White Flight in Bowie?! (Baltimore, Montgomery Village: best cities, high crime, homes)

[bowian]

Originally Posted by RoadTripGurl

to everyone who commented about the schools

First, There are great teachers out there and I do commend them. But most students do not perform well because of the constant distractions of the kids in the class. My son was classified as ADHD and they placed him in a classroom with "troubled" kids. I was tired having to go to the school daily to make sure THEY do THEIR job. I should be on the payroll if that is the case. And believe me, I didn't make a "D" stand, he wasn't performing because he did not get the sevices offered. And besides the children in the school were, well a little wild. Now? My son is in a school where he is the least distracted where he can focus on his schoolwork and not Joseph throwing a book at the teacher. And it is a shame that the quality of the neighborhood equals most likely the quality of education. My conterpart (Iscalder) is happy to live where she is in PG County, but why can't we get a decent education everywhere in PG County? I'd have to sacrafice to a condo to be in the better enighborhood. Why can't there be affordable living AND a decent education in the same neighborhood? The topic of this dicussion is the area of Bowie; I can't afford to live in the same size house I have in Harford County in Bowie which has decent neighborhoods in PG County.

I'm not fussy at anybody, but it was a very hard time for me to deal with the schools there when they were trying everything in their power to make it look like my son wasn't performing when and his test scores showed otherwise. So yes, my son DID perform better out of PG County, and I know there are schools in PG County that perform, but my thing is they ALL should be performing, have the same standard, right? All schools are supposed to provide a Free Appropriate Public Education (FAPE) and my son did not get that...

You're absolutely right; schools should be performing everywhere. Get this -- I live in an unincorporated part of Bowie, and the elementary, middle and high schools my so-called upscale community is zoned for are abysmal. All near the bottom test-score-wise. Ironic, huh? I like the community, but there are some odd and political things that go on in this area.

As for your son, mine has ADHD and PDD-NOS. He is in a non-public school, because his zoned elementary school could not accommodate him either. And, yes, they tried to put him on the emotionally troubled track. So I understand where you are coming from.

[lscalder]

Originally Posted by RoadTripGurl

to everyone who commented about the schools

First, There are great teachers out there and I do commend them. But most students do not perform well because of the constant distractions of the kids in the class. My son was classified as ADHD and they placed him in a classroom with "troubled" kids. I was tired having to go to the school daily to make sure THEY do THEIR job. I should be on the payroll if that is the case. And believe me, I didn't make a "D" stand, he wasn't performing because he did not get the sevices offered. And besides the children in the school were, well a little wild. Now? My son is in a school where he is the least distracted where he can focus on his schoolwork and not Joseph throwing a book at the teacher. And it is a shame that the quality of the neighborhood equals most likely the quality of education. My conterpart (Iscalder) is happy to live where she is in PG County, but why can't we get a decent education everywhere in PG County? I'd have to sacrafice to a condo to be in the better enighborhood. Why can't there be affordable living AND a decent education in the same neighborhood? The topic of this dicussion is the area of Bowie; I can't afford to live in the same size house I have in Harford County in Bowie which has decent neighborhoods in PG County.

I'm not fussy at anybody, but it was a very hard time for me to deal with the schools there when they were trying everything in their power to make it look like my son wasn't performing when and his test scores showed otherwise. So yes, my son DID perform better out of PG County, and I know there are schools in PG County that perform, but my thing is they ALL should be performing, have the same standard, right? All schools are supposed to provide a Free Appropriate Public Education (FAPE) and my son did not get that...

This is a issue in every county in MD even Montgomery County. The low income areas in Montgomery county have low performing schools. Which is why those with money live in certain areas in Montgomery County. If you notice in Montgomery county areas such as Silver Spring,Wheaton,Burtonsville,Takoma Park,etc have low performing schools. Why? because those areas are considered low income areas. The same issue everywhere.

I live in Pg county but I would not live in the low income areas. If I ever decide to move to another county either Howard,Montgomery,Harford I would never live in the low income areas because I know and I think every adult should aready know that low income areas usually get the worst of everything regardless of the county.

This is not a PG county what is happening in parts of Pg county happens in every county. Maybe you are blind and think every school in your county have no issues and every child is getting the best education because if that was the case everyone in MD would live in your county but I know that if you want the best you have to spend the money regardless of county/State/City.

[Maxchus]

Originally Posted by lscalder

.....Burtonsville ...... Why? because those areas are considered low income areas....

This is the first time I've heard of Burtonsville being described as a low income area. I know people who live there and I would describe most of it as being middle class.

[lscalder]

Originally Posted by Maxchus

This is the first time I've heard of Burtonsville being described as a low income area. I know people who live there and I would describe most of it as being middle class.

