Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Well I thank you guys for your honest replies. Utah is definitely not off my list. There's just so much going for the state in terms of making it such an ideal place for me to want to live and raise a family. Despite these setbacks, I can't forget the absolute glee I felt when I was looking at all the potential outdoors recreation & varied geographies, climate, and seasons. How gun friendly the state is--I'm a big gun enthusiast, and I looked up Utah's laws regarding firearms, it's as free as it gets. While looking up real estate for all 12 states on my list, nothing quite compared to Utah. There was really something about the ways the homes are built and embeddened in natural light with the mountains all around that tugged on my heart strings. I can't disregard all of that.
Have you ever visited Utah? You ought to try to come out here on vacation, if you haven't.
Quote:
However, this social and political issue is definitely a setback. A big part of me wanting to making such a move is because I want to raise my children in a highly virtuous, highly moral, conservative environment. Utah may be all of that, but it won't mean much if my family and I face social isolation because of our faith. Considering how important politics is to me, it's discouraging how the extent of my political ambitions will be limited to municipal offices.
There are a lot of neighborhoods in the Salt Lake Valley where I think you and your family would feel little isolation. I wouldn't really consider moving to anywhere in Utah County, but you should be just fine in Salt Lake County. And I don't think you'd be limited to being elected to municipal offices, but like any newcomer to the state, you'd have to climb the ladder just like anyone else. Nobody starts out getting elected as a Senator, Congressman or Governor. Besides, it sounds like you are highly motivated and you have set some clear goals for your future. I think those qualities would be appreciated by Utah voters.
Well, that is certainly not encouraging. Politics is a huge part of my personal and professional life, and I'd hate to not meet my ambitions because of an unbalanced playing field. I'd hope that my political ideology and principles would count more than religious affiliation--especially when I'm certain most LDS would agree with me unanimously on policy issues.
I read the thread thoroughly, and truthfully I find it discouraging that my family and I may face discrimination despite the fact that I'm Christian, dedicated my career to public service, and a veteran.
I agree with Kletterman. You are unlikely to be chosen as a republican candidate for anything unless you are an active Mormon. I'll take it a step further than that. I think many candidates tend to come from large LDS families that provide them a natural base of support. Often they are in the bishopric in their ward. The few exceptions are people who are unusually well known in their community because of business connections or a family name that goes back a century or so.
Personally, I am not conservative and will try to make a few unbiased comments:
1. We encounter with some frequency people who are fleeing CA, NY or somewhere else because they claim it is too "liberal". They often seek out a place like Utah because it has a conservative reputation.
2. You can join a fairly long list of people who are doing what you are doing. Frankly, I find it a bit tiring to here the politicians here compete in trying to be "more conservative" than the other politicians.
3. Conservatives with something other than a Mormon background often feel left out here. The local GOP will be grateful for your vote, but probably not do anything to encourage your political ambitions.
4. I have met people just like you who became disillusioned and left Utah within a few years.
5. If you come here, I wouldn't make politics my first reason for doing so.
Political candidates are chosen by caucus here rather than by primary, so how well established you are and who you know are key to becoming a candidate for the two main parties.
To MillenialMaverick: LOL I am actually a Hebrew (a Jew who believes in the real Messiah called by HIS Hebrew name Yeshua not the "J" one the Christians use). Talk about being "set apart", there aren't many of us around here that's for sure. My wife "was" LDS when I met her but has joined me in my faith for some time. We celebrated our 36th anniversary this last August so it certainly was a good choice. It's so very important to find a woman that values the concept of a "covenant" which is what a marriage "should" be. Not one of convenience or an attitude of "well if it doesn't work out there's always divorce". My parents were married 57 years before dad passed and mom made it to age 93. They were what I patterned my marriage after and it sure has worked well. Each partner should be giving 110% if it's ideal. But frankly the BEST relationships I've noted were ones where each person was as if not MORE concerned for the other than themselves. It is a key.
As far as being an "outsider" with having the kids, it so much depends on WHICH neighborhood you end up with. It would be sadly incorrect to assume that if you place them in a virtually all LDS neighborhood to expect them to be included in many activities of the kids. That's not reality. But in a more mixed neighborhood there's a very good chance of homogenization. As an adult in day to day life however I never tend to feel left out when I'm out and about shopping or whatever else I'm doing. But let's face it, ANY organized religious organization has their OWN gatherings which include their people exclusively......it's perfectly normal and natural. Once you are here you will find it much easier to find the best place for your longer term spot to stay. NOBODY can tell you what that truly is or would be. You have to taste it all for yourself, which isn't a bad thing.
I agree with your sentiments on what makes a successful marriage. I'm happy for the success of your union, and humbled to hear how she was willing to join in your faith.
I totally understand some events are reserved exclusively for church members, I get that and wouldn't demand otherwise. It's not that I fear being excluded from such events, but rather just completely ignored and isolated from day-to-day interactions. Regardless, I'll just have to give it a shot and find out for myself. Thanks for your advice.
Have you ever visited Utah? You ought to try to come out here on vacation, if you haven't.
There are a lot of neighborhoods in the Salt Lake Valley where I think you and your family would feel little isolation. I wouldn't really consider moving to anywhere in Utah County, but you should be just fine in Salt Lake County. And I don't think you'd be limited to being elected to municipal offices, but like any newcomer to the state, you'd have to climb the ladder just like anyone else. Nobody starts out getting elected as a Senator, Congressman or Governor. Besides, it sounds like you are highly motivated and you have set some clear goals for your future. I think those qualities would be appreciated by Utah voters.
