Rate the climate: Portland, OR (cloud, months, East, winters)

[Patricius Maximus]

Originally Posted by westcoast30

I don't think it's so much the rain as is the overcast. Constant overcast skies and lack of sunshine can have a negative mental impact on people, and it's been researched and proven.

On some people, not all. As this quote says...

Originally Posted by lookinforhorseparadise

One other point to make is that not everyone has SAD. Not everyone enjoys endless bright sun.

I for one dislike sunshine and it has a negative impact on me, and for you to sit there and claim that everyone in the human species by necessity must relish sunshine I think is quite offensive, ignorant, and dismissive. Perhaps it would help you to read up on summer S.A.D. You may find it enlightening.

Originally Posted by westcoast30

Portland doesn't seem to have extreme weather like blizzards which I think would be a plus for many people, but the sunshine totals are very low and for some it could be a tough place.

I respect the fact that it may be too cloudy for many people, but the notion it has very low sunshine totals is a laugh. 2400 hours of sunshine per year is what I'd consider to be quite sunny; it's twice as sunny as many parts of Europe, and it's more than 50% of the possible total. Portland occasionally gets sunshine even in the cloudy winter, and there is practically endless sunshine in summertime, so I'd say Portland is a sunny place.

Originally Posted by lookinforhorseparadise

In fact, after moving to St. Augustine, FL I made the discovery that the bright sun triggers TERRIBLE migraines. I had migraines before I moved here from the DC area, but nothing like this. I would LOVE to move somewhere cloudier. I also break out in rashes from the sun, not just sun burn, but actual rashes. I would say Florida is great if you approach it like the wealthy did in the old days, come in DEC or JAN for a month or two, three MAX!! Then get the hell out. We had 90s already this spring. I used the a/c nearly year round. Electric bills are HUGE!
I am looking to get out asap!

I'm the same way. Bright sunshine can trigger headaches in me, too, but my headaches are more associated with heat exhaustion than with anything else, and they are often coupled with lightheadedness. However I find bright sun to be in any case quite draining and straining on my eyes, and it also heats me up tremendously. If the temperature is around 20F that just means shedding a layer, which is no problem, but in anything much above 50F discomfort can result. I've never been south of the 30th parallel, so I imagine my adverse reaction to sunshine would be worse in Florida.

Originally Posted by dunno what to put here

I am exactly the same as you. When in the sun I sweat easily and end up getting 'prickly heat', very itchy and annoying, like you're burning. Does not happen all the time, but when it does, it's not pleasant.

And heat gives me migraines too, especially combined with humidity.

I get the "prickly heat" too, and on a frequent basis anytime the temperature is above 70F and I'm doing anything more physical than slow walking. With temperatures of 70F or higher coupled with bright sunshine I get nausea as well, and in the more advanced stages I get headaches and lightheadedness. I've come close to passing out a couple of times, but fortunately I've made sure it never comes to that. Adding to my litany of problems is high humidity making it hard to breathe. Anything with a dew point close to or above 60F is an uncomfortable nuisance, above 70F is difficult, and a dew point of 75F makes it difficult to breathe. 79F is about the dew point threshold where I feel there's an elephant on my chest and can hardly breathe. Asphyxiation is naturally a danger. I also have a mild allergy to pollen, which is no fun because my nose often gets irritated as well. There's also another feeling I get when the sun is shining on me in hot weather, that feels like my hair is going to burn off my head along with some regions of skin.

Originally Posted by dunno what to put here

But the thought of dry heat also fills me with dread, especially after reading a blog about the side effects of a heatwave in Phoenix.. hell on earth.

I have a strong preference for dry as opposed to humid conditions, so given similar temperatures I'd take dry heat over humid heat in a heartbeat. However, any heat over a certain level is awful, dry or not. Humidity just makes the already bad condition much worse. My preferences work this way:

No heat > Dry heat > Humid heat

Originally Posted by Lamplight

I always wondered if I was the only one who experienced that itchiness in hot weather. In TN my arms and legs (mostly) would always become strangely itchy when the weather got warm, and it drove me nuts.

You have that too? Then it appears to not be an isolated phenomenon. It's still strange, but my previous thinking about it possibly having something to do with dry skin seems to be incorrect . It's an awful feeling, and driving one nuts is a perfect description.

