How business-friendly and Asian-friendly is Vancouver, WA? (Seattle, Tacoma: middle-class, sales)

[GoldenTiger]

Have always wanted to own a small business. So I have a few questions if Vancouver, WA is the right place to be. I understand that a visit will be necessary before we decide, but perhaps this forum can help us which city to visit first and which city to remove from consideration.

We're considering Vancouver because WA is supposedly business-friendlier than either OR or CA. I've been to Portland, OR many years ago, but never been to Vancouver, WA. Here are some of my questions with regards to Vancouver, WA:

1. How similar are people in Vancouver, WA and Portland, OR in terms of work attitude and professional outlook? From reading here, people said Portlanders have an "entitlement" attitude, (e.g. employees not showing up at work then not even notifying their employers or apologizing when they finally show up). Is this really common? And is this the same in Vancouver?

2. Are schools in Camas, WA better than those in Beaverton, OR?

3. Is Vancouver, WA cheaper or more expensive compared to the nicer and safer neighborhoods in Tacoma, WA?

4. Are there authentic or at least decent Asian restaurants (specifically dim sum and sushi) in Vancouver or how far are they if one has to drive to Portland?

5. How "liberal" are people in Vancouver, WA? And also how aggressive are the liberals in Portland? I normally don't care about political beliefs in the neighborhood as long as they don't impose their beliefs on others.

Thanks for your feedback!

[StealthRabbit]

Originally Posted by GoldenTiger

Have always wanted to own a small business. So I have a few questions if Vancouver, WA is the right place to be. I understand that a visit will be necessary before we decide, but perhaps this forum can help us which city to visit first and which city to remove from consideration.

We're considering Vancouver because WA is supposedly business-friendlier than either OR or CA. I've been to Portland, OR many years ago, but never been to Vancouver, WA. Here are some of my questions with regards to Vancouver, WA:

1. How similar are people in Vancouver, WA and Portland, OR in terms of work attitude and professional outlook? From reading here, people said Portlanders have an "entitlement" attitude, (e.g. employees not showing up at work then not even notifying their employers or apologizing when they finally show up). Is this really common? And is this the same in Vancouver? No, Vancouver is quite a bit more conservative in work ethic and attitudes. (but crummy workers seem to be prevalent in lmost every society)

2. Are schools in Camas, WA better than those in Beaverton, OR?
Bout the same, possibly a few more elective options in Beaverton, but for HS, Running Start in WA is tough to beat Academics - Running Start

3. Is Vancouver, WA cheaper or more expensive compared to the nicer and safer neighborhoods in Tacoma, WA? A bit cheaper than the NICE areas in Tacoma (generally Tacoma is a pretty rough place, NICE places bring a premium) Vancouver and Camas are largely upper middle-class, but nothing as rough as Tacoma

4. Are there authentic or at least decent Asian restaurants (specifically dim sum and sushi) in Vancouver or how far are they if one has to drive to Portland? Not much decent for food in Vancouver BUT,,, There is a reason for that. Folks in Vancouver are used to driving to PORTLAND (10 minutes) for their special meals. It is HIGHLY probable that a Portland location would provide SO MUCH MORE traffic to your store, the tax issues would be secondary. BUT MULTNOMAH county is NOT a good county to do business, and the competition is fierce for these restaurants. (Even in Clackamas and MORE-SO Washington County (Beaverton / Hillsboro)

5. How "liberal" are people in Vancouver, WA? And also how aggressive are the liberals in Portland? I normally don't care about political beliefs in the neighborhood as long as they don't impose their beliefs on others. WA is much easier to have your own views on politics (not that your vote will count... the population centers of the state run the elections, and the vast majority of political choices in ANY race are poor to very poor (now that it is a PAID position instead of volunteer (as originally founded...))

Thanks for your feedback!

Vancouver is pretty suburban, and retail / prepared food business climate is quite tough (due to WA sales tax, and the availability of GOOD culture and choices and NO SALES tax 10 minutes away).

