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My husband and I are planning to move from Virginia to the Olympia area to live near our kids and grandkids, and we need advice. Our daughter lives out on Johnson Point which is beautiful, but too secluded for us. We are looking for a safe neighborhood where we can walk to shops and restaurants, and ride our bikes. We'd like to stay under $500k, but for the perfect place we could be flexible.
Does anyone have any recommendations on neighborhoods we should check out on our next visit?
Thanks in advance, EC
Walkable neighborhoods are something I hear about on TV in shows about other places, but I have never been to such a place around here. I've lived in Thurston County nearly my whole life. You won't find places in "town" that have a lot of pedestrians.
There might be a lot of reasons why. For starters, it rains 9 months out of the year, at least a fair percentage of the time. It's hilly here. There are large bodies of water that have to be navigated around. Perhaps for those reasons, we love our cars, and we have built our towns and cities and bedroom communities around being able to drive.
We don't have small shops where you might pick up a couple things and walk home, we have Costco, where you have to buy it by the gallon, or in a two-pack, and you need an SUV to get the stuff home.
We do have restaurants downtown, but the shops downtown are antique stores, art shops, and touristy kinds of boutiques. If you are downtown and need to buy groceries, you're going to need to drive there. There is a grocery downtown, but no homes near it. Where the homes are, there are no groceries.
Your budget puts you well into the upper percentiles of homes in this area. Most homes in that range are on the water, on acreage, and out of town. They are not in the city.
There are a few exceptions that are more downtown... and they might be in the South Capitol neighborhood, which consists of mostly historic homes just south of the Capitol building, moving up the hill on Capitol Blvd towards Tumwater. Also just across the water heading west out of downtown to the West side, you might find some nicer homes with views in West Olympia.
If you want nice homes within BIKING distance of downtown, then I would consider going out East Bay Drive into the areas around Priest Point Park. There are nice bike lanes out there, and if you want to go for a walk, the park is nice.
Maybe that's another cultural difference in this area. If the weather is nice and people want to walk, we don't walk in town. If we want to walk, we go to a nature trail. There are many of those around, I'd be happy to recommend if that interests you. I think there's just a major difference in the way people live here, than on the East Coast.
I'll follow this thread. I'm curious if other locals will agree with me or will find an exception somewhere that might fit your niche. We do have a LOT of people who bike. I can recommend areas it's nice to bike to if you're interested in that.
Walkable neighborhoods are something I hear about on TV in shows about other places, but I have never been to such a place around here. I've lived in Thurston County nearly my whole life. You won't find places in "town" that have a lot of pedestrians.
There might be a lot of reasons why. For starters, it rains 9 months out of the year, at least a fair percentage of the time. It's hilly here. There are large bodies of water that have to be navigated around. Perhaps for those reasons, we love our cars, and we have built our towns and cities and bedroom communities around being able to drive.
We don't have small shops where you might pick up a couple things and walk home, we have Costco, where you have to buy it by the gallon, or in a two-pack, and you need an SUV to get the stuff home.
We do have restaurants downtown, but the shops downtown are antique stores, art shops, and touristy kinds of boutiques. If you are downtown and need to buy groceries, you're going to need to drive there. There is a grocery downtown, but no homes near it. Where the homes are, there are no groceries.
Your budget puts you well into the upper percentiles of homes in this area. Most homes in that range are on the water, on acreage, and out of town. They are not in the city.
There are a few exceptions that are more downtown... and they might be in the South Capitol neighborhood, which consists of mostly historic homes just south of the Capitol building, moving up the hill on Capitol Blvd towards Tumwater. Also just across the water heading west out of downtown to the West side, you might find some nicer homes with views in West Olympia.
If you want nice homes within BIKING distance of downtown, then I would consider going out East Bay Drive into the areas around Priest Point Park. There are nice bike lanes out there, and if you want to go for a walk, the park is nice.
Maybe that's another cultural difference in this area. If the weather is nice and people want to walk, we don't walk in town. If we want to walk, we go to a nature trail. There are many of those around, I'd be happy to recommend if that interests you. I think there's just a major difference in the way people live here, than on the East Coast.
I'll follow this thread. I'm curious if other locals will agree with me or will find an exception somewhere that might fit your niche. We do have a LOT of people who bike. I can recommend areas it's nice to bike to if you're interested in that.
I know that this thread is about Olympia and Lacey, but you seem skeptical that walkable neighborhoods exist in the state.
