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View Poll Results: Which one is more subtropical
Wellington, NZ 3 11.54%
Atlanta, GA 21 80.77%
Both in their way 2 7.69%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 26. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 04-22-2024, 06:46 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesja View Post
Charleston isn't like Atlanta and Dallas, it's warmer. Brisbane and Orlando are on the tropical border, Atlanta and Dallas are middle-points.
Dallas is actually the warmest of the 3, at least if you're comparing them with the criteria of what station would be closest to the quintessential Cfa climate*. Atlanta Hartsfield-Jackson Airport has an annual mean of 17.6C, Charleston International Airport has an annual mean of 19.2C, and Dallas Love Field has an annual mean of 20C.

*All of these are the official station closest to a quintessential Cfa climate with the metric of a 9C coldest month, there are hotter and/or colder stations which are further from that point and so excluded from this comparison.

I happen to very much like comparing the climates of Charleston and Dallas. Same latitude, both good quintessential Cfa climates, and excellent weather monitoring.
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Old 04-22-2024, 07:08 PM
 
2,389 posts, read 1,112,768 times
Reputation: 3491
Quote:
Originally Posted by Can't think of username View Post
Dallas is actually the warmest of the 3, at least if you're comparing them with the criteria of what station would be closest to the quintessential Cfa climate*. Atlanta Hartsfield-Jackson Airport has an annual mean of 17.6C, Charleston International Airport has an annual mean of 19.2C, and Dallas Love Field has an annual mean of 20C.

*All of these are the official station closest to a quintessential Cfa climate with the metric of a 9C coldest month, there are hotter and/or colder stations which are further from that point and so excluded from this comparison.

I happen to very much like comparing the climates of Charleston and Dallas. Same latitude, both good quintessential Cfa climates, and excellent weather monitoring.
Dallas has the warmest annual mean because of hot a$$ Texas summers....
Charleston, SC is warmer in winter ...but I guess that doesn't count for you ....
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Old 04-22-2024, 07:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GTB365 View Post
Dallas had the warmest annual mean because of hot a$$ Texas summers....
Charleston, SC is warmer in winter ...but I guess that doesn't count for you ....
It does count for me! Just not in the way your comment appears to allude to (warmer winter more quintessential) from my interpretation.

Charleston being warmer in the winter* than Dallas gets it to the point where in January, it is .7C too warm from being a bang-on quintessential Cfa climate. Meanwhile, Dallas being only .2C colder than the bang-on 9C quintessential Cfa in January means it is the more quintessential of the 2, making Charleston's warmer winter count in the OPPOSITE of the way I interpreted your comment to mean.

*Do note that although the mean of the 4 winter months is .5C warmer in Charleston than Dallas, the entire winter is not warmer in Charleston. Calculated from daily mean increase, Dallas catches up on February 27 and is warmer for the whole winter part of March on average.
Likewise, it is warmer until November 11. Summer is not the only warmer part of the year in Dallas!
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Old 04-22-2024, 07:49 PM
 
Location: New Zealand
444 posts, read 127,336 times
Reputation: 271
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesja View Post
You are simply so bizarre in your fixation on this topic and how you just goal-post shift, give anecdotes, and lie to build an improbable, or obviously false, image of New Zealand's environment.
So you believe that Wellington doesn't have a coastal rain forest environment, and that the area in Ed's photo doesn't have an annual mean of 14C with 1300mm of rainfall?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesja View Post
Wellington is objectively less biodiverse than Atlanta, so...
Quite true with regards to fauna, but the NZ story is one of isolation. With plant species however, NZ has about double the number of vascular plants, than Georgia does. Wellington is at a crossover area of NZ, and has more plant diversity the most regions of NZ.


Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesja View Post
...Denmark does not have the same environment or biodiversity as Atlanta
More alike than NZ - you just can't get around the dormancy of Denmark and Georgia, and the lack of it in NZ

Last edited by sandshark; 04-22-2024 at 08:40 PM..
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Old 04-22-2024, 07:52 PM
 
Location: New Zealand
444 posts, read 127,336 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesja View Post
You are simply so bizarre in your fixation on this topic and how you just goal-post shift, give anecdotes, and lie to build an improbable, or obviously false, image of New Zealand's environment.
Give some examples please.

Last edited by sandshark; 04-22-2024 at 09:17 PM..
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Old 04-22-2024, 08:10 PM
 
2,389 posts, read 1,112,768 times
Reputation: 3491
Quote:
Originally Posted by Can't think of username View Post
It does count for me! Just not in the way your comment appears to allude to (warmer winter more quintessential) from my interpretation.

Charleston being warmer in the winter* than Dallas gets it to the point where in January, it is .7C too warm from being a bang-on quintessential Cfa climate. Meanwhile, Dallas being only .2C colder than the bang-on 9C quintessential Cfa in January means it is the more quintessential of the 2, making Charleston's warmer winter count in the OPPOSITE of the way I interpreted your comment to mean.

*Do note that although the mean of the 4 winter months is .5C warmer in Charleston than Dallas, the entire winter is not warmer in Charleston. Calculated from daily mean increase, Dallas catches up on February 27 and is warmer for the whole winter part of March on average.
Likewise, it is warmer until November 11. Summer is not the only warmer part of the year in Dallas!

"4 winter months".....For me each of the four seasons is 3 months ....for a total of 12 months for
the year.