I had several restaurant tenants go broke in my Camas commercial real estate. Very sad, they worked quite hard.


Get a rough idea and pencil out a small business plan including your projected expenses, capital needs, cashflows, and REQUIRED revenue to Break-Even. THEN Get an FREE appointment here:
Counseling With the SCORE Ft. Vancouver Chapter (http://www.scorevancouver.org/counseling/ - broken link)

[StealthRabbit]

Originally Posted by GoldenTiger

Have always wanted to own a small business.
Here are some of my questions with regards to Vancouver, WA:

1. How similar are people in Vancouver, WA and Portland, OR in terms of work attitude and professional outlook? From reading here, people said Portlanders have an "entitlement" attitude, (e.g. employees not showing up at work then not even notifying their employers or apologizing when they finally show up). Is this really common? And is this the same in Vancouver? No, Vancouver is quite a bit more conservative in work ethic and attitudes. (but crummy workers seem to be prevalent in most every society)

2. Are schools in Camas, WA better than those in Beaverton, OR?
Bout the same, possibly a few more elective options in Beaverton, but for HS, Running Start in WA is tough to beat Academics - Running Start

3. Is Vancouver, WA cheaper or more expensive compared to the nicer and safer neighborhoods in Tacoma, WA? A bit cheaper than the NICE areas in Tacoma (generally Tacoma is a pretty rough place, NICE places bring a premium) Vancouver and Camas are largely upper middle-class, but nothing as rough as Tacoma

4. Are there authentic or at least decent Asian restaurants (specifically dim sum and sushi) in Vancouver or how far are they if one has to drive to Portland? Not much decent for food in Vancouver BUT,,, There is a reason for that. Folks in Vancouver are used to driving to PORTLAND (10 minutes) for their special meals. It is HIGHLY probable that a Portland location would provide SO MUCH MORE traffic to your store, the tax issues would be secondary. BUT MULTNOMAH county is NOT a good county to do business, and the competition is fierce for these restaurants. (Even in Clackamas and MORE-SO Washington County (Beaverton / Hillsboro)

5. How "liberal" are people in Vancouver, WA? And also how aggressive are the liberals in Portland? I normally don't care about political beliefs in the neighborhood as long as they don't impose their beliefs on others. WA is much easier to have your own views on politics (not that your vote will count... the population centers of the state run the elections, and the vast majority of political choices in ANY race are poor to very poor (now that it is a PAID position instead of volunteer (as originally founded...))

Thanks for your feedback!

Vancouver is pretty suburban, and retail / prepared food business climate is quite tough (due to WA sales tax, and the availability of GOOD culture and choices and NO SALES tax 10 minutes away).

I had several restaurant tenants go broke in my Camas commercial real estate. Very sad, they worked quite hard.


Get a rough idea and pencil out a small business plan including your projected expenses, capital needs, cashflows, and REQUIRED revenue to Break-Even. THEN Get an FREE appointment here:
Counseling With the SCORE Ft. Vancouver Chapter (http://www.scorevancouver.org/counseling/ - broken link)

[StealthRabbit]

Originally Posted by GoldenTiger

... decent Asian restaurants (specifically dim sum and sushi) in Vancouver or how far are they if one has to drive to Portland?

some last minute inputs

The business climate is on the road to change in Vancouver area (Mainly Salmon Creek and East Camas / Washougal) More upscale retail / food places are surviving and more 'anchor/big name' stores coming to Vancouver.
Warning this is a SLOW transition, made SLOWER by high unemployment in the region. Thus the market MAY be there for your specialties, but it will be a tough business climate. It would be far better to work in several Portland / Vancouver places and identify the barriers to entry in this business. BE SURE to sit outside a commerce area and COUNT the potential customers in your desired location (Hint, you have to sell A LOT of Dim Sum and Sushi to pay a $6,000 / month lease + utilities, and recover $50k to outfit a restaurant. Then add; supplies, labor, WA L&I, B&O, Unemployment and Use Taxes, Insurance, overhead (mgmt, bookkeeper, lawyer, accountant, ...) (peaking from an ex-Asia resident who REALLY misses the food stalls, and feeding the whole family good fresh food for $4)