As an adult I've lived in FL, NC, CO, WA, and have spent a lot of time in the NE. And while it's not on the scale of NYC or SF, I disagree that it's primarily a cultural phenomenon- I think that walkability has more to do with the spatial layout. There are quite a few neighborhoods in Seattle- and here in Bellingham- that are quite pedestrian-friendly and are busy with foot traffic.
Much of Bham is easily bikeable, and much of the city west of I-5 is walkable. In fact, it was a major factor in the purchase of our house last year. Many of the more "urban" neighborhoods here actually have grocery stores, corner stores, restaurants and breweries in the middle of residential areas and command a premium for their proximity to such amenities.
Sorry to go on a tangent, but you may be surprised. It's definitely a selling point around here, and prices per sf in the older working class/middle class neighborhoods are sometimes double what they are for scenic mountain and lake homes on the periphery of town.
I don't want to sound like I'm against the idea, I'd just challenge you to find areas where a lot of people are walking or could walk from home to stores, in Oly/Lacey/Tumwater. There might be a few in the bigger NW cities, by accident or design, but I do think it's largely a cultural difference. City buses are largely empty, you can't even get us to carpool, we're so attached to our cars.
Or bikes. Lots of biking, even fairly long distances.
Bellingham is a college town, which often means more walking. Colleges change the layout and dynamic, on and around campus and nearby housing, students walk. Not sure that's where others want to buy homes.
Last edited by Diana Holbrook; 07-13-2017 at 07:30 PM..
I don't want to sound like I'm against the idea, I'd just challenge you to find areas where a lot of people are walking or could walk from home to stores, in Oly/Lacey/Tumwater. There might be a few in the bigger NW cities, by accident or design, but I do think it's largely a cultural difference. City buses are largely empty, you can't even get us to carpool, we're so attached to our cars.
Or bikes. Lots of biking, even fairly long distances.
Bellingham is a college town, which often means more walking. Colleges change the layout and dynamic, on and around campus and nearby housing, students walk. Not sure that's where others want to buy homes.
Lol. I'm not debating that Oly/Lacey/Tumwater isn't set up all that well for walking, just your general skepticism that people in the NW want to walk if they have the opportunity to do so.
Have you visited Bellingham in the last 20 years? Have you lived anywhere else in the last 20 years? Yes, WWU is a decent sized university, but you'd never know that in most of the town. You're right that it does help the dynamic for others, and results in better transportation and foot traffic in certain areas. But I'm not talking about college students, I'm talking about young adults, families, and retirees. Most of the neighborhoods I'm referring to aren't near campus, and none of the people we recently got into bidding wars with were students.
I AM absolutely sure that's where others want to buy homes. And if you look up listings in town, you'll see that the ability to walk to amenities is a key selling point and a big reason that old craftstman homes on relatively small lots are going for $300+ per sf. In my neighborhood, I see more regular foot activity than I saw in most of Denver and especially Charlotte, or Tampa where the layout made the regions suburban ghost towns and you could drive through large swaths without seeing anyone walking down the street. Again, those places aren't the NE, I realize. And I'm not claiming for a second that we hold a candle to places with much higher density. But it is surprising nonetheless. FWIW, the biggest tourist draw here is a bike/hike boardwalk trail that connects our two hubs of activity, Fairhaven and downtown. Of course, it also helps that we're sandwiched in between two big, very expensive cities. But I still see more people walking than other places I've lived, and for all the people I know who have recently purchased homes, walkability is a premium, a luxury to be able to do.
Finally, I'm glad you mentioned bikes. We bike all the time, too. But I think you're missing the point-a lot of people bike because the distance between places is too great to conveniently walk, not solely because they love bikes! Why? Because density matters. Give people housing with proximity to grocery, food and dining options and people respond. Seriously, look up listings in Fairhaven, Happy Valley, Sehome, Downtown, South Hill, York, Sunnyland, Lettered Streets, Columbia neighborhoods- anything above a walkscore of 70 or so- and you'll likely see that convenience is the main selling point. That is, if you can even find a remotely affordable listing at all in the places I just mentioned. Come visit and I'll be glad to show you around.
Gotta go for now- we have to walk over to the produce stand, then hit Trader Joe's before grabbing a beer at Kulshan Brewing. A normal night in the hood and we love it.
Last edited by bartonizer; 07-13-2017 at 09:02 PM..
