******Gaithersburg Development Thread****** (school district, tax, price)

[MDAllstar]

Originally Posted by btsilver

So do you think the BRT was a better idea than LRT? Also I assume they are dumping all these people eventually at shady grove right? What overall impact and stress do you think that will add to the metro system that is already having issue operating at its current "efficiency".

Oh what would make it more convient to travel with out a car is having an "express" track and a local track. Otherwise, it would be just like sitting in traffic except you would be sitting there sharing the same intimate space with about 100 other people.

Obviously I would prefer light rail but Montgomery County is building a system. I believe the right mode is BRT based on the size of the system as well as the connections a long the system. Most of Montgomery Counties system will be grade separated which makes it way faster than car travel at rush hour. The way the BRT network operates will be similar to Metro. BRT doesn't stop that frequent. It stops every couple blocks like light rail does. This system will completely change how the corridor cities operate.

[btsilver]

It still dumps everybody at shady grove. Is metro planning to quadruple the trains running from that station?

[MDAllstar]

Originally Posted by btsilver

It still dumps everybody at shady grove. Is metro planning to quadruple the trains running from that station?

No, people taking the CCT will mainly be going to jobs in Gaithersburg. The CCT is going to be used mainly for people working in the 52,000 jobs coming to Gaithersburg's Science City. Also jobs at NIST and jobs coming to Kentland's Downtown. It is going to take 30 minutes to go from Metropolitan Grove/Watkins Mills Town Center in Gaithersburg to Shady Grove Metro Station on the CCT. It is going to take 49 minutes to get to shady grove station from Clarksburg on the CCT. The grade separated BRT line on 355 to shady grove metro station will be less than half that time so people will use that line to get to shady grove metro station instead of the CCT. The CCT will actually be used way more for people reverse commuting to Gaithersburg from the region on Metro. The CCT is for travel in and around Gaithersburg's west side as it densifies and traffic comes to a stand still. Traffic is always slow in cities. The difficulty will be that people used to seeing Gaithersburg as a low density suburb will have trouble realizing the city is headed for a density over 9,000 people per square mile which is higher than Arlington Virginia and right behind Washington D.C.

The BRT system is needed to pull major ridership from the redline for trips ending in Montgomery County. Many people will switch to the BRT system to get to Rockville, Twinbrook, White Flint, Silver Spring, and Bethesda. Metro ridership is going to continue to climb and the only way our region will be able to handle the increased density is to come up with more transit options. It is all notated here in the WMATA plans.


Moco BRT Network and DC Streetcar Network will give metro system relief:
http://planitmetro.com/wp-content/up...07_Meeting.pdf


Now keep in mind, there will be way more ridership for metro in the future through transit oriented development systemwide but increases in ridership will be driven by people walking to the station from future development around stations. Increases in ridership in the future will not be driven by people living outside a half mile radius of metro station's.


The CCT BRT line's ridership will mainly be people headed to Gaithersburg's Science City and Kentland's Downtown which have been on hold because they can't be built until the CCT is built:

Gaithersburg Science City



Gaithersburg's Kentlands Downtown

[btsilver]

49 minutes? 30 minutes? LOL. That is going to suck. Considering they are building a city much, much denser than it already is, and assuming that the people working these jobs are going to be living in the actual city that already has a high cost of living, it appears they are not taking into account the people who are going to be working in the city that can't necessarily afford to live in the city traveling there. You know kind of like the problem across the entire DMV. Otherwise everyone with decent to good Jobs would be living in DC, Arlington, or some ridiculous costing place like that. I think what is missing here is the reality of the situation of where people are going to live and going to work. I mean do you assume that the people that will be working in the 52,000 jobs (I'm going to just assume these are high paying jobs like 75K and up) are going to want to live in "dense" communities and be happy paying 600K for a one bedroom condo? All i got from that pdf is severe impact to capacity by 2040. After looking at the "data" it seems to me that they are building up the area with a sucky transportation plan. I like looking at the bigger picture which is the entire area and I know that most people do not have the luxury of living within a brisk walk and a stop away from work.

[MDAllstar]

Originally Posted by btsilver

49 minutes? 30 minutes? LOL. That is going to suck. Considering they are building a city much, much denser than it already is, and assuming that the people working these jobs are going to be living in the actual city that already has a high cost of living, it appears they are not taking into account the people who are going to be working in the city that can't necessarily afford to live in the city traveling there. You know kind of like the problem across the entire DMV. Otherwise everyone with decent to good Jobs would be living in DC, Arlington, or some ridiculous costing place like that. I think what is missing here is the reality of the situation of where people are going to live and going to work. I mean do you assume that the people that will be working in the 52,000 jobs (I'm going to just assume these are high paying jobs like 75K and up) are going to want to live in "dense" communities and be happy paying 600K for a one bedroom condo? All i got from that pdf is severe impact to capacity by 2040. After looking at the "data" it seems to me that they are building up the area with a sucky transportation plan. I like looking at the bigger picture which is the entire area and I know that most people do not have the luxury of living within a brisk walk and a stop away from work.

