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View Poll Results: China vs the United States:
China 9 12.33%
the United States 64 87.67%
Voters: 73. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-20-2020, 05:13 PM
 
41 posts, read 16,949 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QIDb602 View Post
These classifications are by no means arbitrary. The reality is that locations in China with the same midwinter temperatures as the US tend to be warmer on average throughout the year. You can't compare Beijing and Chicago or Boston because midwinter is similar. Beijing is more similar to the US upper South outside of winter

Places like Kentucky, Delaware, Virginia, West Virginia, Missouri, etc. have about the same average annual temperature as the North China Plain.

Also I put Henan in the cold category. In general I put states/provinces with the main population centers having average annual temperatures below 15.5-16C into the cold category.

Here are some comparisons. China doesn't use a simple (daily max+daily min)/2 formula and instead records temperature on four separate times per day. This causes China's average temperatures on Wikipedia to generally be colder. In order to make it a fair comparison, it needs to be (daily max+daily min)/2 both ways.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisv...ntucky#Climate 14.55C
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nanjin...nd_environment 16.35C [(20.6C+12.1C)/2]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Louis#Climate 13.9C
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhengzhou#Climate 15.1C

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charle...rginia#Climate 13.15C
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chengdu#Climate 16.9C
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geogra...eijing#Climate (1981-2010) 13.4C (!)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Virgin...rginia#Climate 15.7C
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shanghai#Climate 17.35C

Also the more maritime states like WA and OR have winters comparable to Shanghai but summers that are more like Shanghai's fall. Portland's annual temperature is a full degree colder than Beijing, and Seattle's is similar to Dalian, so they don't compare to South China. Even much of northern California has cooler average annual temperatures that are more comparable to those of the North China Plain.

And if you say that winter is more important or that highs are more important than lows, then make your own comparison. I am just comparing which one is objectively warmer/colder, not which one feels warmer/colder.

You’re not making much sense here, and yes, much of what you’re saying is arbitrary nonsense.

Kentucky, Delaware, Virginia, West Virginia, and most of Missouri, are dominated by a humid subtropical climate, with warmer average temoeratures relative to the same latitude in China. These states don’t AT ALL have mid winter averages matching those of the North China plain. If they did, they’d be categorized as humid continental states, and they aren’t.

The truth is, China is colder than the US for its latitude in the winter. That is an undeniable fact.

Beijing doesn’t at all have a climate comparable to the upper south. Due to the arid influence, it has a climate most similar to that of northern Kansas. Qingdao, a city just to the south of it, has a climate that distinctly matches New York, while still being colder than it, on average, in the winter.

You can approximate matching locations in each country to overcome the issue of the 3 degree latitudinal discrepency in winter climates for the two countries. Henan, for example, closely matches the temperature averages of Kentucky, whereas Jiangsu matches the temperature averages of much of Virginia. And the US still has warmer winters on average, when you compare these comparable regions.
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Old 02-20-2020, 05:17 PM
 
41 posts, read 16,949 times
Reputation: 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by marlaver View Post
China as a whole averages a mean T of 6.9ºC (all years of record keeping)
https://crudata.uea.ac.uk/~timm/cty/.../obs.China.htm
Or currently a mean of 7.6ºC
Berkeley Earth

USA as a whole averages a mean T of 8.5ºC (all years of record keeping)
https://crudata.uea.ac.uk/~timm/cty/...ta/obs.USA.htm
Or currently a mean of 9.6ºC
Berkeley Earth
I know. You can’t ignore the presence of the frigid and near subarctic Manchurian regions and northern plains, nor the frozen plateaus of China’s south and southwest. The US has similar climatic/geographic features, yet still.... Considering that, chilly-winter south China, with its still colder average winters than the southern US, don’t make up for anything. Even on an island below the Tropic of Cancer, China is humid subtropical until the southern tip of Hainan. The US has a plethora of tropical climates on the Florida peninsula just above the TOC.

The US averaging three whole degrees warmer as a whole even with Alaska is significant. It’s warmer.
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Old 02-20-2020, 05:53 PM
tij
 
Location: Providence, RI
454 posts, read 206,519 times
Reputation: 268
Quote:
Originally Posted by creneb56 View Post
I know. You can’t ignore the presence of the frigid and near subarctic Manchurian regions and northern plains, nor the frozen plateaus of China’s south and southwest. The US has similar climatic/geographic features, yet still.... Considering that, chilly-winter south China, with its still colder average winters than the southern US, don’t make up for anything. Even on an island below the Tropic of Cancer, China is humid subtropical until the southern tip of Hainan. The US has a plethora of tropical climates on the Florida peninsula just above the TOC.

The US averaging three whole degrees warmer as a whole even with Alaska is significant. It’s warmer.
The question of which country is warmer by population is different from that of which is warmer by land area though. Believe Qidb602 established that China was warmer by annual mean temperature based on population, but that the average of the US's land area could certainly be warmer, given the vast extent of the sparsely populated and quite chilly Tibet-Qinghai Plateau.

Furthermore, the question of which country, with locations weights based on the population distribution, is warmer in terms of annual mean is distinct from that of which country is milder in winter, which may very well be the US. Summers and transition seasons tend to be hotter in many Chinese than American cities for a location with given winter temperatures, Beijing's July is comparable to Atlanta's and hotter than any of the cities in the Northeastern corridor (NYC, DC, Philadelphia, Boston etc), any of the Great Lakes Cities (Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland etc) or any of the major west coast cities (Seattle, Portland, LA (barring some inland areas), SF, SD etc), and it is located on the northern edge of the North China Plain, remaining cooler than the vast majority of the country.

Somewhere like San José, CA, still has a cooler summer peak mean temperature (due to significantly cooler nights), than Harbin, the northernmost Chinese city, as do places like Portland, OR, Buffalo, NY, and Milwaukee, MI. Many of the US's mild winter areas on the West Coast like San Francisco don't have particularly high annual means since summers are also fairly mild.

Last edited by tij; 02-20-2020 at 06:18 PM..
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