The Post’s View Galvanizing Prince George’s schools (Baltimore: renting, credit)

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by jayman1981

I know this is somewhat off topic, what exactly is so bad about the PG school system? I'm kind of oblivious as to the current issues. People say that PG is not the greatest system, but speaking as a product of the system I think I'm doing fine. Is it that it's not good compared to Fairfax, Mont and Howard counties or is it just that bad to where kids will fail in life? Just a question I've always had that no one can seem to answer.

My sister and I are products of PG schools as well and we are doing quite fine also as contributing citizens with college degrees.

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by North Beach Person

the "public" often doesn't know the square root of **** when officials are trying to make good decisions.

Perhaps that's a communication and transparency problem on the part of public officials? Why IS the public so clueless? Should they be? She we just trust that public officials MUST know what they are doing? Or should their be more public input as with developer hearings. I'll admit, I know little about how the ed board works. Are the sessions televised or at least somewhere online where the public can participate?

PS. I LOVE C-Span for that very reason. I think every jurisdiction, with how cheap technology is today, should have sessions viewable by the public. The PG Planning Board has this access.

[Khemistry]

Originally Posted by adelphi_sky

Perhaps that's a communication and transparency problem on the part of public officials? Why IS the public so clueless? Should they be? She we just trust that public officials MUST know what they are doing? Or should their be more public input as with developer hearings. I'll admit, I know little about how the ed board works. Are the sessions televised or at least somewhere online where the public can participate?

PS. I LOVE C-Span for that very reason. I think every jurisdiction, with how cheap technology is today, should have sessions viewable by the public. The PG Planning Board has this access.

I'm not sure if you mean "real time" participation, but PGCPS televises their BoE meetings on PGCPS cable channel which is only available to Prince George's County residents who have FiOS or Comcast. They also post the BoE meetings on their official YouTube channel, found here at the following link... Board of Education Meetings by PGCPS

I haven't read the OP's post and don't know what most of the commentary involves, here, but based on your comment I will say this brief tidbit: as someone who has extremely close tie to PGCPS and who knows many people who have "insider" knowledge... as much as people think they may know about how dismal and screwed up PGCPS is or can be, they really don't have a clue. PGCPS goes out of their way to hide a lot of things that would have parents in Montgomery County or Fairfax County having a public uproar and they would be featured on the news almost everyday. Lot's of undercover stuff goes on. I just had a conversation the other day with someone, and I told them that it's rare to see this type of dysfunction stem from the top down. A lot of times when there are issues within a school district, you can attribute it to bad administration in a particular school or bad teachers and such. In PGCPS, the problems come from the very top starting in Upper Marlboro with the superintendent, then the board of education, and it trickles down from there. Grant it, PGCPS has a new interim superintendent so I won't be so harsh on Dr. Crawley, but that hack Dr. Hite was a major issue and so was many others before him.

[EdwardA]

Originally Posted by UrbanScholar

A very interesting opinion piece by WaPo on PG schools and the issues that they have had in recent years. Although some of the fixes are debatable, the current bill seeking to revamp the Board qualifications is a compelling one. I guess we will see how it shapes up over the next few months

Galvanizing Prince George’s schools - The Washington Post

The two recent superintendents, William R. Hite Jr. and John E. Deasy, left in part because they were exasperated with the board, the quality of some members and their tendency to meddle. Last year, many county residents were embarrassed when The Post reported that just two of the board’s then eight members held bachelor’s degrees — this in a job whose responsibilities include setting policies to prepare students for college.

This statement says a lot about the PG electorate. How can you be embarrassed by the people you voted for?

[EdwardA]

Originally Posted by UrbanScholar

Giving up the option to elect the school board is not one that I agree with, however, having minimum educational requirements is one that I do agree should be implemented. Should the County Executive be able to control the Board? Probably not but I do think there needs to be a more equitable partnership that aligns both bodies with the future of the county. As for your question. They probably wouldn't but those districts are, in general, ran better and produce better academic result than PG so why change what is working.

Why does that have to be instituted? Simply don't vote for a person who deosn't have a college degree. They may still win but hey it's a democracy.

[EdwardA]

Originally Posted by jayman1981

I know this is somewhat off topic, what exactly is so bad about the PG school system? I'm kind of oblivious as to the current issues. People say that PG is not the greatest system, but speaking as a product of the system I think I'm doing fine. Is it that it's not good compared to Fairfax, Mont and Howard counties or is it just that bad to where kids will fail in life? Just a question I've always had that no one can seem to answer.

