.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by nei

We have discussed this before and there was disagreement. You can support automobiles without using up lots of space for automobiles, but most auto centric does use up space in effort to maximize driving convenience, do use up lots of parking. A neighborhood where large amount of locals park on the street is not your typical suburban auto centric region.

In most auto centric development, each store builds parking to support its customers / workers for the maximum amount. A restaurant might build enough parking for the amount of customers on a Friday night, an office park (at least one that doesn't have shift work) builds enough parking for the amount of workers and visitors in the middle of a weekday, and so on. A more efficient way would be have parking in common in mixed use districts and relying on street parking as an overflow for high demand times.

It would be nice to see actual studies on how much parking is built compared to the residents in auto centric areas.

I agree that it would be nice to see a study or studies. A grocery store probably knows approximately how many total customers it has. It doesn't build a parking lot to accomodate all of them; they're not all there at the same time. It builds to accomodate the number of shoppers in the store, which is a fraction of its total customers. Ditto a restaurant. Most people don't go to the same restaurant every Friday night. They don't need a dedicated spot for their car.

[nei]

Originally Posted by Katiana

I agree that it would be nice to see a study or studies. A grocery store probably knows approximately how many total customers it has. It doesn't build a parking lot to accomodate all of them; they're not all there at the same time. It builds to accomodate the number of shoppers in the store, which is a fraction of its total customers. Ditto a restaurant. Most people don't go to the same restaurant every Friday night. They don't need a dedicated spot for their car.

I don't think you followed what I said.

I meant a restaurant would build parking for the maximum number of customers it gets at a given time (for a restaurant maybe Friday night). Ditto with a supermarket or office park. Since different places have different usage timings, there will be unused parking spaces. How much, I'm not sure.