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I don't think test scores are a fair reflection of the PG county schools. There are students who excel at the same schools others fail. The achievers and non-achieving are getting the same instruction. Its the students who are failing themselves. You have to want to learn and many students as they get older would rather not apply themselves to school every day. Too often I see school-age children wandering the streets during school hours. This is reflected in the scores--the higher the grade level, the lower the scores. A 3rd grader is still bright-eyed and bushy tailed and wants to learn. Middle school and up is harder for some and pressure, rebellion, or circumstances at home may play a role in the lower scores. My point is, honor roll students and D students are all sitting in the same class learning the same thing, so is it the schools fault or the student's fault that the scores are low?
You hit it on the head - the students are failing themselves.
Uh, that's the definition of a magnet program...only the best and brightest and those who have needs beyond what a regular HS can offer.
If other counties had the same priority or resources, they would do the same.
Where did I say differently? Just saying that it's unfair to presume that other schools in Fairfax may not be also excellent when trying to compare a synthetic HS to others that are not.
How's those statistics going that I sent you on the other schools?
MC supposedly is > PG, but within MC there are real issues from zipcode to zipcode. :
I would generally agree.
If you really examine the raw data of some of the MoCo schools you'd be shocked at how poorly performing many of them are, particularly in the 10th and 11th grade test scores and with regards to both their drop out and graduation rates.
There are obviously outstanding schools there but to make a blanket presumption that because there are some outstanding schools there that all are outstanding would be a mistake. The graduation rates at some of the MoCo schools is shockingly low and the drop out rates exceed even some of the worst of the PG County schools.....and that's an accomplishment.
Now, as I've asserted before, test scores are not singularly an indication of a school's quality but, since that seems to be the prevailing notion amongst many people, the facts of the test scores indicate that while there ARE many outstanding schools in MoCo, the school system as a whole does have some significant issues that they need to work out. If a school has outstanding passing rate, but low scores in the 10th and 11th grade with a graduation rate of around 88% one has to wonder what's going on there.
Now, that being said, many of the PG County Schools are nothing short of **** holes. They are dirty, loud and out of control. Having been in many school throughout the state, I believe that a well-ordered school that has a good environment is a better indicator of a given student's opportunity for learning than the microanalysis of test scores is.
Montgomery county schools are generally better than PG schools. I think most of us can agree. That doesn't mean that PG schools are terrible, they are just worse than the high standards of the MoCo schools. Most Silver Spring/Wheaton schools are similar to PG County schools. Bethesda, North Bethesda, and even some Rockville schools are just snobby and white, with some Asians. Since I don't live in PG, I can't give you and educated guess, but I can make an educated generalization. There are some good, and some bad. That's all I can say without making people from PG pissed off at my uneducated, stupid ideas.
Montgomery county schools are generally better than PG schools. Silver Spring and Wheaton schools are very similar to PG schools, except being more diverse. They do okay, kind of like PG schools. Western MoCo does Much better than eastern MoCo, but as you get north of Rockville, they merge into the same thing. I can't make educated guesses about PG schools, because I live in-and-love...MoCo. There is one thing that I can say about PG schools without pissing off anybody: PG schools are so so.
I got tired of folks on this forum saying Pg county schools system is the worst in Maryland. I got tired of folks saying how much better Montgomery county school system is compared to Pg county and the data just prove that Pg county and Montgomery county shcool system is on the same level. I hear on this forum Pg county school system sucks and its way behind Montgomery County, well I guess these figures prove Pg county school system and Montgomery school system are on the same level. Pg county have improve the schools for the better already. All Elementary schools in Pg county have Pre-K. The county have also hired more teachers,getting parents involved their children schools. I believe the county will be putting 3-5 million dollars into the school system this year alone.
Or that they would NEVER live in Prince Georges County.....or how (supposedly) Dangerous Prince Georges County is......or how corrupt the political system is here.....or, yeah, I'll say it....how "ghetto" the County is (....like the ENTIRE county). I get tired of reading it also.....but to each his/her own, I suppose.
Or that they would NEVER live in Prince Georges County.....or how (supposedly) Dangerous Prince Georges County is......or how corrupt the political system is here.....or, yeah, I'll say it....how "ghetto" the County is (....like the ENTIRE county). I get tired of reading it also.....but to each his/her own, I suppose.
Lmao I'd just remind you all that they said the same things about DC while they were secretly investing all of this money into the city. Stand firm don't believe the propaganda about PGC because I honestly believe that the big developers are eyeing the county next, especially inside the beltway near metro stations. Just wait and see!!!