The CCT is not being built to funnel people into DC but rather into Gaithersburg. The population in Gaithersburg will be getting younger and younger just as DC's population is getting younger. Families will have the option to move out to the low density suburbs in Clarksburg, Olney, and Germantown. Gaithersburg, Rockville, North Bethesda, and Bethesda will be urban dense environments with high non-auto commuting. These area's are going to absorb the future growth in the area. People who want low density lifestyles will not be able to live in the corridor cities. When it comes to affordable housing, MPDU is the only answer to that. Increased density always leads to high prices. High ammenties always leads to higher prices. It's like this all over the world. Gaithersburg is only 10.2 sq miles. There is always going to be plenty of low density housing outside city limits in North Potomac as well as Montgomery Village. Infact, Montgomery Village and Germantown will probably be the feeder areas of the Gentrification sweeping Gaithersburg.

[btsilver]

Originally Posted by MDAllstar

The CCT is not being built to funnel people into DC but rather into Gaithersburg. The population in Gaithersburg will be getting younger and younger just as DC's population is getting younger. Families will have the option to move out to the low density suburbs in Clarksburg, Olney, and Germantown. Gaithersburg, Rockville, North Bethesda, and Bethesda will be urban dense environments with high non-auto commuting. These area's are going to absorb the future growth in the area. People who want low density lifestyles will not be able to live in the corridor cities. When it comes to affordable housing, MPDU is the only answer to that. Increased density always leads to high prices. High ammenties always leads to higher prices. It's like this all over the world. Gaithersburg is only 10.2 sq miles. There is always going to be plenty of low density housing outside city limits in North Potomac as well as Montgomery Village. Infact, Montgomery Village and Germantown will probably be the feeder areas of the Gentrification sweeping Gaithersburg.

Well I guess we will see how people use the system. Whether for its intended purpose or for what they want to use it for.

[MDAllstar]

Originally Posted by btsilver

Well I guess we will see how people use the system. Whether for its intended purpose or for what they want to use it for.

I'm confused as to what you mean. There are going to be 4 different lines around Gaithersburg. It will be faster to take the 355 BRT line than the CCT BRT line to shady grove station. Why would people take a line to shady grove station that takes double the time? The area's being redeveloped is extensive around Gaithersburg. When density increases and transportation options increase while limiting parking, people switch modes. This is what always happens. I know it's hard to imagine a reality that is not here yet but vision is the only way you will understand what is happening. An environment like this is going to attract residents that "choose" to walk, bike, and take rapid mass transit to get around.

[btsilver]

Originally Posted by MDAllstar

I'm confused as to what you mean. There are going to be 4 different lines around Gaithersburg. It will be faster to take the 355 BRT line than the CCT BRT line to shady grove station. Why would people take a line to shady grove station that takes double the time? The area's being redeveloped is extensive around Gaithersburg. When density increases and transportation options increase while limiting parking, people switch modes. This is what always happens. I know it's hard to imagine a reality that is not here yet but vision is the only way you will understand what is happening. An environment like this is going to attract residents that "choose" to walk, bike, and take rapid mass transit to get around.

See, that's the problem. The area is going to attract residents that need to work, not neccessarily ones the like to bike, walk, and use rapid mass transit. You seem real excited for this and I welcome the changes but I am skeptical due to the actual existing failures of plan communities in the DMV when it comes to transportation.

[MDAllstar]

Originally Posted by btsilver

See, that's the problem. The area is going to attract residents that need to work, not neccessarily ones the like to bike, walk, and use rapid mass transit. You seem real excited for this and I welcome the changes but I am skeptical due to the actual existing failures of plan communities in the DMV when it comes to transportation.

Well, I'm in the planning profession so it is a very exciting time as sprawling suburbs begin to densify and grow away from the car centric past. As for jobs, actually Gaithersburg is projected to have 205,901 jobs by 2030 with a population of 138,345 people by 2030. Gaithersburg will have plenty of residents working and living in city limits.

http://www.gaithersburgmd.gov/Docume...opt_040609.pdf

[btsilver]

Originally Posted by MDAllstar

Well, I'm in the planning profession so it is a very exciting time as sprawling suburbs begin to densify and grow away from the car centric past. As for jobs, actually Gaithersburg is projected to have 205,901 jobs by 2030 with a population of 138,345 people by 2030. Gaithersburg will have plenty of residents working and living in city limits.

http://www.gaithersburgmd.gov/Docume...opt_040609.pdf

Do you plan for maryland?