[vermonter16]

So, we are in the process of having a home built and also getting a construction loan and the bank told us they would not finance geothermal which is a huge bummer. So, I'm asking you folks a question. I haven't lived in Vermont for several years so I don't know what heating bills are like. What I do know is that during a cold winter it can be a lot and electricity can be expensive. What, in your experiences would you suggest for heating that is efficient? Find another way to finance the geothermal or pay out of pocket....or find another way to heat? Any thoughts? I'm floored and apparently didn't do enough research ahead of time. I thought baks liked green energy and now after perusing the Internet....well, I think they hate it. Our home will be pretty energy efficient and with a SIPS roof, a masonry heater (bank has never heard of that before but they didn't deny it) and radiant heating....with no way to heat right now.

[Logs and Dogs]

Lots of Sex or Wood heat......thsoe are the two most efficient and cost effective I have seen where we are.

Make sure your house is situated on the lot so you take advantage of passive solar etc.

[jenny1951]

Have you considered a wood or pellet stove? If I was building, and had to choose between oil, gas, electric and wood, I would go with wood or pellets. Pellet stoves seem to be gaining in popularity. Remember, you won't find natural gas up here. I always heard electric was the worst, but it seems like I read it may not be as bad as oil, what with oil prices the way they are now. I don't know about that. My house is a little thing (750 sq ft) and it is heated with oil. I use about 200 gallons a year. I also have a direct-vent gas stove in the living room in case the power goes out. It does an awesome job of heating the entire first floor but it ain't cheap. It is one of those cute Jotul stoves that looks like a wood stove, but it isn't as efficient as a Rinnai or something of that nature. I use it this time of year, when I need to get the chill out of the living room but don't want to run the furnace.

[harpoonalt]

I wanted to do Geothermal when we built our house 6 years ago, but couldn't find anyone who actually had experience with it. We built our house with max insulation, air sealing everything, and used the best windows and doors we could. We use about 900 gals of oil in a 2900 sq ft house with the heat set at 68 and left there. We have a Buderus boiler with BBHW so this is a years heat and hot water. We considered radiant but we sometimes have guests and wanted to be able to bring our upstairs heat up quickly. We also compromised on the heat so we could do central air. We agonized over the air but I'm very glad we put it in.
Our neighbor is a plumber and has a pellet boiler that he swears by. Depends on how much you want to be hands on with your heat. As I get older the allure of adding more chores to my day has lessened quite a bit.
It would be worth your while to pursue. The geothermal. I would ask to see an actual system and get real operating numbers. A friend who spent 30 grand on a solar wished he had. Let us know how you make out.

[joe moving]

when you say radiant, do you mean hot water radiators... hot water radiant floor heat or ? is the question how to heat the water for the radiators,?

I would probably look at a propane boiler to go with your masonry heater. They should be nearly 100% efficient these days. I know at least 94% efficient, but haven't looked hard.

i dont know much about SIPs but are you using those for the sides of the home as well as the roof, or is it stick construction, and if so are they doing spray foam insulation ? That seems to be THE big thing with insulation and air infiltration. they fill every tiny little air gap which i think is a big thing, and can do about R33 in a 5.5" (2x6).

you might want to talk to a home performance contractor or someone at efficiency vermont?

Home Performance with ENERGY STAR Overview

here is a doc that talks about costs of various fuels, and cost per MM BTU, however they put 80% efficiency for oil and gas. Where as gas is closer to 95% at this point., still it shows that wood and pellets are much cheaper, but of course require a lot more work.

http://publicservice.vermont.gov/pub/fuel-price-report/11Dec.pdf (broken link)
http://publicservice.vermont.gov/pub...ce-report.html

[Logs and Dogs]

We heat our place with propane hot water base boards and primarily with the wood stove.....the propane is only used when we aren't there to keep the place at 48 degree min; when we have the stove running we are a a nice 68-75 in there.

Wood is cheap for us.

Three friends of ours have swapped out their pellet stoves for wood stoves in the past year and a half. Pellets are a commodity and subject to supply and demand more than cord wood is in VT (yes cord wood is subject to S&D too) but there seems to be more supply. Plus when you lose electricity, you lose many pellet stoves and boilers. Pellets are $220+ per ton.......how many pellets would you burn vs. cord wood?

Sure wood takes some manual labor, but most people in VT aren't afraid of some work.

[vermonter16]

I knew you guys would be a wealth of information!

Logs and Dogs - sex and wood, lol!

We actually plan on heating the house with a masonry heater (russian fireplace) for the most part. The geothermal was for the radiant floors in the basement and on the second floor. We weren't going to have anything on the first. I keep my house at 60 in the winters here in VA and it still runs $300+ a month and the winters are mild. Talk about being completely inefficient.

Our home is a 32x40 handcrafted log cabin. I wish I had a picture I could link to. Here is a link to a picture that is similar but not quite the same. Photos | Mountain Logworks, LLC It is I think the first full house you see with the dog house dormers on either side. Same builder, our logs are a bit bigger though.

We saved for years to build this and still didn't/don't have enough. I may have to send my husband up to live in it while I stay down here and work unless I miraculously get a job in the NE Kingdom. I was going to apply for a correctional officer position but I see that after almost a year of advertising in the Chronicle, the ads recently stopped. Bummer. I'll still apply though.

joe moving - I'll have my husband check out your links and talk to someone. Really good idea!

No air conditioning for us. I hate it. I hate to be hot too...so, yeah - I want my cake and I want to eat it as well... If anything we'll put a window unit in upstairs. Again, our stinkin' townhouse here in VA eats up another $300+ a month to cool and our air temp upstairs remains pretty much in the 80s until night falls and then it goes to the upper 70s... Sheesh.

[arctichomesteader]

The ad will probably be back before you know it. Check the state jobs web page to see what's available regularly. They're constantly hiring corrections officers. High burnout rate I guess, and quite a few nearing retirement.

[vermonter16]

Thanks arctichomesteader. I'll do anything for steady work and when I say that I mean it. You give me hope!

[j_jimerino]

If you were going to mainly heat with the masonry heater I don't think I'd put in the geothermal. I've never even been in a house with geothermal but I know the cost is massive. I'd think you'd want it to be your main heat source.

I know that without a conventional boiler or furnace that requires no intervention to run my home owners insurance would be much more expensive or maybe they wouldn't written the policy at all due to freezing pipe concerns. Maybe the mortgage company has similar (although I think misplaced) concerns about the geothermal system.

If you live in town there are places with natural gas, but its very unlikely in a rural area. Natural gas seems to be almost as cheap as cord wood (purchased) but is zero work.