I think its time to put an end to this once and for all. I have done my research and have notice that one test scores Pg county have high test scores then Montgomery county. I have numbers to prove it and website so all can see for themselves. This is not for people to post what they think about each county but to post facts. I want folks to understand that not all schools in Pg county an dlow test scores and not all schools in Montgoery county have high test scores. I am just tired of folks posting wrong information about something they know nothing about.
Below is 3rd grade Reading test results for 2007 Maryland State Assesment.
Here is the website:[url=http://www.mdreportcard.org/]2007 Maryland Report Card[/url]
Montgomery County 26.1 basic 58.8 Proficient 15.1 Advanced
Maryland State 20.2 basic 60.3 Proficient 19.5 Advanced This is the average test scores of the entire state of maryland.
Prince George county:
30.5 basic 59.2 Proficient 10.3 Advanced
It's silly to think that test scores are the be-all and end-all marker of what is a good vs. not so good school. For one thing, it is common knowledge that test scores are manipulated through a whole variety of ways and means because without high scores schools lose funding (another misguided idea courtesy of No Child Left Behind). Since, as they say, **** rolls downhill, this pressure is passed from the school board to the administration to the teachers, who end up doing nothing but teaching memorization of test questions. So if you really want to look at it all based on test scores, then yes, some PG schools DO have better parrots than others.
Culture is integral in a learning environment as well as any other. The fact is that the racial tension in PG County is and always has been so bad that it affects the school system in ways that surpass even the best attempts at curriculum delivery. Fortunately, I went to Roosevelt as a Science & Tech kid even though it was outside my district so that saved me in more ways than one. But so as to eliminate any assumptions that I am making blanket statements, allow me to provide you with specifics about what I am saying:
I lived for a short time in Capitol Heights and Kettering but grew up mostly in Lanham, PG County- in the infamous Whitfield Towne Apartments, known for having the highest violent crime rates in the whole PG district (until its famous reform project in '96, detailed here: [url]http://www.popcenter.org/library/awards/goldstein/1998/98-62.pdf[/url]). Nothing about DMV was worth anything in the 80s and 90s unless you just liked ducking bullets and sleeping with one eye open. I got the **** out in '95 the day after graduation and never looked back. Still amazed to have made it out alive, and grateful I didn't let DMV make me who I am. Along with what Khemistry says here, you really have to have grown up in PG County or at least been there awhile to have a real perspective on the county. Think of The Wire (aired on HBO 2002-2008). It is not an exaggeration to say the only difference between PG County inside and just south of the Beltway and The Wire is that the latter takes place in Baltimore City instead.
But here's about the school system, again as specifically as I can put it so that no one can think I am just making generalizations. Also, my own experience was awhile back, from all the news I have read/heard, it really hasn't gotten any better:
ABOUT THE RACISM: "Racism" is the sacred cow topic of the whole DC area. It makes it impossible to have a real dialogue or solve any problems. The anti-white racism in the whole DMV is insane. To the other posts in this thread, no one was "imagining" anything when they talk about bullying of whites in the school system. Not only did I experience it intensely, but the other 10 or 15 white kids that went to my schools got it too. The only thing that insulated us a tiny bit from the "G-pop" was that it was usually the white and Asian kids separated into the magnet programs while everybody else was, well, everybody else. You can get pissy I just said that but being a racial minority in PG County flat-out sucks, due to the blatant racism against whites that no one talks about since racism is so highly regarded as being a "whites discriminating against everyone else" situation. And as a white person there you don't get to have an opinion on a damn thing without getting jumped because everyone wants to pull the race card as their "get out of jail free" for whatever the bad behavior of the moment is.
One fun example of the racism is how on the very first day of 3rd grade when I tried to make friends with some other girls at lunch they refused to respond to me until I called them out. Then, they said "Our mothers don't let us talk to white people." And proceeded to put their arms around each other and sing We Shall Overcome. At me. So I wasn't "racist" (as the blacks of DMV love to claim white people all are) going in to PG County schools but the experiences of myself and so many other minority kids sure were enough to make a person racist if you didn't find the ability to sort it all out in your head at some point.
As to PG County schools, Bowie was still a "nice" (read: white) area at the time so Bowie had far less drama. My mom made us dress up to go in to Bowie because it was so much nicer than Lanham/Landover/Kettering/Capitol Heights/everywhere else. By the time I was a junior in high school though even Bowie H.S. was getting metal detectors and mandatory I.D. cards, along with Roosevelt which was considered pretty much the sainted high school of the county due to both it's Science & Tech program AND its nearly 50-50 racial balance. The quality of classes at most schools was dragged down by affirmative action initiatives making it "no longer required" for students of color to do any actual work in order to get passed from grade to grade. Thus the teachers- when they bothered teaching at all- were forced to teach to the lowest common denominator while everyone else sat on their ass learning nothing.