Originally Posted by Kaul

better yet, I'll just avoid the whole situation. I would rather bike at -50 than 90, truth be told.

As bad as -50F sounds, I think I agree with you. Intense physical activity such as bike riding in 90F weather for me is potentially lethal, whereas I can't say the same about -50F assuming I have proper layers. Of course handling a bike in all those layers of snow pants may prove unwieldy .

Originally Posted by Lamplight

Actually, even though I'm a firm heat-hater, I can bike in 90 degree weather and not be terribly uncomfortable. Stopping, however, is an entirely different matter. And the fact that after a 20 minute ride in 90 degree heat I'll need 30 minutes in an air conditioned 75 degrees (or less) to cool off. But during the ride, it's not quite so horrible. I'd rather ride in 20 degree weather any day, though.

I've found that any wind chill effect, which for me is practically nonexistent in the first place, is more than canceled out by the increase in my body heat and sweat from that kind of physical activity. Physical activity in 90F weather, or even 80F weather, for me is something I must eschew lest dire health consequences come into the picture.

I agree that I'd take 20F weather for bike riding. I've done it many times before and it's nice and invigorating, and almost heavenly. In these conditions the tremendous increase in body heat is helpful, rather than a hinderance.

Originally Posted by Candle

Not to get too off topic but 45F is my favorite temp for biking. 20F would be fine too.

However I'd say 45F is a very pleasant temperature for me to do any sort of physical exercise. Anywhere from 35-55F is great for "summer sports", for lack of a better phrase. I'd probably be pretty comfortable partaking in the Greenlander's soccer matches .

[Lamplight]

Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus

I've found that any wind chill effect, which for me is practically nonexistent in the first place, is more than canceled out by the increase in my body heat and sweat from that kind of physical activity. Physical activity in 90F weather, or even 80F weather, for me is something I must eschew lest dire health consequences come into the picture.

For me a lot also depends on the sun and humidity. For example, when I used to bike to work in TN, the last half mile of my commute put me in direct sunlight. On a typical summer morning, the temperature would be 69-75 with a similar dew point, which was almost bearable in the shade while moving on the bike, but once I got into the sun I would really start to notice discomfort. I could ride in not-quite-but-almost comfort for the entire commute until I reached that last half mile, which was the perfect (worst?) combination of direct sunlight, humidity, and my body reaching it's peak internal warmth for the duration of the commute. Then I'd get to work and as soon as I stopped riding the sweat would really begin. A typical commute home would be 89+ with about the same dew point, but much lower relative humidity and less shade. Still, I usually wouldn't be completely miserable until I stopped moving for more than a few seconds. When I'd get home I'd take off half my clothes, turn my large fan on high, and sit on the floor in front of it for about 30 minutes (with the AC set to 74-76). So while I may not be extremely uncomfortable during the ride, the aftermath was horrible.

Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus

I agree that I'd take 20F weather for bike riding. I've done it many times before and it's nice and invigorating, and almost heavenly. In these conditions the tremendous increase in body heat is helpful, rather than a hinderance.

Well I'm not so hearty that I can say riding in 20F weather was "heavenly", it was certainly more comfortable to me than riding in heat. My face and hands would get cold, sometimes even hurt a little, but otherwise it didn't bother me. And after I stopped riding, cooling off only required removing my jacket for a few minutes, and not a half hour ritual full of misery. I've ridden in weather colder than 20F, down to about 3F, but at those lower temperatures I would tend to overdress (not being used to it) so that parts of me would actually be too warm, while other parts would still be cold. Cycling in colder weather can be tricky because you have to remind yourself to wear less clothing than you may at first be inclined to. I found that if I'm a little too cold for comfort at the beginning of the ride, then by the end I'll be just right.

[nei]

Originally Posted by Lamplight

Actually, even though I'm a firm heat-hater, I can bike in 90 degree weather and not be terribly uncomfortable. Stopping, however, is an entirely different matter. And the fact that after a 20 minute ride in 90 degree heat I'll need 30 minutes in an air conditioned 75 degrees (or less) to cool off. But during the ride, it's not quite so horrible. I'd rather ride in 20 degree weather any day, though.

Dryish (dew point low 60s or less, better if mid 50s) 90°F is mostly enjoyable for me as long as the sun's not beating done me. Air conditioning is nice afterwards, but don't need it. In midday sun with no shade, 90°F can brutal and sun sick head ache inducing. I'd take 90°F over 20°F for riding any day. In hot weather, sun exposure and to a lesser extent dew point matters less than temperatures for riding comfort.