Actually I have a vacation planned this April to visit Utah. Closest I've ever been is Colorado--which I very much enjoyed.
I have no illusions about climbing the ladder--no one starts at the top. I think it'd be like that for any career in any area. Like you've noticed, I'm very motivated and don't accept stagnation or "impediments" to my potential success. So if I were fortunate enough to win local or state office, I'd already be wondering how I can climb even higher. The political situation may in Utah may prove exceptionally challenging for me, though that wouldn't deter me if I ended up choosing to live here. Thanks for the advice!
I agree with Kletterman. You are unlikely to be chosen as a republican candidate for anything unless you are an active Mormon. I'll take it a step further than that. I think many candidates tend to come from large LDS families that provide them a natural base of support. Often they are in the bishopric in their ward. The few exceptions are people who are unusually well known in their community because of business connections or a family name that goes back a century or so.
Personally, I am not conservative and will try to make a few unbiased comments:
1. We encounter with some frequency people who are fleeing CA, NY or somewhere else because they claim it is too "liberal". They often seek out a place like Utah because it has a conservative reputation.
2. You can join a fairly long list of people who are doing what you are doing. Frankly, I find it a bit tiring to here the politicians here compete in trying to be "more conservative" than the other politicians.
3. Conservatives with something other than a Mormon background often feel left out here. The local GOP will be grateful for your vote, but probably not do anything to encourage your political ambitions.
4. I have met people just like you who became disillusioned and left Utah within a few years.
5. If you come here, I wouldn't make politics my first reason for doing so.
I appreciate your willingness to make unbiased comments, I would like to address your comments in the same manner you posted them;
1) This is what is colloquially known in the political world as "snowbird migration." It's the act of people fleeing their native homes because of disastrous nanny state policies that bankrupt the state's budget, destroy the potential for business growth, and impede on civil rights. Over the past two decades, the most affected states by the "snowbird" effect have been Florida, Colorado, North Carolina, Texas, and Georgia--noted by their economic and population explosion. Most transplants are coming from New York, California, Pennsylvania, Illinois, and Michigan. However, the snowbird effect is a cyclical pattern and started to negatively affect those states as well, prompting a new round of migration. It's being predicted that Utah is going to be one of the next big targets for transplants, due to many attractive factors that the state currently offers.
2) I am not competing for most conservative, rather just finding a crowd who agree with my political philosophies & way of life. It matters to me specifically in terms of raising of a family, because the area(s) I've lived in are literal indoctrination chambers of the most perverse and deprived ideologies you can imagine. I am not exaggerating, I invite you to spend a weekend walking through New York City and observe day to day interactions.
3) That makes sense. It's discouraging, but I get it.
4) It's possible. That's why I'm on a website like this trying to get as close to the grassroots as possible.
5) I didn't mention politics until the end of my admittedly long post. It just happens to be what this thread evolved into. Also, considering how I currently work within politics, am soon heading to graduate school for Public Policy studies, and have political aspirations of my own; it is a rather important factor when choosing a potential home.
Political candidates are chosen by caucus here rather than by primary, so how well established you are and who you know are key to becoming a candidate for the two main parties.
Religion is just as much an indoctrination chamber as any "nanny state."
Also, "family values" is a very subjective term, depending on the person. But it's usually a euphemism for homophobia.
Regardless, your profile would match that of many Utahns.
Salt Lake County is relatively diverse in terms of politics, but still mostly conservative outside of SLC. Gary Herbert still won the county in 2016 by a wide enough margin (~37000 votes).
While you flee to a more conservative area, I'll hopefully flee to a liberal safe space. If only Utah's poltical demography would change in my favor by the time you wanted to move here, but that's highly unlikely. Religious people have too many kids.
Religion is just as much an indoctrination chamber as any "nanny state."
Also, "family values" is a very subjective term, depending on the person. But it's usually a euphemism for homophobia.
Regardless, your profile would match that of many Utahns.
Salt Lake County is relatively diverse in terms of politics, but still mostly conservative outside of SLC. Gary Herbert still won the county in 2016 by a wide enough margin (~37000 votes).
While you flee to a more conservative area, I'll hopefully flee to a liberal safe space. If only Utah's poltical demography would change in my favor by the time you wanted to move here, but that's highly unlikely. Religious people have too many kids.
Sure it can be, but the key difference is religion and one's association with it is a choice, whereas you cannot choose to disregard the state's laws.
Family values have been revered and cultivated since the beginnings of civilization as one of the key foundations of a society--long before homosexuality made it to the mainstream political discourse. Supporting one group does not mean to oppose/discriminate another. I resent the comparison.
Indeed, why don't you "flee" to a safe space? If you're not resonating with the environment you're in, why seek to change what so many others spent generations creating, instead of going where you're more in touch?
Regardless, thank you for providing that data and contributing to this discussion.
I meant what others have said. Outside of SLC, you face almost insurmontable odds running as a Republican vs. an LDS Republican. Also, you have said "Christian " enough times that I have to wonder if you have a subconscious belief that LDS are not Christain. LDS kids are strongly encouraged to not date outside their faith. They tend to marry younger than others, so why waste time on someone not in the faith.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