Well Jayman first off using anecdotal evidence (your personal success) to refute the notion that PG schools are inferior overall doesn't work. I don't think anyone is saying all students who attend PG schools will become miserable failures in life or that all kids who attend Fairfax schools will live successful lives.

PG is often rated as being a poor school system based on test scores, graduation rates, types of colleges students are admitting into, deliquency rates, truancy rate etc.

On this basis PG is generally considered to be the 2nd worst system in the state of Maryland and runs neck and neck with DCPS as worst sytem in the immediate DC area.

[bowian]

Originally Posted by Khemistry

as someone who has extremely close tie to PGCPS and who knows many people who have "insider" knowledge... as much as people think they may know about how dismal and screwed up PGCPS is or can be, they really don't have a clue. PGCPS goes out of their way to hide a lot of things that would have parents in Montgomery County or Fairfax County having a public uproar and they would be featured on the news almost everyday. Lot's of undercover stuff goes on.

I think at least some folks have some clue or more direct knowledge, hence the attempt to unseat some incumbents in the last primary, the decreasing student population, and thriving private schools. But I agree that we just don't know everything.

And with regard to the comments I have been reading on here in the last year or so, what's with this push to bring in more vocational programs? There are vocational programs here -- plenty, from what I have seen. I don't notice any push for more vocational schools in programs in AA, Montgomery, Howard, Baltimore and other counties.

If students choose a vocational program as opposed to a college prep program (or college itself), then let that be the student's choice. But the choice should never be an excuse for a school system to shirk its responsibility to educate all students well (or prep them so that they are ready for college should they choose to attend). Parents need to make sure they're not falling for the okie doke and allowing their children to be dumbed down.

[bowian]

Originally Posted by EdwardA

This statement says a lot about the PG electorate. How can you be embarrassed by the people you voted for?

Not all of the electorate voted for all eight Board members. They vote for the member in their district. So perhaps many residents were embarrassed about the lack of degrees of the Board as a whole.

But you have a point. Be careful when examining a candidate's credentials.

[HandsUpThumbsDown]

Originally Posted by North Beach Person

A question: would the Legislature or Governor even dare to suggest this in Mongomery or Anne Arundel or Baltimore Counties?

No.

[North Beach Person]

Originally Posted by bowian

I think at least some folks have some clue or more direct knowledge, hence the attempt to unseat some incumbents in the last primary, the decreasing student population, and thriving private schools. But I agree that we just don't know everything.

And with regard to the comments I have been reading on here in the last year or so, what's with this push to bring in more vocational programs? There are vocational programs here -- plenty, from what I have seen. I don't notice any push for more vocational schools in programs in AA, Montgomery, Howard, Baltimore and other counties.

If students choose a vocational program as opposed to a college prep program (or college itself), then let that be the student's choice. But the choice should never be an excuse for a school system to shirk its responsibility to educate all students well (or prep them so that they are ready for college should they choose to attend). Parents need to make sure they're not falling for the okie doke and allowing their children to be dumbed down.

That's because, in the case of Anne Arundel and Baltimore Counties at least, those programs have not undergone the systematic gutting that they have in Prince George's. In fact, in Baltimore County, there is a waiting list for enrollment and students have to audition/test into them.

It's been at least 10 years since I wrote a recommendation for a student wanting to go to a dedicated Vo-Tech program. Quick, name the schools that offer Vo-Tech. Don't look.

I've intentionally stayed away from teaching AP classes (I have taught a couple but I willingly gave up one that I started in my school and I have taught them as a fill in when the original instructor had "issues".) and I see literally dozens of kids a year that the "College For All" push is shortchanging. When a kid goes through 12/13 years of school and still has to take remedial classes at PGCC then something is wrong somewhere. These are kids who, in earlier years, would have been in Shop class. Now they're listed as "College Track/Prep". Why? BECAUSE THAT'S ALL WE DO NOW! It makes the parents feel good and gets us more money from Bill Gates. So instead of learning the beginnings of a trade in high school they now have to go to ITT or Lincoln Tech and pay for classes the public high schools used to have as a matter of course and policy.

I graduated from high school in PA 41 years ago with kids who couldn't spell Bob if you spotted them the "B"s. Guess what? Every single one of them walked out of high school into a trade learned at my rural, poor, Appalachian high school. I, on the other hand, knew Algebra (sort of), Physics, Chemistry, Biology, English Lit, etc. Who was better prepared for the world of work?