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The problem is that our tax revenues is primarily based on residential taxes. In general, the net from residential taxes is much lower than commercial because the public services provided to residents is higher than those required of commercial businesses (e.g. a commercial business doesn't go to the hospital or need an education). That is why there is such a push for more businesses because having a stronger base will yield a higher contribution to the county's operating revenues. Unfortunately in this society money is the driver for improved public services. So unless we are speaking about non-monetary elements that would contribute to a higher quality of life, money is necessary to build new roads, alternatives forms of public, transportation, better schools etc. If we are talking about non-monetary elements that contribute to the quality of life that could be a very long discussion. In short, those elements don't require money just a stronger commitment of the individual and the community in which they live. Now can money alone improve a community? Absolutely not. That would take an active partnership to make those improvements occur. That is where we have a deficit in PG. PG's issues are many and complex but, in my opinion, public involvement (on all levels) will go a long way in us becoming a better place to live
I agree with you that the commercial tax base is a major problem, but without improving the quality of life, that is hard to see happen. I think that is something perhaps Baker is finding out. He is trying to expand the commercial tax base in the hopes that it will bring money, and in turn bring in better services. I honestly don't think this will work. I think the problem he is running into is that many businesses and the federal government for that matter are avoiding PG because of the issues with the quality of life. In other words, I believe the quality of life should be fixed before trying to attract a wider commercial tax base. Easier said than done, I know but that is where we are at. What comes first quality of life or commercial tax base?
Let me put it like this. I work for the Federal Government in Suitland and we have a huge turnover rate for our jobs. When you look at the location of some of our workers, we have people who live as far as Delaware, Baltimore, Fredericksburg, Chantilly, Centreville, and even Manassas. Why would people who work in Suitland want to live that far away? For most it is the perception that PG has. I'm certain that the GSA notice that and they unfairly keep government agencies out of PG, but to them, they realize the horrible work life balance that workers have. I mean who would want to have a work force where a majority of the people would choose to live an hour away from their job, in this area? That's why I believe it's just going to be hard to expand that tax base. This county needs to become more attractive for people to want to come here. Is a casino going to fix that problem? Don't know if it will. It's a gamble so to speak. I mean there is no guarantee that a casino is going to magically bring jobs. And even if it did, we may not see the improvement from casinos for at least another decade.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UrbanScholar
It is very honorable that you volunteer at a school. We need more people will to mentor inside and outside of school to help students move to the next level. I agree that there is a lot of mismanagement in our school system as well as displaced priorities in the U.S. educational system (e.g. standardized testing and their impact on true education). Those are things that communities and organizations like an active PTA can make a difference. The problem is that a lot of parents today just check the box in child rearing and would rather be friends than parents to their kids.
I definitely empathize with you on how to inspire parents but really for us to have to posit this question is insane. These are their children. That should be the incentive. I know that the fact that these children are theirs may not be enough but wow, really.
Thank you. I grew up here in this county and I believe I had a much easier life than many have right now. I was fortunate to have both of my parents in my life and I grew up in a nice place. I have seen a lot of the young boys in this county go in the wrong direction because they are being told that they can't but I believe people like me can give them a reason to believe that they can do well. That's what someone did for me.
To sit here and to think that we have to convince parents that they should be involved, just as you said, is mind blogging. I know this is getting a bit off topic, but I will say that in the experience I've had very little is done. The administration is overwhelmed! In the mentoring program that we have with the school, we requested that the students have their parent sign a form just stating that they were aware that their child was in the program. I talked to a few mentees including my own and none of them had even given it to their parents. I was thinking, why didn't the school follow up and make sure that those forms were sent!!! Too many issues, to take care of the small, yet important details. I digress.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UrbanScholar
We are going way off topic on the original topic but I appreciate your perspective. At the end of the day, in my opinion we do need a more diverse tax portfolio so the burden won't rest completely on county residents. We also need for citizens of PG to hold its elected officials accountable every day for every action and not just during an election cycle.
I appreciate yours as well as well as adelphi_sky and others. I know we may not always agree on the things that go on in this county, but I think we can all agree that we are passionate about this county getting better. We may disagree about this casino issue but overall, we just want to see this county get better. What is the best? I don't think there is one, but we will all have our opinions.
And holding our elected officials accountable is probably the number 1 reason why we are having this conversation. Electing people just because they have the most posters or because they look professional on a picture is sad, but that's what people do. Are the elected officials really exhausting every avenue to avoid this? I don't think so. I hear people like Patterson and Muse opposing this, but as elected officials, I would like to hear some solutions from them as well. Complaining only gets so far...
Rather than try to bring in corporations with little to offer, Prince Georges needs to focus on quality of life. Even if Prince Georges did manage to bring in the multi-million corporations, is that going to improve the schools or its negative reputation?
The county needs to get rid of the dead weight, figure out what works and what doesn't and make better decisions.
Anti-PG folx always throw in the "Poor Schools", "Crime", and "Negative Reputation" to Derail the main focus on Increasing Business/Economic/Revenue Growth for the County/State......