,

The schools in Burtonsville majority low performing schools. Do your reseach on Paint Branch high school,Galway Elementary,Green Castle Elementary schools and you let me know if those school can come close to Chevy Chase,Bethesda,Potomac or parts of Rockeville which are considered the high income areas in Montgomery county. Burtonsville gets no attention from Montgomery County government. Burtonsvile has plenty of low income families with low performing schools.

[RaisedWell]

Originally Posted by RoadTripGurl

to everyone who commented about the schools

First, There are great teachers out there and I do commend them. But most students do not perform well because of the constant distractions of the kids in the class. My son was classified as ADHD and they placed him in a classroom with "troubled" kids. I was tired having to go to the school daily to make sure THEY do THEIR job. I should be on the payroll if that is the case. And believe me, I didn't make a "D" stand, he wasn't performing because he did not get the sevices offered. And besides the children in the school were, well a little wild. Now? My son is in a school where he is the least distracted where he can focus on his schoolwork and not Joseph throwing a book at the teacher. And it is a shame that the quality of the neighborhood equals most likely the quality of education. My conterpart (Iscalder) is happy to live where she is in PG County, but why can't we get a decent education everywhere in PG County? I'd have to sacrafice to a condo to be in the better enighborhood. Why can't there be affordable living AND a decent education in the same neighborhood? The topic of this dicussion is the area of Bowie; I can't afford to live in the same size house I have in Harford County in Bowie which has decent neighborhoods in PG County.

I'm not fussy at anybody, but it was a very hard time for me to deal with the schools there when they were trying everything in their power to make it look like my son wasn't performing when and his test scores showed otherwise. So yes, my son DID perform better out of PG County, and I know there are schools in PG County that perform, but my thing is they ALL should be performing, have the same standard, right? All schools are supposed to provide a Free Appropriate Public Education (FAPE) and my son did not get that...

I'm sorry you had to go through this. My son is ADHD (doing fine now in high school). I became a Special Ed teacher for this reason. I had a very difficult time with him before he even started school. The key is to talk to as many people as you can who are directly or indirectly involved with your child. I know this is for others who are reading this: always get a second, third, fourth opinion before you let anyone make decisions on your child's placement. Sometimes it's a parenting issue. Sometimes it's a straight-up teacher issue. I can deal with "book-throwing Joseph" when other teachers may not be able to. Sometimes it's an administrator or politics of the building issue. I am known for saying things off the record or talk to the parent heart to heart away from my superiors if I know it will benefit the child and parent in the long-run.

You should have gone forward with a lawsuit and not have had to move. Every child has a right to a free appropriate public education regardless of where they live.

[Skapov]

Originally Posted by The_Fairfaxian

To all of those who mentioned the excessive racial segregation within Bowie, I have to admit that it's fairly true. The older (North) Part of Bowie is whiter while the southern portion (Upper Marlboro and Mitchellville) is more black. As for the reception, the high school I attended (Bowie High School) was fairly diverse, but the people self-segregated themselves by race. This was the attitude from both blacks and whites in Bowie. This, along with the lack of amenities and good schools would be the reason why I would recommend not moving to that town. I would also say this would be the case for quite a few places in Montgomery and Howard Counties too. As for Fairfax County, to which some of you have considered looking into, I would recommend looking into the layout and interaction between neighbors of different ethnic groups before moving there. Although from my experience, racial integration in Fairfax and most of Northern Virginia has a better reception, and many of the people are more welcoming to different ethnic groups including middle and upper class blacks. Latinos, however might have a problem however due to various factors (but that's for another post).

Thanks, these are all great pointers! Being that my son and all future children are/will-be bi-racial (50% Black/50% White), I need an environment where people preferably won't self-segregate, because I want my kids to be able to fit-in and have an active social life.

There just isn't a "perfect" community for us multicultural people, but the black community is obviously always more welcoming to biracial children, so that's why I feel very comfortable raising my children with an African-American orientation, like Barack Obama's.

I'm keeping my options open, and thanks to all who have helped with providing the inside-perspective.

[Skapov]

Originally Posted by lscalder

This is a issue in every county in MD even Montgomery County. The low income areas in Montgomery county have low performing schools. Which is why those with money live in certain areas in Montgomery County. If you notice in Montgomery county areas such as Silver Spring,Wheaton,Burtonsville,Takoma Park,etc have low performing schools. Why? because those areas are considered low income areas. The same issue everywhere.

I live in Pg county but I would not live in the low income areas. If I ever decide to move to another county either Howard,Montgomery,Harford I would never live in the low income areas because I know and I think every adult should aready know that low income areas usually get the worst of everything regardless of the county.

