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The all-time record lows for Buenos Aires and Tokyo are 22F and 23F, respectively.
The only part of the 'U.S. South' that is comparable is the southern half of the Florida peninsula. Everywhere else in the South, even the such coastal places as Jacksonville, New Orleans and Charleston, has seen cold-snaps exceeding those in Buenos Aires and Tokyo by more than 10F - with anyplace inland far exceeding that (examples: Charlotte, record low is -5F; Atlanta, record low is -9F; Memphis, record low is -25F).
Nice try, but Buenos Aires and Tokyo are not comparable climates to that of the 'U.S. South'.
Imagine the UHI's that exist around Tokyo. If you go 162 miles southwest to Nagoya the winter min record is 13.5F. Hiroshima record low is 16.5F even further south. All cities on the coast. Interior Japan is not nearly as mild.
Hitoyoshi, Japan way at the bottom of the country has an avg Jan high/low temp of 48.7/30.6F (1961-1990) at 32N latitude and just about sea level. Yes it doesn't have the extremes that happen very rarely here, but the average weather is much colder than anywhere at sea level and that latitude in the US.
I've actually found the colder the arctic high pressure, the faster the warm up because it's very dry arctic air, so after the winds from the north which transport the colder air stop and the cold dry air is just there, it is quickly modified by the 30N latitude sun. It's when cold fronts stall out that lasting cold happens, but it's not as extreme. If you look at New Orleans' weather before that blast, it was quite cold back to December 15, last time it was in the 70's. However, after the extreme blast it warmed up within 5 days. Basically once an arctic blast penetrates that far south, it peters out.
Absolutely those places warmed up; if they didn't then they wouldn't be subtropical.
However, the point isn't how warm those places get, the point is how cold those places can get. Although every subtropical locale is indeed subject to cooler than average temperatures, the extremes in the US South are much more pronounced.
Absolutely those places warmed up; if they didn't then they wouldn't be subtropical.
However, the point isn't how warm those places get, the point is how cold those places can get. Although every subtropical locale is indeed subject to cooler than average temperatures, the extremes in the US South are much more pronounced.
I think you missed the point. It wasn't that they warmed up, it was how fast they warmed up. You can usually count on your hand how many cold days are like that in a winter. There is more sustained cold in subtropical China but not as extreme. The south is mild like 90% of the time and then the other 10% is abnormally cold.
Unless you've lived in the South you don't know what you're talking about.
I think you missed the point. It wasn't that they warmed up, it was how fast they warmed up. You can usually count on your hand how many cold days are like that in a winter. There is more sustained cold in subtropical China but not as extreme. The south is mild like 90% of the time and then the other 10% is abnormally cold.
I think you missed my point. All I'm saying is that record lows in the US South are much more below average lows than compared to other subtropical regions. I'm not saying the US South is any less subtropical than elsewhere, just that their (your) record lows are colder.
In other words, the absolute range of temperatures is greater than elsewhere. It's not any more complicated than that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cBach
Unless you've lived in the South you don't know what you're talking about.
I think you missed the point. It wasn't that they warmed up, it was how fast they warmed up. You can usually count on your hand how many cold days are like that in a winter. There is more sustained cold in subtropical China but not as extreme. The south is mild like 90% of the time and then the other 10% is abnormally cold.
Unless you've lived in the South you don't know what you're talking about.
That's irrelevant. As he stated, the point is that the south gets far colder than many other subtropical locations. Whether it lasts an hour, a day, or a week is irrelevant. Temperatures swing all over the place.
I think you missed the point. It wasn't that they warmed up, it was how fast they warmed up. You can usually count on your hand how many cold days are like that in a winter. There is more sustained cold in subtropical China but not as extreme. The south is mild like 90% of the time and then the other 10% is abnormally cold.
Unless you've lived in the South you don't know what you're talking about.
C'mon. Even Houston get more nights below freezing than London at 50N. Now that is telling you something.
That's irrelevant. As he stated, the point is that the south gets far colder than many other subtropical locations. Whether it lasts an hour, a day, or a week is irrelevant. Temperatures swing all over the place.
How often and by how much do temps "swing all over the place"? I posted for three cities how often over a 30 yr period temps differ from the mean by 5F, 10F, and 15F.
As shown, Florida varies the least, but even Philadelphia and Charleston have 90% and 87% of winter days respectively where the min avg temp varies less than 15F plus or minus. I think every winter we get swings, but it is not as if temps just keep going 15F plus and minus all winter. That is not borne out by the averages. Maybe in an extreme winter, but there is no way this is borne out by the average number of days with those differences each winter averaged over 30 years.
How often and by how much do temps "swing all over the place"? I posted for three cities how often over a 30 yr period temps differ from the mean by 5F, 10F, and 15F.
As shown, Florida varies the least, but even Philadelphia and Charleston have 90% and 87% of winter days respectively where the min avg temp varies less than 15F plus or minus. I think every winter we get swings, but it is not as if temps just keep going 15F plus and minus all winter. That is not borne out by the averages. Maybe in an extreme winter, but there is no way this is borne out by the average number of days with those differences each winter averaged over 30 years.
I think it's odd that a lot of posters think that some cold nights during the fall and winter months automatically disqualifies a place from subtropical classification.
March - 66/42
April - 75/50
May - 81/58
June - 88/67
July - 91/71
August - 90/70
September - 83/63
October - 74/52
November - 65/43
I would imagine that most people would consider the above climate pretty warm despite the cool averages of 54/34, 51/31, and 57/36 in between.
Miami is tropical. Everywhere else above Miami is not.
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