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Old 08-31-2016, 08:25 AM
 
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I've been looking at the climate contrasts between Newfoundland and the Azores Islands and thought of a scenario.


What if New Zealand was in the North Atlantic Ocean at the same latitude as it's current spot, but now it's in between Newfoundland and the Azores Islands. Plus in this scenario it would be flipped over so that North Island is now South Island, and South Island is now North Island. Auckland is now pointing towards the Azores Islands and Invercargill is pointing towards Newfoundland.


Do you think New Zealand would have the same climate as at it's present spot? The same flora? How do you think the Gulf Stream would effect it? How would New Zealand effect Europe? What about hurricanes?
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Old 08-31-2016, 08:46 AM
 
Location: Sydney, Australia
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They will probably get a lot more snow if they were on the western Atlantic side.
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Old 08-31-2016, 09:18 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Ethereal View Post
They will probably get a lot more snow if they were on the western Atlantic side.

I don't know if New Zealand would get that much snow on the west coast due to the moderating influence of the jet stream. For example Iceland which is about 65° latitude has winters which are only around 0 degrees. Then there use to be a Ship Station at 44ºN/41ºW with an average overall temperature of 15°C.

SHIP STATION D, WMO REGION 4 DEPENDENT ISLANDS / OCEAN VESSEL STATIONS Weather History and Climate Data

St. John's at about 47ºN/52ºW is around 10°C degrees cooler than Ship Station D, which is a big difference.

Still the northern end of New Zealand would probably get more snow.
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Old 08-31-2016, 09:50 AM
 
Location: Foreignorland 58 N, 17 E.
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It fully depends on which side of the isle they were nearest, so it's a very hypothetical question. What it would do is to disturb the Gulf Stream flow, causing Europe to have a colder climate, especially in winter. I don't know which area in where the surface temperature shifts from cold-water to warm-water exactly, so it could even be a vast difference (greater than now) between Whangarei and Invercargill.
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Old 08-31-2016, 10:16 AM
 
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Originally Posted by lommaren View Post
It fully depends on which side of the isle they were nearest, so it's a very hypothetical question. What it would do is to disturb the Gulf Stream flow, causing Europe to have a colder climate, especially in winter. I don't know which area in where the surface temperature shifts from cold-water to warm-water exactly, so it could even be a vast difference (greater than now) between Whangarei and Invercargill.
The scenario I'm thinking about is the northern tip of New Zealand being around 450 kilometers south of St John's. And Whangarei being nearly 1500km west southwest of the Azores Islands.

Here's a ocean temperature map which made help.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_su...:MODIS_sst.png

I to believe that Invergargill and Whangarei would be further apart in temperature.
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Old 08-31-2016, 10:42 AM
 
Location: Foreignorland 58 N, 17 E.
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Originally Posted by gordo View Post
The scenario I'm thinking about is the northern tip of New Zealand being around 450 kilometers south of St John's. And Whangarei being nearly 1500km west southwest of the Azores Islands.

Here's a ocean temperature map which made help.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_su...:MODIS_sst.png

I to believe that Invergargill and Whangarei would be further apart in temperature.
I will do a guess then:

August values and February values (because of seasonal lag in C):

Cape Reinga 24/20 & 19/14
Whangarei 26/20 & 18/12
Auckland 26/19 & 17/11
Hawkes Bay 27/17 & 15/8
Wellington 24/14 & 10/3
Christchurch 22/12 & 7/2
Dunedin 20/12 & 6/1
Queenstown 22/10 & 1/-7
Invercargill 20/10 & 3/-3

So the subtropical threshold would be further "north" on the former "North Island", whereas it'd be a cooler oceanic climate up north, especially in terms of night temperatures. Queenstown gets a continental climate.

Sounds legit?

Last edited by lommaren; 08-31-2016 at 10:55 AM..
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Old 08-31-2016, 11:06 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lommaren View Post
I will do a guess then:

August values and February values (because of seasonal lag in C):

Cape Reinga 24/20 & 19/14
Whangarei 26/20 & 18/12
Auckland 26/19 & 17/11
Hawkes Bay 27/17 & 15/8
Wellington 24/14 & 10/3
Christchurch 22/12 & 7/2
Dunedin 20/12 & 6/1
Queenstown 22/10 & 1/-7
Invercargill 20/10 & 3/-3

So the subtropical threshold would be further "north" on the former "North Island", whereas it'd be a cooler oceanic climate up north, especially in terms of night temperatures. Queenstown gets a continental climate.

Sounds legit?

Yes that looks pretty good. Thank you for your guesses.

I noticed to the seasonal lag in the Azores. I wonder what causes this?

Another thing I wonder about is rain patterns in this scenario.
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Old 08-31-2016, 11:14 AM
 
Location: Foreignorland 58 N, 17 E.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gordo View Post
Yes that looks pretty good. Thank you for your guesses.

I noticed to the seasonal lag in the Azores. I wonder what causes this?

Another thing I wonder about is rain patterns in this scenario.
It's caused by it being so far out there with such mild waters surrounding it. The greater the maritime influence, the longer the lag. See Septembers in California

Cape Reinga towards Auckland would be slightly above mediterranean with a relatively dry climate, but it would rain/snow like crazy the further north you'd go.
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Old 08-31-2016, 11:30 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lommaren View Post
It's caused by it being so far out there with such mild waters surrounding it. The greater the maritime influence, the longer the lag. See Septembers in California

Cape Reinga towards Auckland would be slightly above mediterranean with a relatively dry climate, but it would rain/snow like crazy the further north you'd go.

If this was the case on the North (South) Island there wouldn't be as much that could be grown as compare to South Island now. Plus Milford Sound would likely be covered by snow in the winter. But I wonder would the west coast be as wet in general?
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Old 08-31-2016, 11:46 AM
 
Location: Foreignorland 58 N, 17 E.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gordo View Post
If this was the case on the North (South) Island there wouldn't be as much that could be grown as compare to South Island now. Plus Milford Sound would likely be covered by snow in the winter. But I wonder would the west coast be as wet in general?
Plant hardiness does a 'freak' increase as a result of snow cover I've heard. Over in New Brunswick where you are this combined with warm summers help plants grow a lot better than in areas that have less reliable snow cover I believe

West Coast obviously wetter, I've done this model based on only the west and east coasts being left unmirrored. If you'd put Hawkes Bay on the west coast instead its temperatures would be more moderated. I'd expect around 1000-1300 mm rainfall in most of NZ though.
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