Charming towns for a creative person (Seattle, Tacoma: live in, zoning, costs)

[texasdiver]

Originally Posted by Taz22

This subject is not really discussed on the moving to Washington threads. I know, because I started reading them a few years ago. I had no idea parts of rural Washington were so rough.

Yes. If you want enlightened civilized rural areas without monster trucks and guns you are much better off looking to rural Texas, Arkansas, Kentucky, Wyoming, Idaho, Mississippi, or Nevada.

[homesinseattle]

I think you could accomplish the vibe you are looking for in a number of places in Snohomish, like Fobes Hill or Dutch Hill, for example. Parts of North Bend, near Mount Si, would work too.

[Angry-Koala]

Originally Posted by Taz22

Many people know about the problems in rural Washington but don’t talk about it. This can create a problem for people who are interested in moving to a rural place, but don’t want West Virginia. I don’t get the secrecy surrounding rural poverty here, because it’s here.

No secrecy here. Most of us just don't notice it because it's what we grew up seeing.

What gets to me though is when people cut down forests or divide up pastures and put in giant, sprawling houses and giant, habitat-destroying lawns that provide no food or cover for most wildlife. I'll take neighbor with a junky yard and a small house surrounded by woods any day over the other kind of place. To each his own, I guess.

[Diana Holbrook]

Originally Posted by texasdiver

Wow, this is the most interesting thread I've read in a long time.

There is a LOT of rural poverty in the northwest that I think people from the outside are simply unaware of.

There is/was a lot of systemic rural poverty in SW WA that was brought on by changes in logging, and the loss of logging from Mt. St. Helens. The timber that was lost there and has been replanted will only start to come to maturity in another 10 years. The timber towns that were lost to the spotted owl.... well, they may never come back. Maybe some of those people will never come back.

Most of the areas we're talking about here in this thread are not systemically poor now. We're not that far out. We're less than 10 miles from the freeway. Lots of old timber towns; Tenino, Rochester, Winlock, Napavine, Shelton, are finding new life and new growth as bedroom and feeder communities around Olympia/Lacey/Tumwater. People don't all want to live in town, and these older rural areas allow everyone to afford a nice place with 5-10 acres, a few local services and a 30 minute commute into town proper.

The poor of concern out here are are a symptom of the wider drug problem in the country. It's not lack of opportunity, it's addiction. They're not centered in any particular area... they're all over. There aren't more of them in the country than in town... I think most people are just surprised they ARE in the country. You expect poor and homeless in the city... not camping in the woods... but they are. Either out where land values are still really cheap, or they've been there a long time, or they're squatting. It varies, In Tenino within a few square miles you can find lots that are worth $20K, and a mansion worth 11 million. The value of land here is all about what's been done with it, or whether it's ever under water... Or has pocket gophers, or...

Half the guys I new in HS are still into hunting, fishing, and big trucks judging from their facebook feeds which are mostly poses in front of steelhead they have caught or mule deer they have shot. And lately posing with guns, cammo, and MAGA hats. And they are in their 50s. It's the same in Western Washington as it is in rural Oregon.

Yes, but I don't associate those hobbies necessarily with poverty, it's just enjoyment of the great outdoors. That's why so many people want to be here. The woods! Same as people who are into horses and trail riding. Even professional people ride horses and fish and hunt and like to get out in the woods on weekend. And that takes a big truck and a boat or a house in the country. All walks of life fish and hunt around here. Some do it to get out and see the scenery. Some do it to eat. Some of both.

As a school teacher I see a LOT of rural poverty and kids living in really struggling families even in this economy. Very often they are families with small businesses in small towns that are struggling or failing, but they are still trying to show a good face.

Local business is hard in lots of places, with people preferring Costco to the local grocer and Home Depot to the local hardware store. The right kind of businesses are thriving in these little towns though... it's changing and many of these little towns are thriving now. Restaurants are good business now, and organic local farm and fruit stands, services like mechanics, carpenters and roofers, gas station and a church. Stuff people still need to live in the country and get into work in town.

If you want to avoid even the sight of it then don't move to rural towns in the Pacific Northwest, or find giant master-planned communities like Sunriver where the poor are zoned out of existence.

Yes.

[homesinseattle]

Originally Posted by Angry-Koala

No secrecy here. Most of us just don't notice it because it's what we grew up seeing.

What gets to me though is when people cut down forests or divide up pastures and put in giant, sprawling houses and giant, habitat-destroying lawns that provide no food or cover for most wildlife. I'll take neighbor with a junky yard and a small house surrounded by woods any day over the other kind of place. To each his own, I guess.

Koala, having traveled many country roads, I can tell you there is a difference between normal, functional, country things in a yard and a methy, no pride, hillbilly yard. Many country people keep their homes and yards very nice, some don't. I think that is the difference.

[Diana Holbrook]

Originally Posted by texasdiver

Yes. If you want enlightened civilized rural areas without monster trucks and guns you are much better off looking to rural Texas, Arkansas, Kentucky, Wyoming, Idaho, Mississippi, or Nevada.

[Taz22]

Originally Posted by texasdiver

Yes. If you want enlightened civilized rural areas without monster trucks and guns you are much better off looking to rural Texas, Arkansas, Kentucky, Wyoming, Idaho, Mississippi, or Nevada.

Hummm, I used to live in rural Texas and it was kind of similar to here. No days long fireworks, but plenty of loud parties, guns and big trucks. Next time around, closer in to a big city would be better. No small town is enlightened but some are worse than others. And I’ll add, rural Texas had some of the most disfunctional teens on the planet.

[Taz22]

Originally Posted by homesinseattle

Koala, having traveled many country roads, I can tell you there is a difference between normal, functional, country things in a yard and a methy, no pride, hillbilly yard. Many country people keep their homes and yards very nice, some don't. I think that is the difference.

Homes, you nailed it.

[Taz22]

Originally Posted by homesinseattle

I think you could accomplish the vibe you are looking for in a number of places in Snohomish, like Fobes Hill or Dutch Hill, for example. Parts of North Bend, near Mount Si, would work too.

Thanks, next year we’ll talk. I’ve narrowed it down to parts of Washington, Oregon and possibly Couer d’alene Idaho.

[texasdiver]

Originally Posted by Diana Holbrook

Most of the areas we're talking about here in this thread are not systemically poor now. We're not that far out. We're less than 10 miles from the freeway. Lots of old timber towns; Tenino, Rochester, Winlock, Napavine, Shelton, are finding new life and new growth as bedroom and feeder communities around Olympia/Lacey/Tumwater. People don't all want to live in town, and these older rural areas allow everyone to afford a nice place with 5-10 acres, a few local services and a 30 minute commute into town proper.

Yes, any place within remotely reasonable commuting distance of Seattle/Tacoma or Portland is going to have lots of growth and economic opportunity. And I guess Olympia and Salem too. It's the places farther out where land is cheap that one sees much more pervasive rural poverty: Grays Harbor, Roseburg, Yakima, Coos Bay, Longview, Tillamook, etc.