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Old 08-14-2023, 09:33 AM
 
Location: Cumberland
6,999 posts, read 11,293,992 times
Reputation: 6268

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth View Post
Don't rewrite history to support your point. That is dishonest.

The Post was very transparent with their poll. It was conducted with standard and legitimate methedology. And contrary to your statement, it backed up what every poll has ever said. Publications like Sports Illustrated found the same thing. Really, it is so hard to accept that most of the indigenous peoples of North America just don't care?

Suddenly, when the truth was unacceptable to the woke, the Post commissioned another effort, this time tweaking it with woke nonsense. There is your suspect poll.

As for the name Redskins, have you never noticed that indigenous peoples aka Indians aka Native Americans do not have red colored skin?

The name change prevailed because a loud but tenacious minority were relentless while the majority never took it seriously. That is often how policy is made and other examples are numerous.
I'd love to see the methodology if you can find it. I agree with the author of the article I posted, it DOES matter and should be transparent if those surveys are going to be used as authoritative statements on how Native Americans think and feel, like you wish to use them for. This is the same standard for all polling, to take a poll seriously, you need to have access to the exact questions, methodology, and cross tabs.

Conspiracy isn't needed for me to accept the results of the most recent polls. That doesn't make it more "true" on its face, but resorting to "woke nonsense" being the reasons to "tweak" something to get a "suspect poll" isn't a strong argument, it's a bunch of buzz words strung together.

Look, go ask Danny Boy why he changed the name if 80-90% of all Native Americans still supported the name. Ask any corporation why they change and adapt. If you were correct, that this was completely a manufactured crisis spurred on by lies, why did your team fall for it? Isn't FAR more likely the winds of change have finally blown strong enough so that "redskin" isn't an acceptable name for a sport's team?

And, yeah, Native Americans don't have red skin, which is why the name/word is even more egregious. "Redskin" is a term to refer to a group of people that isn't even accurate to their biology, appearance, culture, or anything else. This isn't a point in your favor, it is another reason why "redskin" is a more offensive name for a team than "Braves" or "Chiefs" or the name of a specific tribe, like Seminole.
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Old 08-14-2023, 12:45 PM
 
Location: Southern MN
12,038 posts, read 8,403,014 times
Reputation: 44792
But people calling themselves Black, even though they range from white, to olive to light tan to brown to deep black, isn't offensive? Why the difference?

Such a silly thing to use time and money on when there are so many more serious problems.
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Old 08-14-2023, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Cumberland
6,999 posts, read 11,293,992 times
Reputation: 6268
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodestar View Post
But people calling themselves Black, even though they range from white, to olive to light tan to brown to deep black, isn't offensive? Why the difference?

Such a silly thing to use time and money on when there are so many more serious problems.
Whatever people want to call themselves is generally fine, even when it is a slur. That is not a justification though for others to use the same words. Classic in-group vs. out-group dynamics.
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Old 08-14-2023, 09:08 PM
 
Location: Howard County, Maryland
16,555 posts, read 10,607,780 times
Reputation: 36567
Quote:
Originally Posted by westsideboy View Post
Look, go ask Danny Boy why he changed the name if 80-90% of all Native Americans still supported the name. Ask any corporation why they change and adapt. If you were correct, that this was completely a manufactured crisis spurred on by lies, why did your team fall for it? Isn't FAR more likely the winds of change have finally blown strong enough so that "redskin" isn't an acceptable name for a sport's team?
Do you honestly think the team management could possibly care less what Native Americans think? They didn't change the name because of Native sensitivities; they changed it because the old name became perceived as offensive by the liberal opinion-shapers of the day. Is it actually offensive to Native Americans? I don't know. I doubt the team management knows either. But that's never stopped certain liberal do-gooders from getting offended on behalf of others, regardless of how those others might actually feel.