I agree with you that the commercial tax base is a major problem, but without improving the quality of life, that is hard to see happen. I think that is something perhaps Baker is finding out. He is trying to expand the commercial tax base in the hopes that it will bring money, and in turn bring in better services. I honestly don't think this will work. I think the problem he is running into is that many businesses and the federal government for that matter are avoiding PG because of the issues with the quality of life. In other words, I believe the quality of life should be fixed before trying to attract a wider commercial tax base. Easier said than done, I know but that is where we are at. What comes first quality of life or commercial tax base?
I agree that quality of life is a major issue for the county and Baker has an uphill battle considering our recent political history. That said, I don't know if we have the latitude to work on these issues serially. Although expanding the corporate/government presence should lag behind QOL efforts, there still needs to be a concerted push to recruiting business. What could that entail. Developing a really strong plan to guide the county over the next 5 to 10 years, continue to lobby businesses and media to showcase the positives of the county, implement policies that are business friendly (from start-ups to conglomerates), improve the school systems by any means necessary, and improve public services to ensure that they are on par with other jurisdictions.
Let me put it like this. I work for the Federal Government in Suitland and we have a huge turnover rate for our jobs. When you look at the location of some of our workers, we have people who live as far as Delaware, Baltimore, Fredericksburg, Chantilly, Centreville, and even Manassas. Why would people who work in Suitland want to live that far away? For most it is the perception that PG has. I'm certain that the GSA notice that and they unfairly keep government agencies out of PG, but to them, they realize the horrible work life balance that workers have. I mean who would want to have a work force where a majority of the people would choose to live an hour away from their job, in this area? That's why I believe it's just going to be hard to expand that tax base. This county needs to become more attractive for people to want to come here. Is a casino going to fix that problem? Don't know if it will. It's a gamble so to speak. I mean there is no guarantee that a casino is going to magically bring jobs. And even if it did, we may not see the improvement from casinos for at least another decade.
That is a shame that people would rather drive an hour + than move to PG. That should be a wake-up call to the county that they need to aggressively promote the positives of the county but more importantly create true livable communities. Especially around major employment districts like the federal center in Suitland (Greenbelt and New Carollton as well).I don't know if a casino will aid in fixing the problem but I am open to see what it can do. I think at the very least it could provide job opportunities for those currently unemployed or underemployed (unfortunately not everyone can make over the median income). And you're right nothing done today will have an immediate impact. It may take 5 to 10 years to really see a change. But would it be to our benefit to at least aggressively making strategic changes to improve the county. And at the end of the day if a strategy does not work then we remove it from the plan.
Thank you. I grew up here in this county and I believe I had a much easier life than many have right now. I was fortunate to have both of my parents in my life and I grew up in a nice place. I have seen a lot of the young boys in this county go in the wrong direction because they are being told that they can't but I believe people like me can give them a reason to believe that they can do well. That's what someone did for me.
You're welcome. I didn't grow up here but the area that I grew up had very similar problem that PGC has except we did not have the moniker of affluency. But similar to you I was fortunate to have both parents and a huge extended family to help along the way. The problems with young men, especially minority, has always been a challenge but it is especially dire today. We could probably write a dissertation of all of the systematic, social, and political issue that plague the group but one thing that helps is providing them with role models.
To sit here and to think that we have to convince parents that they should be involved, just as you said, is mind blogging. I know this is getting a bit off topic, but I will say that in the experience I've had very little is done. The administration is overwhelmed! In the mentoring program that we have with the school, we requested that the students have their parent sign a form just stating that they were aware that their child was in the program. I talked to a few mentees including my own and none of them had even given it to their parents. I was thinking, why didn't the school follow up and make sure that those forms were sent!!! Too many issues, to take care of the small, yet important details. I digress.
Understood but that is a real example of why educational reform is necessary.
I appreciate yours as well as well as adelphi_sky and others. I know we may not always agree on the things that go on in this county, but I think we can all agree that we are passionate about this county getting better. We may disagree about this casino issue but overall, we just want to see this county get better. What is the best? I don't think there is one, but we will all have our opinions.
True, there is definitely a lot of passion from those wanting the best for the county. But similar to MLK jr. and Malcolm X, it takes many viewpoints to get to the end of the race.
And holding our elected officials accountable is probably the number 1 reason why we are having this conversation. Electing people just because they have the most posters or because they look professional on a picture is sad, but that's what people do. Are the elected officials really exhausting every avenue to avoid this? I don't think so. I hear people like Patterson and Muse opposing this, but as elected officials, I would like to hear some solutions from them as well. Complaining only gets so far...
I read an article on Rosecroft this evening. In it they stated their position on Baker's endorsement and also stated that, without gaming, they will not be able to survive (Owners: Rosecroft Raceway would close without slots | Washington Examiner). This got me to thinking. Will slots really actually save Rosecroft as a horse racing site or just prolong the inevitable? If awarded a license will they actually morph into a casino that has occasional horse races? Given the the overarching thought of this thread that casino gambling should not be looked at as a golden ticket. Should Rosecroft look at it from that perspective. Since casinos in PG is a long shot is it probable that Rosecroft will not survive? What other contingencies do they have in place if a PG Casino is not approved? If it closes what is next for the property?