Here's what I DID learn though: the names and recognizable accomplishments of pretty much every black figure in history, since every day was Black History month and this is how we started the morning announcements. Oh, and every negro spiritual that ever was. Actually at Kettering Elementary we sang We Shall Overcome instead of even doing our nation's pledge of allegiance. And I can recognize any ten seconds of a MLK speech anywhere, anytime because I heard them over... and over... Not that any of these things were inherently negative. But in the context of creating black solidarity in an "us versus anyone else" fashion, being isolated and treated as a social and racial pariah characterized PG County schools for not just me but for all of the minority kids that were forcibly integrated via the lovely racket called the "Talented And Gifted" programs.
Racial discrimination in ANY form, no matter which race is doing it to which other race has to go, and the fact is that to this day in PG County it hasn't gone anywhere- and probably never will.
ABOUT SPECIFIC SCHOOLS: I can only speak from my own experience which was awhile ago- I graduated from Eleanor Roosevelt High School in Greenbelt back in 1995 and must say that getting into the Science & Technology program not only probably saved my life but my education as well. I was living in Kettering at the time and slated to go to Largo High School, which as a white minority in PG County would have been an even worse extension of the torment I already suffered in PG elementary and middle schools. It was definitely a more challenging and far better school- at least for me, since I got into the Science & Tech program- and the S & T kids were mostly white and Asian which minimized the racial drama to where it was no longer a daily distraction.
**However- In Greenbelt, between my eleventh and twelfth grade year alone I attended five funerals, all for kids under 18, all ERHS kids. Three of them were murdered. And this was at the best school in the state.**
For the pre-high school experience, this is my take on PG County:
Due to all the social problems of being the token white kid I went to three different elementary schools- first, Ardmore Elementary, then Kettering, then Woodmore. None were any better than the other. The racism extended through all of the staff, teachers, and administration so whenever I was tormented whether in the classroom, cafeteria, or at recess it was overlooked and at times blatantly supported and encouraged by the people who were in positions of authority. The violence was unprecedented. Fights in these schools weren't just a bit of weave-pulling and a couple of punches. Fights ended with kids being carried out on stretchers and into ambulances. I was constantly getting jumped by groups of kids almost daily, and then would be the one blamed because the kids that started the fight would all pull the race card and claim that I had said/done something discriminatory- when in fact, it was always the other way around.
The elementary school curriculum design was ridiculous. We had these combination classrooms where third and fourth graders, fifth and sixth graders, etc. were grouped together as 3/4, 5/6 classes and so on. The point was apparently to take the accelerated kids from the lower grade and pair them in a class with the kids whose performance in the grade above was underwhelming. It didn't do anything good for either group of kids and the classrooms were a mess of chaos and disruption All. The. Time.
Just before middle school we moved to Kettering in a townhouse complex off of Enterprise Road and SR 301 near Watkins Park. The suburbanization of the black middle class was starting to take effect, but it didn't make that neighborhood or area any better. Whenever said middle class moved out to PG County they brought all the same un-middle-class problems and mindset with them and what was a promising neighborhood for about five minutes was again filled with drug dealers and violence.
At Francis Scott Key middle school* in Capitol Heights (where I went after elementary), we could hear gunshots regularly in the surrounding neighborhood. I once witnessed one kid get brutally beaten down and kicked repeatedly against the concrete wall by eight kids until the kid was no longer moving or conscious. Apparently bussing me from Kettering to Capitol Heights was the county's brilliantly illogical plan for integrating the district, it never really made sense why they sent me over there. (*I think F.S. Key is gone now)
Needless to say, learning anything throughout elementary and middle school was flat-out impossible. The social structure, the violence and daily torment, and the lack of support from teachers and administrative staff created such a hostile environment that even the idea of learning anything was a joke. All of my energy was taken just trying to survive. Besides, the staff wasn't really interested in whether students learned anyway, they pretty much wanted to do as little as possible while still collecting their paychecks.
I left the Washington, DC area the day after I graduated high school and have never looked back since. The fact that A) I got out alive, B) Graduated, and C) Didn't get pregnant, join a gang, or become a sociopath is a miracle of proportions most reading this will never understand. You couldn't pay me any amount of money to set foot in PG County again, and to even think of raising kids there if you aren't black is a nightmare waiting to happen.
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