DALLAS, TX

December 49.5
Hi........Lo
59.2 / 39.8

January 47.8
Hi........Lo
57.7 / 37.9

February 52.0
Hi........Lo
62.0 / 41.9



CHARLESTON, SC

December 52.5
Hi........Lo
62.7 / 41.6

January 49.5
Hi........Lo
60.2 / 38.9

February 52.7
Hi.......Lo
63.8 / 41.6


You are correct about both Spring and Fall.....Dallas is a bit warmer.
particularly Fall....as Dallas takes awhile to "cool" down...Big D has a September 90 average high...
November is warmer in Charleston.
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Old 04-22-2024, 08:21 PM
 
2,851 posts, read 1,466,849 times
Reputation: 376
Quote:
Originally Posted by GTB365 View Post
"4 winter months".....For me each of the four seasons is 3 months ....for a total of 12 months for
the year.

DALLAS, TX

December 49.5
Hi........Lo
59.2 / 39.8

January 47.8
Hi........Lo
57.7 / 37.9

February 52.0
Hi........Lo
62.0 / 41.9



CHARLESTON, SC

December 52.5
Hi........Lo
62.7 / 41.6

January 49.5
Hi........Lo
60.2 / 38.9

February 52.7
Hi.......Lo
63.8 / 41.6


You are correct about both Spring and Fall.....Dallas is a bit warmer.
particularly Fall....as Dallas takes awhile to "cool" down...Big D has a September 90 average high...
November is warmer in Charleston.
Everything else is true, so I'll just stick to the matter of season definition.

I don't use the 3 month seasons, period, because it's based on erroneous application of daylight seasonal principles to weather seasonal principles. My preference is to go off of inarguable and demonstrable astronomical seasons (daylight)+seasonal weather pattern changes that vary in length, as this comment explains: https://www.city-data.com/forum/65971517-post596.html

When it comes to Southeast US places like Charleston and Dallas, December-March has the winter weather pattern of mild or warm averages but wild swings between hot and cool/cold weather, and it is also broadly consistent with the very coherent astronomical seasons. Which is why it is my definition of choice.

Hope this helps.
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Old 04-22-2024, 09:17 PM
 
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
217 posts, read 65,005 times
Reputation: 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesja View Post
Wellington is objectively less biodiverse than Atlanta, so...
New Zealand has high endemic biodiversity due to its geographical isolation
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catego...ora_by_country
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catego...rds_by_country
Hawaii features in the US data
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Old 04-23-2024, 09:39 AM
 
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
485 posts, read 113,083 times
Reputation: 76
My complicated way of humid subtropical and other temperates:

coldest month -3°C-18°C/26.6-64.4°F, at least 1 month averaging 10°C/50°F or above, f humid(wet year round, or no pronounced dry season, or simply when it is not s or w, a’ hot summer(at least one month averaging 22°C/71.6°For above.

People mostly complain on colder edge, not accepting cities like NYC, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh
, Boston, Columbus, etc., so I made 26.6-45.5°F average coldest month to be pre-continental side of temperate climate, and 45.5-64.4°F pre-tropical. So example Orlando is pre-tropical humid-subtropical, NYC pre-continental humid-subtropical.

I even made it more detailed(but remember after all it is just a single climate being break down to deeper meaning.

26.6-32°F average coldest month, it is part of the pre-continental, but a more blurred borderline to real continental.Example city in Cfa categor, Pittsburgh average 27.5°F coldest month.

32-36.05°F average coldest month(26.6-36.05°F is the true pre-continental) is a pre-continental climate without borderline issues but influence from the continent climates are obvious. Example of city Philadelphia average 33.7°F coldest month.

36.05-45.5°C coldest month average, is the pre-continental climate that feels pure in its temperate nature but leaning more towards continental that tropical. Example city Cfa city Nashville.

36.05-54.95°F average coldest month is the temperate climate, in this case the humid-subtropical climate without borderline issue, in other words pure one. It is the balanced area between continental boundary and tropical boundary, it takes half the way of each of the pre-continental and pre-tropical types.Example cities: Nashville, Atlanta, DC,Birmingham, Tallahassee, Jacksonville and more.

45.5-64.4°F pre-tropical(54.95°F-64.4°F is the most outstanding pre-continental)

45.5-54.95°F is the pre-tropical start line, tropical characteristics start to be pronounced, but only in a smaller level. Example Cfa city, Mobile, AL.

Average coldest month 54.95-59°F is the pre-tropical that is in around middle line, many times even mistaken or thought by some to be tropical already. Example city, Ocala, FL.

59-64.4°F average coldest month is where the line of tropical and temperate becomes blurred, this climate is so similar to tropical that it is very often though to be. Areas with this subtype can grow many tropical fruit and vegetation but are not yet tropical. Orlando, Tampa, and many Floridian cities, some southern Texas cities fit this description.

Average 64.4°F average coldest month or more, finally tropical! 26.6°C average coldest month or below, continental it is.
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Old 04-23-2024, 02:02 PM
 
52 posts, read 11,784 times
Reputation: 46
Quote:
Originally Posted by sandshark View Post
Quite true with regards to fauna, but the NZ story is one of isolation. With plant species however, NZ has about double the number of vascular plants, than Georgia does. Wellington is at a crossover area of NZ, and has more plant diversity the most regions of NZ.
…Why do you just lie? New Zealand is listed as having around 2,300 species of vascular plant, in comparison to Georgia, which is typically sourced as having between 3,600 to 4,100 species.




Quote:
More alike than NZ - you just can't get around the dormancy of Denmark and Georgia, and the lack of it in NZ
So you’re selectively attending to any dormancy at all?

The environment or Denmark is not at all like Georgia’s
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