Spring 2012 Thread (March-May) (hot, averages, temperature, Chicago)

[susancruzs]

Very true here, too! We had major rain (wish I had my gauge out) and less than 65 mis. north of me over 16" of snow!

We are supposed to get mid-40's early next week, very strange weather. There is absolutely no snow in my yard, not even at the end of my driveway.

[Patricius Maximus]

Originally Posted by dhdh

Then we are both happy Sophie because I'm looking forward to the summer

Transition seasons can do strange things to people....

Right now I'm in Hong Kong and have been so for the past week, and although I was extremely happy to be here for personal reasons, the weather was absolutely crappy and couldn't feel less springlike. I haven't seen the sun for the whole week, it was abundantly foggy with some light rains and temps didn't exceed 15°C on most days, staying even below 13°C a few days ago.

I'd consider those temperatures very spring-like, in fact almost summer-like, especially since as far as I can tell there is no significant cooling at night. The overall conditions I'd consider spring-like or near-summer-like, although I agree with you that all that rain, humidity, and fog for a straight week certainly doesn't fit the archetypal spring.

Of course I have a different conception of "Spring" than you do (mine being colder), not that it matters much given that Hong Kong doesn't have seasons as they are normally understood, that being something at least resembling the Chicago-like four-season set. They just have a dry, very warm season and a wet, very hot season. Vegetation never goes dormant, and as far as vegetation goes it's perpetual summer. So as I pointed out in this thread, "Spring" doesn't exist in a place that doesn't have a winter (dormancy for plants) to transition out of or a summer to transition into (plants active). A place may have Spring in the sense of temperatures getting hotter, but that's something else entirely, as is "Spring" in the chronological (Mar-Apr-May) sense.

Originally Posted by msev

@dhdh

Hong Kong is sub-tropical

Yes, it is, but barely, since the coldest month's mean temperature is 61F, just shy of the 64F threshold needed to be tropical. So Hong Kong can fairly be called "near-tropical" as well as "subtropical".

I would also like to point out that HK has a seasonal lag; March's average daily mean is 66F, well shy of November's 71F. Also there's a big plunge in sunshine hours in February, and very cloudy conditions last through April (all three months having 102 hours of sun or less out of around 350 possible). All that kind of ruins anything resembling a Spring vibe. Contrast with some place like Shreveport, Louisiana (marginal winter dormancy for plants), which has a seasonal lead in "Spring" (Feb/Mar much warmer than Nov/Dec) and increased raw sunshine totals in February and March.

[nei]

Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus

I would also like to point out that HK has a seasonal lag; March's average daily mean is 66F, well shy of November's 71F. Also there's a big plunge in sunshine hours in February, and very cloudy conditions last through April (all three months having 102 hours of sun or less out of around 350 possible). All that kind of ruins anything resembling a Spring vibe. Contrast with some place like Shreveport, Louisiana (marginal winter dormancy for plants), which has a seasonal lead in "Spring" (Feb/Mar much warmer than Nov/Dec) and increased raw sunshine totals in February and March.

Huh. I thought it was usual for March to be closer to December. In Long Island, April is a bit warmer than November, but November is much closer to March.

[dunno what to put here]

Many places in the UK have avg. low temperatures in March lower then in December, and lower in April then in November.

[ben86]

In terms of weather/flora it's been spring for 10 days or so down here but the meteorological spring has carried on more or less from where it left off last year: so far spring 2012 has had temperatures 3-4C above average, sunshine double what we'd expect and bone dry...here we go again?

[Weatherfan2]

Here (Buxton) March temperatures are comparable to November. However it is much sunnier and therefore often feels milder. I went for a walk earlier and could acutally smell the spring in the air. I wonder what the smell actually is. I particularly like days in spring when it is dry and starts cool and crisp then warms up to a pleasant 12-18°C or so like last March/April.

[tigre79]

Originally Posted by Weatherfan2

Here (Buxton) March temperatures are comparable to November. However it is much sunnier and therefore often feels milder.