Worst cycling combination I can remember is 40s in pouring rain with insufficient rain gear. Rain gear helps, helps then it's raining inside. Miserable situation either way, and dangerous.

[nei]

Originally Posted by Lamplight

For me a lot also depends on the sun and humidity. For example, when I used to bike to work in TN, the last half mile of my commute put me in direct sunlight. On a typical summer morning, the temperature would be 69-75 with a similar dew point, which was almost bearable in the shade while moving on the bike, but once I got into the sun I would really start to notice discomfort. I could ride in not-quite-but-almost comfort for the entire commute until I reached that last half mile, which was the perfect (worst?) combination of direct sunlight, humidity, and my body reaching it's peak internal warmth for the duration of the commute. Then I'd get to work and as soon as I stopped riding the sweat would really begin. A typical commute home would be 89+ with about the same dew point, but much lower relative humidity and less shade. Still, I usually wouldn't be completely miserable until I stopped moving for more than a few seconds. When I'd get home I'd take off half my clothes, turn my large fan on high, and sit on the floor in front of it for about 30 minutes (with the AC set to 74-76). So while I may not be extremely uncomfortable during the ride, the aftermath was horrible.

Your biggest issue might just be the combination of high dew point. Your dew points in TN are much higher than typical 90°F MA weather so the experience would be very different.

Well I'm not so hearty that I can say riding in 20F weather was "heavenly", it was certainly more comfortable to me than riding in heat. My face and hands would get cold, sometimes even hurt a little, but otherwise it didn't bother me. And after I stopped riding, cooling off only required removing my jacket for a few minutes, and not a half hour ritual full of misery. I've ridden in weather colder than 20F, down to about 3F, but at those lower temperatures I would tend to overdress (not being used to it) so that parts of me would actually be too warm, while other parts would still be cold. Cycling in colder weather can be tricky because you have to remind yourself to wear less clothing than you may at first be inclined to. I found that if I'm a little too cold for comfort at the beginning of the ride, then by the end I'll be just right.

Biggest issue with cold weather cycling is you need lots of layers. If you bike in hilly terrain, constant layer switching is required. Lowest I've ridden in is low 10s I think, but not very many miles.

[Patricius Maximus]

Originally Posted by Lamplight

For me a lot also depends on the sun and humidity. For example, when I used to bike to work in TN, the last half mile of my commute put me in direct sunlight. On a typical summer morning, the temperature would be 69-75 with a similar dew point, which was almost bearable in the shade while moving on the bike, but once I got into the sun I would really start to notice discomfort. I could ride in not-quite-but-almost comfort for the entire commute until I reached that last half mile, which was the perfect (worst?) combination of direct sunlight, humidity, and my body reaching it's peak internal warmth for the duration of the commute. Then I'd get to work and as soon as I stopped riding the sweat would really begin. A typical commute home would be 89+ with about the same dew point, but much lower relative humidity and less shade. Still, I usually wouldn't be completely miserable until I stopped moving for more than a few seconds. When I'd get home I'd take off half my clothes, turn my large fan on high, and sit on the floor in front of it for about 30 minutes (with the AC set to 74-76). So while I may not be extremely uncomfortable during the ride, the aftermath was horrible.

High humidity and bright sunlight definitely make it much worse for me as well. The main difference is that I seem to have a lower "baseline" than you do, i.e. I'm already miserable with just the heat itself. Sunshine exerts a tremendous influence on my comfort when the temperature is about 55-75 Fahrenheit, but it still doesn't determine my comfort as much as it does yours at any temperature . I guess the increase in discomfort on my scale is smoother as the temperature gets higher than yours is. Especially considering that I don't collapse on the floor like you do even at 65 or 75F with bright sunshine (the aftermath is horrible for me as well at 80+ F levels).

Well I'm not so hearty that I can say riding in 20F weather was "heavenly", it was certainly more comfortable to me than riding in heat. My face and hands would get cold, sometimes even hurt a little, but otherwise it didn't bother me. And after I stopped riding, cooling off only required removing my jacket for a few minutes, and not a half hour ritual full of misery.