This is not a PG county what is happening in parts of Pg county happens in every county. Maybe you are blind and think every school in your county have no issues and every child is getting the best education because if that was the case everyone in MD would live in your county but I know that if you want the best you have to spend the money regardless of county/State/City.

NO, it's not just the low-income areas in PG County with low-performing schools! That is what is so disheartening, even the neighborhood schools where houses average $500,000 are still low-performing, including here in Upper Marlboro, and the only location with "passable" schools is really BOWIE, and only at the elementary level even there! It is correct that schools in Silver Spring and Takoma Park and Germantown are low-performing, but the ironic thing about PG County is that you can't even buy your way out of the poor schools, because there are no real enclaves that have highly regarded public schools.

[lscalder]

Originally Posted by Skapov

NO, it's not just the low-income areas in PG County with low-performing schools! That is what is so disheartening, even the neighborhood schools where houses average $500,000 are still low-performing, including here in Upper Marlboro, and the only location with "passable" schools is really BOWIE, and only at the elementary level even there! It is correct that schools in Silver Spring and Takoma Park and Germantown are low-performing, but the ironic thing about PG County is that you can't even buy your way out of the poor schools, because there are no real enclaves that have highly regarded public schools.

No you are wrong I live in Upper Marlboro and I can tell you right now that my community out perform plenty of high income area schools in Montgomery County. The high income areas in Pg county have excellent schools. I know that for a fact. I have done my search and compared schools.

[bowian]

Originally Posted by lscalder

No you are wrong I live in Upper Marlboro and I can tell you right now that my community out perform plenty of high income area schools in Montgomery County. The high income areas in Pg county have excellent schools. I know that for a fact. I have done my search and compared schools.

No, that's just not true. The high-income areas do not have consistently excellent schools in PG. I used to live in Upper Marlboro. Love the area, but I certainly did NOT want my children to attend James Madison middle school, which would have been their zone middle school had we remained in UM. Madison Middle did NOT make adequate yearly progress in 2008. The school location is near a variety of middle-income housing, including houses that sold for over $500K. I compared Madison's math scores to the scores of the following schools: Benjamin Tasker in Bowie, Samuel Ogle in Bowie, and Ernest Everett Just in Lake Arbor/Mitchellville. Only Ernest Everett Just scored lower than Madison. I believe Madison is on the State watch list for possible takeover if I'm not mistaken.

Then I compared Mattaponi Elementary to the other UM-area ele. schools (Melwood and Rosaryville), Glenn Dale (my kids' zone school), and the Bowie and Mitchelliville schools for math scores. The lowest scores (in the 70s) were for the UM elementaries and Glenn Dale. Again, ALL those areas have lots of homes that go for $500k and up. Consistently, the Bowie and Mithcellville schools score better, but there are plenty of outside the beltway schools that don't do as well as you would expect. And quite a few inside the beltway elementaries did pretty well score-wise. All this information is from the PGCPS website.

Someone asked if the low scores are because of the black kids. Of course not. All of the Bowie and Mitchellville schools have black students. Some are majority black. My take is that the answer to low scores is threefold: the schools have trouble reaching and teaching low-income kids (on free and reduced lunch) and special ed kids; which goes to reason #2 -- bad school culture (trickling from bad administrators down); and lack of parental involvement.

The schools in upper income areas often have a significant number of free and reduced lunch students attending. If you can't reach the impoverished kids and they don't test well, that will bring the scores down. The impoverished kids can learn, but you have to know how to reach them and teach them early in the game.

[Skapov]

Originally Posted by westsideboy

What is a "black orientation"? You mean like Steve Martin in the "The Jerk?" Was Eminem raised with a black orientation? Help me out here.

Everybody has their own world view, and "black orientation" means feeling like an authentic member of the African-American community, and being proud of ones heritage and roots! For example, I remember last year my boss being "surprised" when I mentioned being off for the Martin Luther King Jr. holiday (a company-wide holiday), because to him it doesn't mean anything and is just like being off for Veterans Day or President's Day (you know how people mix up them holidays). But for a Black Person, we know and respect that holiday, it means a lot to us to know about Black History and to pay attention to what is relevant as far as news and events that concern Black Americans.

I don't want my child to completely assimilate into the "Mainstream", I want them to treasure black traditions and have black friends and date/marry other black people etc.! Barack Obama could have assimilated, but he chose to marry a black woman, have black children, and live his life as a black man. I want my children to do the same, and this is why I currently live in PG County and had initially wanted to settle here, because it's majority-black with solid Middle Class families. Now the schools...that's another issue .