Lol. I'm not debating that Oly/Lacey/Tumwater isn't set up all that well for walking, just your general skepticism that people in the NW want to walk if they have the opportunity to do so.
I think they walk... they just don't walk to shop. They walk for fun and fitness and other reasons, at parks, or nature trails. .... That they probably drive to.
Quote:
Finally, I'm glad you mentioned bikes. We bike all the time, too. But I think you're missing the point-a lot of people bike because the distance between places is too great to conveniently walk, not solely because they love bikes! Why? Because density matters.
I think they walk... they just don't walk to shop. They walk for fun and fitness and other reasons, at parks, or nature trails. .... That they probably drive to.
I think that's what I said, isn't it?
I will concede to you on Bellingham. NOT my area.
True, but outside of literally a handful of major cities in the United States, no one in this country really does a lot of serious shopping without their cars. It's certainly not unique to the Pac NW in any shape or fashion, that's all I'm saying.
If you were agreeing about density, I didn't see it and apologize. But low density, sprawling design dominates in this country, and there are some good examples of effective pedestrian environments in this state, too- even if they're just small areas in towns. Again, here in Bellingham many neighborhoods have a decent grocery store and even restaurants close to residential.
Finally, there's a huge demand right now for walkable places like the OP is looking for- and the demographics with those demands range from people getting out of college to retirees. Sure, most of the the people in Bellingham still have cars- but some people don't, and many couples can exist on one, etc. But people here seem more willing to use alternate forms of transportation than other places I've lived before, so I guess it's all relative.
We do have restaurants downtown, but the shops downtown are antique stores, art shops, and touristy kinds of boutiques. If you are downtown and need to buy groceries, you're going to need to drive there. There is a grocery downtown, but no homes near it. Where the homes are, there are no groceries.
True about the downtown shops. I live downtown and have no need to go to a vast majority of the places down here. As you mention though there are quite a number of restaurants however which is nice and walking the boardwalk or around the lake is quite pleasant as well.
Thank you all for your posts. Your responses have been quite informative, although it's disappointing to hear there aren't any recommendations.:-(.
Perhaps the difference here on the east coast is that some of our cities and towns were built when cars weren't as plentiful and people walked to run errands. Unfortunately, here too these walkable neighborhoods are the exception, since we definitely have more than our share of strip malls with Costcos, grocery stores, chain restaurants, etc., but in our next move we're looking for a place to live which could offers us the opportunity for what would be called 'purposeful' exercise when doing the activities of daily living like walking/biking to work, going shopping, etc. For example, here in VA our youngest daughter doesn't even own a car since she lives in a town where she walks 30 - 40 minutes to work each way and she and her husband walk to get their groceries or go out to eat. For excursions over an hour they will take the Metro and for even longer outings they may Uber or rent a car. In contrast our oldest daughter living out on Johnson Point has to drive over 20 minutes just to pick up milk. We want a lifestyle similar to our youngest daugher but we want to live near the grandkids in Olympia.
So let me ask this - are there any neighborhoods (housing developments, planned communities) that are in close enough proximity to some nice strip malls (or is that an oxymoron?) that we could walk to get coffee, pick up some toothpaste, or grab a quick bite to eat (even if it's at a chain restaurant?) As an example, my daughter used to live in a neighborhood in Lacey, way down College Street, and the Chehalis Trail was just a couple of blocks away and a shopping center was within a 30 minute walk down sidewalks. We'd be interested in exploring some other communities like that, so if you know of some we should consider please let me know.
We may not be able to find exactly what we want, but I'm not ready to give up yet. :-)
So let me ask this - are there any neighborhoods (housing developments, planned communities) that are in close enough proximity to some nice strip malls (or is that an oxymoron?) that we could walk to get coffee, pick up some toothpaste, or grab a quick bite to eat (even if it's at a chain restaurant?) As an example, my daughter used to live in a neighborhood in Lacey, way down College Street, and the Chehalis Trail was just a couple of blocks away and a shopping center was within a 30 minute walk down sidewalks. We'd be interested in exploring some other communities like that, so if you know of some we should consider please let me know.
We may not be able to find exactly what we want, but I'm not ready to give up yet. :-)
Many thanks for sharing your opinions!
I lived on the west side (Olympia) by the mall for a year and there is lots of stuff over there to walk to. Just pop open google maps to see. Apart from everything in the mall you have 3 grocery stores within a couple minutes of each other, Target, a bunch of restaurants, cvs, rite aid, several coffee shops, pet stores etc etc.
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