Look, I couldn't care less about the Redskins, or the Commanders. The team could relocate to Anchorage tomorrow and I wouldn't shed a single tear. I think they changed the name because they wanted to pander to liberal pieties. But I also think that it's their team, and they can call it whatever they want.
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Old 08-15-2023, 10:22 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,333 posts, read 60,500,026 times
Reputation: 60917
Well, there's this:

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/nativ...?intcmp=tw_fnc






BOOM goes the grenade.
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Old 08-15-2023, 10:55 AM
 
Location: Southern MN
12,038 posts, read 8,403,014 times
Reputation: 44792
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Well, there's this:

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/nativ...?intcmp=tw_fnc






BOOM goes the grenade.
Laughing. They're going to get fixed whether they want it or not.
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Old 08-15-2023, 12:09 PM
 
Location: Cumberland
6,999 posts, read 11,293,992 times
Reputation: 6268
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Well, there's this:

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/nativ...?intcmp=tw_fnc






BOOM goes the grenade.
You don't have to be a Native American to join.

https://www.nagaeducation.org/membership

Be the change you want to see in the world!
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Old 08-15-2023, 05:44 PM
 
13,648 posts, read 20,767,629 times
Reputation: 7650
Quote:
Originally Posted by westsideboy View Post
I'd love to see the methodology if you can find it. I agree with the author of the article I posted, it DOES matter and should be transparent if those surveys are going to be used as authoritative statements on how Native Americans think and feel, like you wish to use them for. This is the same standard for all polling, to take a poll seriously, you need to have access to the exact questions, methodology, and cross tabs.

Conspiracy isn't needed for me to accept the results of the most recent polls. That doesn't make it more "true" on its face, but resorting to "woke nonsense" being the reasons to "tweak" something to get a "suspect poll" isn't a strong argument, it's a bunch of buzz words strung together.

Look, go ask Danny Boy why he changed the name if 80-90% of all Native Americans still supported the name. Ask any corporation why they change and adapt. If you were correct, that this was completely a manufactured crisis spurred on by lies, why did your team fall for it? Isn't FAR more likely the winds of change have finally blown strong enough so that "redskin" isn't an acceptable name for a sport's team?

And, yeah, Native Americans don't have red skin, which is why the name/word is even more egregious. "Redskin" is a term to refer to a group of people that isn't even accurate to their biology, appearance, culture, or anything else. This isn't a point in your favor, it is another reason why "redskin" is a more offensive name for a team than "Braves" or "Chiefs" or the name of a specific tribe, like Seminole.
You are welcome to do your own research. Conducting a poll is not particulaly difficult and native people were indeed polled endlessly on this subject with the results always being the same. If you have evidence to the contrary then post it. If not, be an adult and yield the point.

I already explained why Danny Boy chanaged the name. Policy is often made by small, motivated groups who are loud a and energized. In this case, they exploited the death of George Floyd and successfully went for the jugular. I would appreciate it if you would actually absorb what is being said to you.

As for Redskins (did the ground open up when I wrote that?), it probably comes from them rubbing red dye on their bodies. Gee ... really egregous stuff there.
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Old 08-15-2023, 05:49 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,333 posts, read 60,500,026 times
Reputation: 60917
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moth View Post
You are welcome to do your own research. Conducting a poll is not particulaly difficult and native people were indeed polled endlessly on this subject with the results always being the same. If you have evidence to the contrary then post it. If not, be an adult and yield the point.

I already explained why Danny Boy chanaged the name. Policy is often made by small, motivated groups who are loud a and energized. In this case, they exploited the death of George Floyd and successfully went for the jugular. I would appreciate it if you would actually absorb what is being said to you.

As for Redskins (did the ground open up when I wrote that?), it probably comes from them rubbing red dye on their bodies. Gee ... really egregous stuff there.
Also, don't discount pressure from the League for a name change. The "protests" made the rest of them look bad. The same reason that Snyder was quietly pressured to sell, the constant turmoil was making the rest of the owners look bad and getting people to look at them.
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Old 08-15-2023, 07:04 PM
 
13,648 posts, read 20,767,629 times
Reputation: 7650
Quote:
Originally Posted by North Beach Person View Post
Also, don't discount pressure from the League for a name change. The "protests" made the rest of them look bad. The same reason that Snyder was quietly pressured to sell, the constant turmoil was making the rest of the owners look bad and getting people to look at them.
Quite true. Snyder did not possess the stature, respect or eloquence to effectively combat the mob. Did not posssess much of anything except corruption and ineptitutde.

Glad he is gone.
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