Washougal is very much an untapped market with lots of new residents and few eateries. Camas is to proud to realize Washougal IS their clientele. Most of Camas residents do not go to downtown Camas. ALL of Washougal residents MUST drive by Camas to get to Vancouver or Portland. I Don't feel there is enough clientele in that region to support (specifically dim sum and sushi)

Now if someone would make a NICE Roach Coach + Event catering business + EZ take-out / set meal delivery with HEALTHY and authentic Asian food (Not the salty, starchy, bland stuff that is American Asian) There COULD be a potential business without the hassle and expense of a brick and mortar 20hr / day / 7 days / week restaurant.

Food ingredients and availability is quite affordable and of good quality in PDX metro area.

If you want an area that has a very strong economy in WA, look to Richland or Kennewick. You might have an open market out there (and it is a nice place to live).

[GoldenTiger]

Originally Posted by StealthRabbit

some last minute inputs

The business climate is on the road to change in Vancouver area (Mainly Salmon Creek and East Camas / Washougal) More upscale retail / food places are surviving and more 'anchor/big name' stores coming to Vancouver.
Warning this is a SLOW transition, made SLOWER by high unemployment in the region. Thus the market MAY be there for your specialties, but it will be a tough business climate. It would be far better to work in several Portland / Vancouver places and identify the barriers to entry in this business. BE SURE to sit outside a commerce area and COUNT the potential customers in your desired location (Hint, you have to sell A LOT of Dim Sum and Sushi to pay a $6,000 / month lease + utilities, and recover $50k to outfit a restaurant. Then add; supplies, labor, WA L&I, B&O, Unemployment and Use Taxes, Insurance, overhead (mgmt, bookkeeper, lawyer, accountant, ...) (peaking from an ex-Asia resident who REALLY misses the food stalls, and feeding the whole family good fresh food for $4)

Washougal is very much an untapped market with lots of new residents and few eateries. Camas is to proud to realize Washougal IS their clientele. Most of Camas residents do not go to downtown Camas. ALL of Washougal residents MUST drive by Camas to get to Vancouver or Portland. I Don't feel there is enough clientele in that region to support (specifically dim sum and sushi)

Now if someone would make a NICE Roach Coach + Event catering business + EZ take-out / set meal delivery with HEALTHY and authentic Asian food (Not the salty, starchy, bland stuff that is American Asian) There COULD be a potential business without the hassle and expense of a brick and mortar 20hr / day / 7 days / week restaurant.

Food ingredients and availability is quite affordable and of good quality in PDX metro area.

If you want an area that has a very strong economy in WA, look to Richland or Kennewick. You might have an open market out there (and it is a nice place to live).

I really appreciate your feedback. Thank you very much.
Sorry that I did not specify clearly. I am actually thinking of opening an online business that may need a small warehouse/shipping office. I will surely try to write down the plan and see how feasible it may be. The dim sum or sushi restaurant is a need for our Asian family, who would like to patronize such local businesses if we move there :-) but at least it's nice to know that it's readily available, although we may need to cross the river.

[Inkpoe]

While PDX has great Asian food stands, generally Asian food are much better in Seattle area.

Tacoma and Vancouver are so different in many ways they can't really be compared. Tacoma is constantly revitalizing. Tacoma has more urbanity, older architecture, a true DT area, its own zoo/aquarium, its own port, et. c. It does have rough areas which are easy to point out and avoid. Tacoma is not a "bedroom community", even though it does serve that purpose (because its cheaper than Seattle).

I would think that Tacoma would be more pricer than Vancouver. The real estate in Vancouver fallen more steeply and its heavy reliance on Portland has made its own economy a bit more shaky. My BIL brought a house for 360K during the boom, the house next to him gone into foreclosure and sold for 140K which is a lot more realistic and reasonable for the area.