Interesting. In that sort of weather often parts of my body can be too cold (or even too hot!) but generally I find cycling in moderately cold weather (20's Fahrenheit) to be quite pleasant. Of course that's with proper clothing, which for me would still be lighter than most people's (but still definitely not as light as short sleeves ).

The only time my hands ever got so cold they were a bit painful or numb was a couple of incidents in wet weather with temperatures around 40F. It was mostly the cold water rather than the air, but parts of my body were getting way too cold. This was mostly due to improper clothing - I didn't have gloves suited for that sort of weather at that time . It was a simple matter to warm up my hands, though, and my face was already protected by my raincoat's storm flap and my ski goggles (this may seem odd, but ski goggles are suited for wind-driven rain as well as snow).

Cycling in colder weather can be tricky because you have to remind yourself to wear less clothing than you may at first be inclined to. I found that if I'm a little too cold for comfort at the beginning of the ride, then by the end I'll be just right.

That's true. Balancing out the factors of the bodily heating, temperature, and wind chill can be a mental exercise in and of itself. There's also the factor in long rides of the temperature changing during your ride. If you start out on a high-range day in the morning and the temperature is 10F, and you ride for a few hours, the temperature may be 20F or more when you're finished.

Generally I'd say it's better to start out too cold and work one's body up to just right than to start out just right and have to shed layers later on (naturally they're difficult to haul around on such a vehicle).

[Lamplight]

Originally Posted by nei

Dryish (dew point low 60s or less, better if mid 50s) 90°F is mostly enjoyable for me as long as the sun's not beating done me. Air conditioning is nice afterwards, but don't need it. In midday sun with no shade, 90°F can brutal and sun sick head ache inducing. I'd take 90°F over 20°F for riding any day. In hot weather, sun exposure and to a lesser extent dew point matters less than temperatures for riding comfort.

Worst cycling combination I can remember is 40s in pouring rain with insufficient rain gear. Rain gear helps, helps then it's raining inside. Miserable situation either way, and dangerous.

Riding in rain, especially a heavy rain, in regular clothes is truly miserable. Before I had any rain gear, I'd commute in regular clothes, get soaked, and change into dry clothes at work. That worked, but what a miserable ride! Actually, I always had a relatively water proof jacket, but that was all.

Originally Posted by nei

Your biggest issue might just be the combination of high dew point. Your dew points in TN are much higher than typical 90°F MA weather so the experience would be very different.

I'd say it definitely is my biggest issue. I distinctly recall one 4th of July several years back, I went for a fairly long ride with my parents. The temperature that day was in the mid to high 80s, but the dew point was abnormally low for TN (low 50s, I think). I was mostly comfortable while riding, and only a little uncomfortable after stopping, as long as I stayed in the shade. Even in the sun it wasn't horrible, though certainly not ideal for me.

Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus

High humidity and bright sunlight definitely make it much worse for me as well. The main difference is that I seem to have a lower "baseline" than you do, i.e. I'm already miserable with just the heat itself. Sunshine exerts a tremendous influence on my comfort when the temperature is about 55-75 Fahrenheit, but it still doesn't determine my comfort as much as it does yours at any temperature . I guess the increase in discomfort on my scale is smoother as the temperature gets higher than yours is. Especially considering that I don't collapse on the floor like you do even at 65 or 75F with bright sunshine (the aftermath is horrible for me as well at 80+ F levels).

I should clarify that my "lying on the floor in front of the fan to cool off" ritual mainly just applied to riding home in 90+ temps with lower afternoon humidity. A temperature of 75 in the afternoon, even with high humidity, didn't require nearly as much cooling off for me, though I'd still stand in front of a fan for a few minutes. The super humid, 70-75 degree morning ride was a killer, though. At work we had one of those huge industrial floor fans that are about four feet tall, and I'd just stand in front of it for a while, trying to dry up some of the sweat. If I didn't have any work to do right away, I'd give up on that and just go sit in the air conditioned office for as long as I could get away with. But as soon as I had to do anything at all in the warehouse, I'd quickly be covered in sweat, so it was kind of fruitless to try and cool off in the first place.

Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus

Interesting. In that sort of weather often parts of my body can be too cold (or even too hot!) but generally I find cycling in moderately cold weather (20's Fahrenheit) to be quite pleasant. Of course that's with proper clothing, which for me would still be lighter than most people's (but still definitely not as light as short sleeves ).