Same here, and the precipitation days are about the same between those two months as well, but we're getting our daylight back so it just feels better. And there's a good snowpack too, so there's lots of outdoor fun to be had. That's really what this time of year is about here. Lots of snow, plenty of light, and warmer temps. We won't get our first crocuses or daffodils until the end of April, but new growth starts in earnest after that. Last year I had to mow the lawn while there were still patches of snow in the yard.

[Patricius Maximus]

Originally Posted by nei

Huh. I thought it was usual for March to be closer to December. In Long Island, April is a bit warmer than November, but November is much closer to March.

It is commonplace for March to be close to December, especially for locations that have a maritime influence such as yours. However it's also commonplace for March to be comparable to November, and some places even have a "seasonal lead", such as most of the Southeast U.S. in late Winter and Spring, and interior Alaska in Summer. Of course all of these lag the peaks and troughs in insolation, but the worldwide average of interiors and coasts or the standard is for (this is for northern readers; just invert the months for the southern) DJF to be winter, with January being the coldest month and December and February each a bit warmer and comparable to each other, JJA to be summer with July the hottest month and June and August being a bit cooler and comparable to each other, and even transition seasons (Nov, Mar being comparable; Apr, Oct being comparable; Sep, May being comparable). Of course this is just a standard or measuring stick; many places with a maritime influence lag greatly from this, and many deep interiors lead this schedule.

Originally Posted by Weatherfan2

Here (Buxton) March temperatures are comparable to November. However it is much sunnier and therefore often feels milder. I went for a walk earlier and could acutally smell the spring in the air. I wonder what the smell actually is. I particularly like days in spring when it is dry and starts cool and crisp then warms up to a pleasant 12-18°C or so like last March/April.

Add in the fact that you're coming out of winter instead of coming out of summer/going into winter and you have a month that feels warmer, with sunshine, day length, acclimation, and trajectory conspiring to make people like Weatherfan2 feel better than they would in November.

That smell definitely has something to do with the plants, perhaps pollen or some sort of chemicals, or microflora.

[nei]

Originally Posted by Patricius Maximus

June and August being a bit cooler and comparable to each other, and even transition seasons (Nov, Mar being comparable; Apr, Oct being comparable; Sep, May being comparable). Of course this is just a standard or measuring stick; many places with a maritime influence lag greatly from this, and many deep interiors lead this schedule.

Your standard is for very continental places. January and February are roughly the same in most of the interior Northeast. Ditto with July and August. And for coastal places, the same is true; you have to go well into the interior to get your standard. I've never experienced your "standard".

Huh. Looks like the Feb = Dec pattern is more common in the southeast than I realized. I'm not very familiar with the south. Still find hard to believe that's normal, and not some regional quirk.

[Patricius Maximus]

Originally Posted by nei

Your standard is for very continental places. January and February are roughly the same in most of the interior Northeast.

When I refer to "interiors", I'm thinking of a place like the Midwestern United States, not the interior Northeast . Of course even in most continental climates February is warmer than December (less so than in New Hampshire though) but there are many exceptions. There are also places that are ahead of this schedule but none of them are in the eastern United States.

Although most places in the world will lag my standard I think it's a good one to apply, if only roughly. Most lagging from this is due to maritime influence which is gained from proximity to a coastline or from humid air. Most of the Eastern U.S. has humid airmasses or are close to the coastline. There are exceptions - in most of the interior Southeastern U.S. February/March are significantly warmer than November/December. In the whole of the interior Western U.S. it is the rule for December and January to be the coldest months, with February being a lot warmer, and in many places December and January are about even, just as January and February are in your region. In Interior Alaska it is the rule for June and July to be the hottest months, and for August to be a lot cooler.

This list proves there are many examples of the standard being met or led, just as there are many examples of it being lagged, even if lagging is more typical. And you're right - the standard is for a continental climate, being closer to the heat retention of land than water, but that's the whole point - to assess the maritime influence and lag of a particular spot. You could just as easily create another standard based on a very continental climate (such as Jun/Jul being hottest and Dec/Jan being coldest), or a very oceanic climate (such as Aug/Sep being hottest and Feb/Mar being coldest). The spectrum is the same, it just depends on where you place the zero point, and mine is a good place to put it and it reflects the meteorological seasons well .