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View Poll Results: Which one is more subtropical?
NZ 4 16.67%
Virginia 12 50.00%
Both in their way 3 12.50%
Not sure it is too hard to really know 0 0%
Depends what part of each place 5 20.83%
Voters: 24. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-10-2024, 06:31 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
406 posts, read 83,165 times
Reputation: 53

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed's Mountain View Post
LOL, none of those palms are "perfect" for anywhere in Ontario. They will die quickly.
Amherstburg specifically and Niagara-On-The-Lake. Central Kentucky has a colder hardiness zone. They will definitely live well in Amherstburg and Niagara-On-The-Lake.
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Old 03-10-2024, 06:32 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
406 posts, read 83,165 times
Reputation: 53
Then why don’t they die in Youngstown? Youngstown is colder than Amherstburg and Niagara-On-The-Lake. Sabal Minor is hardy down to 6b, Amherstburg is 7a and also Niagara-On-The-Lake.
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Old 03-10-2024, 06:34 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
406 posts, read 83,165 times
Reputation: 53
If you look where exactly they are located you will understand why.
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Old 03-10-2024, 06:47 PM
 
Location: New Zealand
388 posts, read 98,259 times
Reputation: 204
Quote:
Originally Posted by whylie View Post
No, the complete picture of the native ecology of a region informs us of where the dividing lines are between colder and warmer climates. There is no situation in which "thousands" of major subtropical species all grow to their climax in New Zealand but nowhere in Virginia.
As you said, it isn't about 1 species, and there will be a lot more species that grow to their climax in the north island, simply because frost tenderness is a bigger issue than lack of warmth.

I'm surprised you didn't verify the 80 ft magnolia in nz, it wasn't hard to find the record. My sugar cane has done well, one plant has given me about 25 canes 5-6 ft tall, with about 12-14ft in height overall, not bad from one cutting and about 12 months. Not at all hard to grow and next year I reckon I'll do even better from what I've learned.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Subtropical-is-temperate3 View Post
Day to day weather? That is meteorology! Weather and climate can be related but are not the same thing. Climate systems are of climate, climatology. And the ecology of a place is a good indicator of climate, and Köppen’s system is not far from describing that. It is impossible to make a climate classification based on day to day weather because though weather is predictable to certain point it is unpredictable.
That's right.

This is the point I try to make when people think classification equals vegetation.I think Koppen does a good job myself.
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Old 03-10-2024, 06:50 PM
 
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada
5,731 posts, read 3,510,184 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Subtropical-is-temperate3 View Post
Amherstburg specifically and Niagara-On-The-Lake. Central Kentucky has a colder hardiness zone. They will definitely live well in Amherstburg and Niagara-On-The-Lake.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Subtropical-is-temperate3 View Post
If you look where exactly they are located you will understand why.
I used to live in Toronto so I know exactly where they are located.

Those palms do not "live well" anywhere in Ontario; none of them will survive outdoors. The only specimens that exist get covered by a shed heated with Christmas lights that encloses the palm for the winter--so basically they're indoor plants.
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Old 03-10-2024, 07:26 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
406 posts, read 83,165 times
Reputation: 53
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ed's Mountain View Post
I used to live in Toronto so I know exactly where they are located.

Those palms do not "live well" anywhere in Ontario; none of them will survive outdoors. The only specimens that exist get covered by a shed heated with Christmas lights that encloses the palm for the winter--so basically they're indoor plants.
Dwarf palmetto Sabal minor, does. Needle palm is the hardiest of all palms hardy even in Montreal.
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Old 03-10-2024, 07:28 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
406 posts, read 83,165 times
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Windmills would certainly not do well in Toronto, but Amherstburg has more chances.
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Old 03-10-2024, 07:30 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
406 posts, read 83,165 times
Reputation: 53
But they succeeded in Cleveland in same hardiness zone as Amherstburg, the Youngstown post I doubt it would grow well without protection.
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Old 03-10-2024, 07:32 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
406 posts, read 83,165 times
Reputation: 53
They tried in Indianapolis, but it wasn’t the best idea. Sabal Palmetto did though there, and grew more. In Central Kentucky it even started to spread like if we where placing Southern Georgia here, they did great in Kentucky with similar hardiness zones as Southern Ontario.
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Old 03-10-2024, 07:35 PM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
406 posts, read 83,165 times
Reputation: 53
Don’t think Sabal minor is same as the bigger Sabal palmetto, the Cabbage palm is hardy only down to 8a, Memphis successfully grew them. Same for Virginia’s Coast. The Mandarins growing in Long Island and Ilex Opaca being native in Cape Cod is what amazed me.
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