The only time my hands ever got so cold they were a bit painful or numb was a couple of incidents in wet weather with temperatures around 40F. It was mostly the cold water rather than the air, but parts of my body were getting way too cold. This was mostly due to improper clothing - I didn't have gloves suited for that sort of weather at that time . It was a simple matter to warm up my hands, though, and my face was already protected by my raincoat's storm flap and my ski goggles (this may seem odd, but ski goggles are suited for wind-driven rain as well as snow).

The only parts of me that ever got too cold were my hands, face, and sometimes feet. I never had a good method for covering my face, and since my commute was short I never bothered. My hands were my biggest problem. No matter what gloves I used, my hands would always get cold at lower temperatures. I rarely spent money on true cycling gear except for wet weather clothing and cold weather gloves. No matter what the temperature, my normal street/work clothes were adequate for cold weather. But for my hands, I went as far as to purchase some fairly expensive, true cold weather cycling gloves. And they definitely helped, but my fingers would still get cold. Obviously not enough to make me stop commuting, though.

Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus

That's true. Balancing out the factors of the bodily heating, temperature, and wind chill can be a mental exercise in and of itself. There's also the factor in long rides of the temperature changing during your ride. If you start out on a high-range day in the morning and the temperature is 10F, and you ride for a few hours, the temperature may be 20F or more when you're finished.

Generally I'd say it's better to start out too cold and work one's body up to just right than to start out just right and have to shed layers later on (naturally they're difficult to haul around on such a vehicle).

I always commuted on bikes that had at least some sort of luggage, so storing extra layers wasn't usually a problem. In TN, mostly in spring and fall, the morning to afternoon temperature difference can vary so much that I might need to wear all-out winter clothing in the morning, and on the ride home I might be wearing just a t-shirt and jeans (and sweating!). In fact this was so common that, more often than not, I'd ride home with at least one layer stored in my bag.

[Weatherfan2]

Originally Posted by Lamplight

Riding in rain, especially a heavy rain, in regular clothes is truly miserable. Before I had any rain gear, I'd commute in regular clothes, get soaked, and change into dry clothes at work. That worked, but what a miserable ride! Actually, I always had a relatively water proof jacket, but that was all.

Cycling on wet roads even without the rain can be dangerous.

Five years ago I went storm chasing on my bicycle (before I upgraded to a car), and coming back, I rode quite quick downhill, on a wet road. I tried to stop for a junction, skidded, couldn't stop in time, fell off, and went into a stationary car. The bike was less than a week old. I also received injury.

[nei]

Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus

Anything with a dew point close to or above 60F is an uncomfortable nuisance, above 70F is difficult, and a dew point of 75F makes it difficult to breathe. 79F is about the dew point threshold where I feel there's an elephant on my chest and can hardly breathe.

Where have you experienced a dew point of 79°F enough to comment on it?

[nei]

Originally Posted by Lamplight

Riding in rain, especially a heavy rain, in regular clothes is truly miserable. Before I had any rain gear, I'd commute in regular clothes, get soaked, and change into dry clothes at work. That worked, but what a miserable ride! Actually, I always had a relatively water proof jacket, but that was all.

I find biking in very warm heavy rain (Temperature mid to high 70s, dew point low to mid 70s). No chill, any sweat gets washed off. Natural shower!

[Patricius Maximus]

Originally Posted by Weatherfan2

Cycling on wet roads even without the rain can be dangerous.

Five years ago I went storm chasing on my bicycle (before I upgraded to a car), and coming back, I rode quite quick downhill, on a wet road. I tried to stop for a junction, skidded, couldn't stop in time, fell off, and went into a stationary car. The bike was less than a week old. I also received injury.

It carries increased hazard, however if one is careful and exercises caution there is very little risk. It's the same concept as driving a car in the rain.

Originally Posted by nei

Where have you experienced a dew point of 79°F enough to comment on it?

To the depths of hell and back .

Originally Posted by nei

I find biking in very warm heavy rain (Temperature mid to high 70s, dew point low to mid 70s). No chill, any sweat gets washed off. Natural shower!

Blech. I prefer not to get soaked, but if I have to get soaked I'd much rather do it in a cold rain than a warm rain. Sure, I'd get chilled, but it's a lot more refreshing than the steambath the rain you outlined provides. Besides, I'm not a fan of taking a shower fully clothed .