Prince George's pursues Apple, other high-end retailers (Rockville, Clinton: school, university)

[Zimar]

Originally Posted by pgtvatitans

I can't believe I'm saying this but you're right. Adelphi's theory doesn't work here. A Cheesecake Factory just opened up at Potomac Mills in Prince William County. Prince William County is basically half the size of PG and is mostly urban sprawl (even though PWC's job market is growing). I also see two Wegmans (and one of them is in a very, very remote suburban location no where near any major businesses) in Prince William County and one in PG? How did it get to PG? Well because they receive huge incentives to do so. This isn't rocket science, it's all about perception. If a business believes that people are less likely to shop in a place because the customers may feel unsafe or because they may be victims of crimes (primarily theft), then the business have to see how it affects their bottom line. Is it worth moving to a place that you have to pay for extra security or have customers scared away? Many business are saying no.

Think about it, what is the ultimate goal of a business? To make money of course, if businesses are saying that PG has the money to support upscale retail, then what is the problem? It's really not a deep as we are making it here.

Wow! It's true, miracles happen every day!

To back up my assertion, I go to Costco at woodmore (note there is a costco fairly nearby in dc). Packed. Wegmans. Packed. Nearby Chipotle at mealtime. You don't even want to know how packed. It's not lack of business, or density, it's something else. Something more... sinister... I will say my opinion as a white (sort of) person: there is some element of racism to this. You can't say it's Maryland's anti-business climate, because Moco is packed with stores and restaurants galore. You know whatever county government officials in charge would be falling all over themselves to accommodate a business like that here and get some credit for it. It's not density, it's not lack of appropriate space to put a business. There are plenty of low-crime areas. There are a lot of wealthy, educated people in the area. There are very few explanations left.

[tcave360]

Originally Posted by Zimar

Wow! It's true, miracles happen every day!

To back up my assertion, I go to Costco at woodmore (note there is a costco fairly nearby in dc). Packed. Wegmans. Packed. Nearby Chipotle at mealtime. You don't even want to know how packed. It's not lack of business, or density, it's something else. Something more... sinister... I will say my opinion as a white (sort of) person: there is some element of racism to this. You can't say it's Maryland's anti-business climate, because Moco is packed with stores and restaurants galore. You know whatever county government officials in charge would be falling all over themselves to accommodate a business like that here and get some credit for it. It's not density, it's not lack of appropriate space to put a business. There are plenty of low-crime areas. There are a lot of wealthy, educated people in the area. There are very few explanations left.

Hell, I'm willing to bet that all of the Chipotles in this county are packed to no end! LOL If none of yall believe me, check out the Chipotle here in Clinton off of Route 5. That place is ALWAYS PACKED!!! Sometimes, the line even stretches out of the door! It's nice that customers can order their food via phone and I think Chipotle's website too. It's too bad they don't deliver! lmao But hey, the sight of heavy foot traffic is always a majorly good thing for business in my eyes.

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by Zimar

Wow! It's true, miracles happen every day!

To back up my assertion, I go to Costco at woodmore (note there is a costco fairly nearby in dc). Packed. Wegmans. Packed. Nearby Chipotle at mealtime. You don't even want to know how packed. It's not lack of business, or density, it's something else. Something more... sinister... I will say my opinion as a white (sort of) person: there is some element of racism to this. You can't say it's Maryland's anti-business climate, because Moco is packed with stores and restaurants galore. You know whatever county government officials in charge would be falling all over themselves to accommodate a business like that here and get some credit for it. It's not density, it's not lack of appropriate space to put a business. There are plenty of low-crime areas. There are a lot of wealthy, educated people in the area. There are very few explanations left.

Wait. I thought we were discussing Nordstroms and Lord & Taylor? Wegmans and Costco are totally different price points. And both are grocery or have a huge grocer component. Both have reasonable price-points and serve communities where there are not a lot of quality grocers. Which brings me to a high-end grocer called Whole Foods which the county still does not have. The one location Whole Foods has chosen is steps from a growing Hyattsville and across the street from University Park where the median income in 6 figures.

I'm not saying that race and crime don't play a role. I'm just saying that the density-of-affluency issue can be just as compelling.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by adelphi_sky

Wait. I thought we were discussing Nordstroms and Lord & Taylor? Wegmans and Costco are totally different price points. And both are grocery or have a huge grocer component. Both have reasonable price-points and serve communities where there are not a lot of quality grocers. Which brings me to a high-end grocer called Whole Foods which the county still does not have. The one location Whole Foods has chosen is steps from a growing Hyattsville and across the street from University Park where the median income in 6 figures.

I'm not saying that race and crime don't play a role. I'm just saying that the density-of-affluency issue can be just as compelling.

