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Old 10-19-2011, 10:09 PM
 
708 posts, read 1,132,094 times
Reputation: 442

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Quote:
Originally Posted by analyze_this View Post
DC people are lazy slobs compared to workaholics in SV or Wall St.
Amen!!! Good post. One has to ask how hard would you work if you were promised 80-150k and a cushy government or non profit job approving TPS reports? You would just try and create additional beauraucratic nonsense to justify your job (hence Type A world ablaze types) because on the inside you know you are overpaid and in a salary/financial dead end.
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Old 10-19-2011, 10:14 PM
 
11,145 posts, read 14,779,954 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by pjg66 View Post
Wonder if Washington and Lincoln could ever have envisioned the huge cadre of vampires (aka federal contractors, lobbyists, law firms, etc.) that would surround that federal government and suck up so many of those tax dollars.
Well, in this regard Jefferson would have been on the side of the Occupy protesters: "I hope we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial by strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country."

Never one to be easily categorized, he also said: "A wise and frugal government, which shall leave men free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned - this is the sum of good government."

I accidentally wrote Lincoln instead of Jefferson previously, but here's a few that suggest Lincoln wouldn't be too happy with our broken system either:

"I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . .. corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed."


"These capitalists generally act harmoniously and in concert, to fleece the people."

"Discourage litigation. Persuade your neighbors to compromise whenever you can. As a peacemaker the lawyer has superior opportunity of being a good man. There will still be business enough."

Last edited by Bluefly; 10-19-2011 at 10:36 PM..
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Old 10-19-2011, 10:32 PM
 
Location: East Coast of the United States
22,097 posts, read 23,303,645 times
Reputation: 18716
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefly View Post
DC was created to receive federal taxes and use them to provide for defense, the general welfare, and all the other things listed in the Constitution. This is not debatable. The discussion of how much money DC should receive is an entirely different topic.
Man, that darned Constitution.
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Old 10-20-2011, 04:47 AM
 
1,783 posts, read 3,608,490 times
Reputation: 1382
Quote:
Originally Posted by vicnice View Post
Amen!!! Good post. One has to ask how hard would you work if you were promised 80-150k and a cushy government or non profit job approving TPS reports? You would just try and create additional beauraucratic nonsense to justify your job (hence Type A world ablaze types) because on the inside you know you are overpaid and in a salary/financial dead end.
And yet many do things that are vitally important to the daily lives of millions of Americans. I am sure the CIA analysts who tracked Bin Laden really appreciate being lumped into a group of "lazy slobs". Or the hundreds of thousands of civil service employees who ensure our military is run correctly. Or the people who ensure our air is clean, food free from diseases, veterans are taken care of, national parks administered, important medical research is funded and on and on and on. They don't always do a perfect job but in the big scheme of things they are done well far more often then they aren't.
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Old 10-20-2011, 05:28 AM
 
Location: North America
5,960 posts, read 5,125,512 times
Reputation: 1948
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefly View Post
You're confusing two topics to try and make some talk radio political point, but here's the facts: none of this metro area (except a few small towns) would exist without Washington and Lincoln choosing to create a city for the sole purpose of housing a federal government.
DC was created to receive federal taxes and use them to provide for defense, the general welfare, and all the other things listed in the Constitution. This is not debatable. The discussion of how much money DC should receive is an entirely different topic.
How can you separate the two?

That would be like (just as an example) saying tax money for schools is normal and expected but lets not talk about the gold plated desks and 50" TVs in each classroom because, hey, that has nothing to do with your tax money!

We aren't stupid. We all know why D.C. was founded because we all took basic American history in school. That is not the issue.

What IS the issue is the TRILLIONS in tax money (and money stolen from future generations) being sucked up by ONE metropolitan area NOT ALL FOR THE PURPOSE OF FULFILLING DUTIES OUTLINED IN THE CONSTITUTION.

How do you go to a very high unemployment state like California or Nevada or Oregon or Michigan and explain to those people the absolute necessity of a GS-15 at Housing and Urban Development and her automatic step increases?

How do you justify D.C. folks not participating EVEN A LITTLE BIT in a national crisis of recession and unemployment? If you really look in your heart you will admit that not each and every federal position is necessary in a near depression. We can cut back and let people keep some of their own money.

Again I ask what are the approval ratings of this congress and the current administration OUTSIDE of D.C.?
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Old 10-20-2011, 05:38 AM
 
Location: North America
5,960 posts, read 5,125,512 times
Reputation: 1948
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoomBoxing View Post
And yet many do things that are vitally important to the daily lives of millions of Americans. I am sure the CIA analysts who tracked Bin Laden really appreciate being lumped into a group of "lazy slobs". Or the hundreds of thousands of civil service employees who ensure our military is run correctly. Or the people who ensure our air is clean, food free from diseases, veterans are taken care of, national parks administered, important medical research is funded and on and on and on. They don't always do a perfect job but in the big scheme of things they are done well far more often then they aren't.
...and this is all done with billions borrowed from China and with tremendous amounts of waste and fraud because being fired is nearly impossible.
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Old 10-20-2011, 05:56 AM
 
11,145 posts, read 14,779,954 times
Reputation: 4209
Quote:
Originally Posted by clb10 View Post
How can you separate the two?