I read an article on Rosecroft this evening. In it they stated their position on Baker's endorsement and also stated that, without gaming, they will not be able to survive (Owners: Rosecroft Raceway would close without slots | Washington Examiner). This got me to thinking. Will slots really actually save Rosecroft as a horse racing site or just prolong the inevitable? If awarded a license will they actually morph into a casino that has occasional horse races? Given the the overarching thought of this thread that casino gambling should not be looked at as a golden ticket. Should Rosecroft look at it from that perspective. Since casinos in PG is a long shot is it probable that Rosecroft will not survive? What other contingencies do they have in place if a PG Casino is not approved? If it closes what is next for the property?
Sounds like they are playing politics if you ask me. I'm sure they had every intention of having a casino there, but it's not like they can't come up with something else to make it a viable and auspicious development. I've heard some people suggest to them to make it a kids themed destination, perhaps by having games and rides. I would think that would probably be a good market for them. At this point, without politically backing, they don't stand much of a chance if they try to have some slots there. They need to go to plan B, which I'm assuming that's what they would try to do.
Rather than try to bring in corporations with little to offer, Prince Georges needs to focus on quality of life. Even if Prince Georges did manage to bring in the multi-million corporations, is that going to improve the schools or its negative reputation?
The county needs to get rid of the dead weight, figure out what works and what doesn't and make better decisions.
The "dead weight" is, residential homes not worthless corporations.
Take a second to think about that.
A home bring in ~3-5K per year in taxes, but you have to have:
- Schools
- Roads
- Trash Service
- Police/Firefighter
- etc.
A Corporation can bring in billions per year in taxes, and needs none of those services (many corporations in campuses are responsible for constructing local roads, and contributing to road funds)
They hire people, raise incomes, and the people that work there pay for Police, Firefighter etc.
The dead weight are homes, they consume more than they pay taxes for (generally).
The "dead weight" is, residential homes not worthless corporations.
Take a second to think about that.
A home bring in ~3-5K per year in taxes, but you have to have:
- Schools
- Roads
- Trash Service
- Police/Firefighter
- etc.
A Corporation can bring in billions per year in taxes, and needs none of those services (many corporations in campuses are responsible for constructing local roads, and contributing to road funds)
They hire people, raise incomes, and the people that work there pay for Police, Firefighter etc.
The dead weight are homes, they consume more than they pay taxes for (generally).
Fair point, but my question for you and others would be, then why does this county continue to build more housing developments? We are seeing new housing development pop up all the time. Wouldn't it make more sense to hold off on them given what you have said and also given the high foreclosure rate (aka a glut of vacant, unoccupied homes)? I definitely understand your point, but I wonder is that the logic that the administration is thinking with.
Fair point, but my question for you and others would be, then why does this county continue to build more housing developments? We are seeing new housing development pop up all the time. Wouldn't it make more sense to hold off on them given what you have said and also given the high foreclosure rate (aka a glut of vacant, unoccupied homes)? I definitely understand your point, but I wonder is that the logic that the administration is thinking with.
I agree with both of you. My answer to your first question is yes, it would. The answer to the second question is probably not. The county apparently will take what it can get, and housing the is only thing smoking right now. As long as you have people who keep wanting to the brand-new houses, PG will keep building them. Not that there is anything wrong with wanting a new house or even a large one; we just need to balance things out. If we don't want to be just a bedroom community, then we need to stop building so many bedrooms, lol.
The bad thing is, from what I am seeing, developers and builders can design less-than-aesthetic communities, with crappy, odd-looking facades (brick only around the garage door and nowhere else? a sliding glass back door opening into an basement stairwell? really?). And that is apparently okay with the county and MNCPPC.
The "dead weight" is, residential homes not worthless corporations.
Take a second to think about that.
A home bring in ~3-5K per year in taxes, but you have to have:
- Schools
- Roads
- Trash Service
- Police/Firefighter
- etc.
A Corporation can bring in billions per year in taxes, and needs none of those services (many corporations in campuses are responsible for constructing local roads, and contributing to road funds)
They hire people, raise incomes, and the people that work there pay for Police, Firefighter etc.
The dead weight are homes, they consume more than they pay taxes for (generally).
A corporation would not bring in billions, just millions, and that would almost be a stretch. Think more like 20 or 30 million at the high end. What corporation in the country do you know pays billions in taxes per year? Especially when the biggest corporations have an effective tax rate of 0. Think GE and Verizon.
Second, businesses DO actually need the fire department, police, trash services, roads, etc.
Third, campuses may contribute SOME funds to local roads, but who maintains them? Who plows the snow? Fills the potholes?
I do believe we need more white-collar businesses. Residential property taxes just aren't enough.
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