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Your point was that cars are the most efficient way to move people.
No, my point was that VEHICLES were the most efficient way to move people. So that any system designed to move people efficiently will also, by necessity, be designed to move vehicles efficiently. So when you say a place is set up to efficiently move cars, that is neither pejorative nor in any way an impediment to that place being set up to efficiently move people.
No, my point was that VEHICLES were the most efficient way to move people. So that any system designed to move people efficiently will also, by necessity, be designed to move vehicles efficiently. So when you say a place is set up to efficiently move cars, that is neither pejorative nor in any way an impediment to that place being set up to efficiently move people.
This was the assumption of American traffic engineers for decades. Unfortunately it's often not true. If a roadway gets full of cars, it may impede the movement of buses (or streetcars), especially when they have to pull to the curb for bus stops. The road becomes inefficient for buses. It's also not necessarily safe or efficient for bicycles (which are vehicles, but not motor vehicles). There's a whole effort going on today to create "complete streets" which will optimize conditions for all modes of travel (including vehicle-less pedestrians) not just cars.
This was the assumption of American traffic engineers for decades. Unfortunately it's often not true. If a roadway gets full of cars, it may impede the movement of buses (or streetcars), especially when they have to pull to the curb for bus stops.
I've found that it's more the buses impeding the cars. This is why Philly SEPTA strikes often make traffic move better; buses, to steal a phrase, are like cholesterol in the arteries of the streets. But yes, when a road gets full of vehicles (whether cars or buses), it gets less efficient for any given vehicle. But that's a matter of usage and/or capacity planning, not infrastructure design per se.
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It's also not necessarily safe or efficient for bicycles (which are vehicles, but not motor vehicles).
Bicycling advocates aren't happy unless they've got a lane to themselves on a street with no cars on it.
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There's a whole effort going on today to create "complete streets" which will optimize conditions for all modes of travel (including vehicle-less pedestrians) not just cars.
One truism of optimization is you can't optimize for all conditions at once.
Bicycling advocates aren't happy unless they've got a lane to themselves on a street with no cars on it.
Many advocate bike lanes and safer intersections. I haven't heard of any that advocated a street without cars, though I'm sure you can find some. And then there are these:
I've found that it's more the buses impeding the cars. This is why Philly SEPTA strikes often make traffic move better; buses, to steal a phrase, are like cholesterol in the arteries of the streets. But yes, when a road gets full of vehicles (whether cars or buses), it gets less efficient for any given vehicle. But that's a matter of usage and/or capacity planning, not infrastructure design per se.
Good. Prioritize buses (full of people) over private vehicles (Typically one person). Moving people more efficiently.
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Bicycling advocates aren't happy unless they've got a lane to themselves on a street with no cars on it.
Not true, most biking advocates are more knowledgeable on transportation issues then average and understand multi-modal transit.
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One truism of optimization is you can't optimize for all conditions at once.
Yes, but you should prioritize the most efficient form of transportation. The one moving the most people.
I also want to add in response to the grocery question. Not only do New Yorkers use carts for large loads but in vast majority of cases there are multiple grocery stores within walking distance (a 5 minute walk even).
I also want to add in response to the grocery question. Not only do New Yorkers use carts for large loads but in vast majority of cases there are multiple grocery stores within walking distance (a 5 minute walk even).
For some value of "grocery store". Little delis with food items, yes. Supermarkets are a bit scarcer on the ground, though there still likely will be something within walking distance. The supermarkets are also small, crowded, have little selection, and have ridiculously high prices -- next to rent and real estate, groceries are probably the most overpriced item in New York.
For some value of "grocery store". Little delis with food items, yes. Supermarkets are a bit scarcer on the ground, though there still likely will be something within walking distance. The supermarkets are also small, crowded, have little selection, and have ridiculously high prices -- next to rent and real estate, groceries are probably the most overpriced item in New York.
I've find decently priced grocery stores in NYC with ok selection (not to the size of the big box-style suburban stores). And outside of Manhattan is easier to find normal priced groceries. Obviously haven't that big of a sample. Beer seems more overpriced than groceries. This Brooklyn supermarket had decent prices:
It appears not to have car parking, but it does appear to have dog parking.
New Yorkers haven't embraced the big box concept. Maybe since their apartments are so small. With over eight million people, they still, as of June, have not one Walmart.
New Yorkers haven't embraced the big box concept. Maybe since their apartments are so small. With over eight million people, they still, as of June, have not one Walmart.
Why should they? They live in a dense enviorment where big box stores cant really be supported and if they can exist, they would need to make sure it was in a heavily traveled area of NYC where they could assure themselves a profit. The only place that can even have a big box store without building up is staten island and even there its too dense in some areas.
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