That would be like (just as an example) saying tax money for schools is normal and expected but lets not talk about the gold plated desks and 50" TVs in each classroom because, hey, that has nothing to do with your tax money!

We aren't stupid. We all know why D.C. was founded because we all took basic American history in school. That is not the issue.

What IS the issue is the TRILLIONS in tax money (and money stolen from future generations) being sucked up by ONE metropolitan area NOT ALL FOR THE PURPOSE OF FULFILLING DUTIES OUTLINED IN THE CONSTITUTION.

How do you go to a very high unemployment state like California or Nevada or Oregon or Michigan and explain to those people the absolute necessity of a GS-15 at Housing and Urban Development and her automatic step increases?

How do you justify D.C. folks not participating EVEN A LITTLE BIT in a national crisis of recession and unemployment? If you really look in your heart you will admit that not each and every federal position is necessary in a near depression. We can cut back and let people keep some of their own money.

Again I ask what are the approval ratings of this congress and the current administration OUTSIDE of D.C.?
I made a simple claim that DC was built to depend on tax revenue. You said "NO!" and threw out a bunch of talking points. I accurately explained why you were wrong in refuting my claim. If you would like to discuss the other topic you're going on about, the Politics and Other Controversies forum is a more appropriate venue. This one is about the city of Washington, DC.
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Old 10-20-2011, 06:06 AM
 
1,783 posts, read 3,608,490 times
Reputation: 1382
Quote:
Originally Posted by clb10 View Post
How can you separate the two?

That would be like (just as an example) saying tax money for schools is normal and expected but lets not talk about the gold plated desks and 50" TVs in each classroom because, hey, that has nothing to do with your tax money!

We aren't stupid. We all know why D.C. was founded because we all took basic American history in school. That is not the issue.

What IS the issue is the TRILLIONS in tax money (and money stolen from future generations) being sucked up by ONE metropolitan area NOT ALL FOR THE PURPOSE OF FULFILLING DUTIES OUTLINED IN THE CONSTITUTION.

How do you go to a very high unemployment state like California or Nevada or Oregon or Michigan and explain to those people the absolute necessity of a GS-15 at Housing and Urban Development and her automatic step increases?

How do you justify D.C. folks not participating EVEN A LITTLE BIT in a national crisis of recession and unemployment? If you really look in your heart you will admit that not each and every federal position is necessary in a near depression. We can cut back and let people keep some of their own money.

Again I ask what are the approval ratings of this congress and the current administration OUTSIDE of D.C.?
You are seeing things through a narrow lense. How percentage of fed workers are GS-15? Most are 5 through 11 and are not living some life of luxury like you are acting like...and most don't even live in this area. Fed workers took COLA freezes for two years and that will likely be extended. And they will surely feel some more pain when the debt "supercommittee" decides what else they want to do.

But you are missing the point. Again, most fed workers are regular working/middle class people who do things important to the function of our country. While I'm sure some jobs could be cut, it is extremely off base to label all of them lazy or act like they are all GS-15 paper pushers. If it makes you feel better about your own biased views to believe that then so be it.

Quote:
...and this is all done with billions borrowed from China and with tremendous amounts of waste and fraud because being fired is nearly impossible.
Not at all. I've seen people fired all the time, and fraud is the easiest way to guarantee it. The difference is most are offered the chance to resign so when OPM reports the low percentage of fired people it gives the anti-government crowd a chance to act like it's impossible. As for the billions borrowed from China, a sensible tax structure could alleviate that concern. Something tells me your and my idea of a "sensible tax structure" are at the opposite ends of the spectrum so I will leave it at that.
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Old 10-20-2011, 06:07 AM
 
Location: North America
5,960 posts, read 5,125,512 times
Reputation: 1948
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefly View Post
I made a simple claim that DC was built to depend on tax revenue. You said "NO!" and threw out a bunch of talking points. I accurately explained why you were wrong in refuting my claim. If you would like to discuss the other topic you're going on about, the Politics and Other Controversies forum is a more appropriate venue. This one is about the city of Washington, DC.
I ain't talkin' bout St. Louis or Miami here am I?
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Old 10-20-2011, 06:11 AM
 
Location: North America
5,960 posts, read 5,125,512 times
Reputation: 1948
Quote:
Originally Posted by BoomBoxing View Post
You are seeing things through a narrow lense. How percentage of fed workers are GS-15? Most are 5 through 11 and are not living some life of luxury like you are acting like...and most don't even live in this area. Fed workers took COLA freezes for two years and that will likely be extended. And they will surely feel some more pain when the debt "supercommittee" decides what else they want to do.

But you are missing the point. Again, most fed workers are regular working/middle class people who do things important to the function of our country. While I'm sure some jobs could be cut, it is extremely off base to label all of them lazy or act like they are all GS-15 paper pushers. If it makes you feel better about your own biased views to believe that then so be it.



Not at all. I've seen people fired all the time, and fraud is the easiest way to guarantee it. The difference is most are offered the chance to resign so when OPM reports the low percentage of fired people it gives the anti-government crowd a chance to act like it's impossible. As for the billions borrowed from China, a sensible tax structure could alleviate that concern. Something tells me your and my idea of a "sensible tax structure" are at the opposite ends of the spectrum so I will leave it at that.
I would love to hear some concrete examples of federal job cutting ideas from people who must defend at all costs the bloated structure of the federal government.

That, of course, will never happen, though.
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