Wegmans is considered a high end grocer. It is comparable to Whole Foods in some ways. It's more of a hybrid store. You can get some really inexpensive generic brand products, but you can easily spend a ton of money on some of their higher end stuff, especially their organics.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by Zimar

Wow! It's true, miracles happen every day!

To back up my assertion, I go to Costco at woodmore (note there is a costco fairly nearby in dc). Packed. Wegmans. Packed. Nearby Chipotle at mealtime. You don't even want to know how packed. It's not lack of business, or density, it's something else. Something more... sinister... I will say my opinion as a white (sort of) person: there is some element of racism to this. You can't say it's Maryland's anti-business climate, because Moco is packed with stores and restaurants galore. You know whatever county government officials in charge would be falling all over themselves to accommodate a business like that here and get some credit for it. It's not density, it's not lack of appropriate space to put a business. There are plenty of low-crime areas. There are a lot of wealthy, educated people in the area. There are very few explanations left.

Race definitely plays a role in this, but then I sit back and wonder what is a place like PG doing to fight stereotypes. The county as a whole does have a lot of crime, compared to surrounding areas. Of course the media tends to focus on this, but it's not like it isn't there. There is a bit of truth to both side of it. PG isn't as a whole as bad as it's being made to be but it's also not a place that is comparably safe as Montgomery County or Fairfax, so why would the PG expect the same type of businesses? PG has to get out of it's own way first and once that is done, and then these businesses are still not coming, then I think we can say it's truly racism.

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by pgtvatitans

Wegmans is considered a high end grocer. It is comparable to Whole Foods in some ways. It's more of a hybrid store. You can get some really inexpensive generic brand products, but you can easily spend a ton of money on some of their higher end stuff, especially their organics.

That's just it, you can't get generic inexpensive brands at Whole Foods. That's why I would separate the two. Wegman's has value paks, etc. And in some ways, Wegman's can come out cheaper than Safeway or Giant. You walk into Whole Foods, you just know they're going to take you to the cleaners. Wegman's offers an experience. Their sections are more in depth. It's like there's a butcher store, a bakery store, a cheese and cracker store within a store. It is certainly higher quality than Shoppers, Safeway, or Giant, but I think Whole Foods is just in its own stratosphere. I would almost call it boutique-ish.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by adelphi_sky

That's just it, you can't get generic inexpensive brands at Whole Foods. That's why I would separate the two. Wegman's has value paks, etc. And in some ways, Wegman's can come out cheaper than Safeway or Giant. You walk into Whole Foods, you just know they're going to take you to the cleaners. Wegman's offers an experience. Their sections are more in depth. It's like there's a butcher store, a bakery store, a cheese and cracker store within a store. It is certainly higher quality than Shoppers, Safeway, or Giant, but I think Whole Foods is just in its own stratosphere. I would almost call it boutique-ish.

I understand what you're saying and you're right, but people categorize Wegmans as being upscale. It's a bit of both. It really is a hybrid store. It's really hard to put it in a category but I will say that you won't find one in Capitol Heights or Anacostia so that point has to be accounted for. They moved to Woodmore/Lanham because of the income in that area. I don't think you can say that Safeway, Giants and Shoppers are that selective. Whole Foods certainly is though.

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by pgtvatitans

I understand what you're saying and you're right, but people categorize Wegmans as being upscale. It's a bit of both. It really is a hybrid store. It's really hard to put it in a category but I will say that you won't find one in Capitol Heights or Anacostia so that point has to be accounted for. They moved to Woodmore/Lanham because of the income in that area. I don't think you can say that Safeway, Giants and Shoppers are that selective. Whole Foods certainly is though.

And space. Wegman's, like Wal-Mart used to be, is largely a suburban store. You won't find it, at least that I know of, inside the beltway.

[justtitans]

Originally Posted by adelphi_sky

And space. Wegman's, like Wal-Mart used to be, is largely a suburban store. You won't find it, at least that I know of, inside the beltway.

Depends on the area. DC wants to put one at the Walter Reed site. It's definitely possible. The one in Fairfax is not as wide as the other ones in the area but it has a third level. It kind has a somewhat urban design with bi level parking so it's not impossible for them to find land that will suit their needs.

[Fast GTO]

There is a lot of crime because there are large pockets of poor. Call them ghetto's if you wish. Most of those ghetto's are west of the beltway and only make up a small piece of PG county, but that is what the media hawks to. And at this point annacostia might as well be synonymous with PG County. When people talk about crime stats and look at the crime reports map you have an explosion of crime in that area. On top of that 90+ percent of the residents in that area are Black, so what do you think the resultant stereotype is going to be?