North County Help...Jupiter CC, Rialto, Evergrene, Abacoa, Botanica, Mirabella, etc (Indiantown: renting, loan)

[atlantatofloridabound]

Thank you city guy for all of your feedback. I agree with you on most counts. We live in a golf club community now but it was relatively cheap to join and it's not a full fledged country club so no food minimums and the dues are relatively low. We don't have a problem paying monthly dues but do have a problem paying a huge initiation fee. You have a point about the neighborhoods that require you to join for golf so that's something to consider.

I have seen that cost comparison on that realty site and it helps but is mainly Jupiter area clubs, not Boca or Wellington. I am also having a hard time finding a site where I can search by high school. I had a realtor send me a community in Wellington that is new construction but the schools were bad so I would really like to be able to search by school to help me figure out where these neighborhoods all fall in line.

I know the Palm Beach County website allows you to put in address but that's a pain. Thanks again for your feedback. I can't believe how much more the homes cost for so much less house compared to Atlanta. We will have to significantly downsize for more money!

[JimT7406]

CityGuy your analysis was spot on. The cost factor is dragging down home values in most country club communities throughout the entire county. Had Toll Brothers built a more traditional PUD community with a clubhouse, pool, fitness etc. that would likely have been sold out and gone a long time ago. Instead they are still trying to sell out a community with home construction that started in 2007.

[SXN]

Originally Posted by atlantatofloridabound

I am also having a hard time finding a site where I can search by high school. I had a realtor send me a community in Wellington that is new construction but the schools were bad so I would really like to be able to search by school to help me figure out where these neighborhoods all fall in line.

I know the Palm Beach County website allows you to put in address but that's a pain. Thanks again for your feedback.

Try Redfin.com. They have the best online real estate search tool IMHO. If you go to advanced options in the search menu you can choose to have schools displayed on the map of search results. You can then click on each school and it will highlight all homes within it's zone. You can also click for information on test scores, parent reviews etc. Take the reviews with a grain of salt - not sure how accurate they are.

[atlantatofloridabound]

Thanks for the redfin suggestion. That website is really great and just what I was looking for!

[JupiterLand]

My wife and I were in a similar situation. We already lived in Jupiter, but needed a larger home and initially considered both Jupiter Country Club and Rialto. Palm Beach Gardens was off the table because we wanted Jupiter schools and we weren't considering zero-lot line communities, which ruled out most of Abacoa.

Here are my thoughts-
Up until about 6-8 months ago, JCC was expensive and seemed to market to seniors while Rialto was far more reasonably priced and marketed to families. All that changed recently in recent months.

Rialto raised its' prices to JCC-level prices. We looked in Rialto over the summer and when we went back two months later, Lennar was trying to get $670K for the exact same house (same model, options, etc. and just a slightly better lot) that sold a couple of months earlier for $525K. I also began to have questions about the quality. When we asked if we could have smooth interior walls inside the house at Rialto, we were told Lennar only did textured walls (ostensibly because drywall guys can more easily cover their mistakes that way). No offense, but I don't think I should have concerns over workmanship if I'm paying over $500K for a home. We were also very specific about site location because we wanted to avoid the noise from I-95 and the athletic field lights that light up some parts of the neighborhood at night. This requirement reduced the number of lots we deemed acceptable to those with fairly high premiums. We also learned that Rialto is experiencing problems because it is assigned to Limestone Creek Elementary and zoned as "walking distance" for the kids--even though there are no stop lights on Island Way and the morning traffic sometimes looks like I-95! Rialto was a good buy for those people who paid in the mid-$300's and now have homes just down the street from where Lennar is trying to get $750K+ for homes, but we scratched it off our list.

The homes at JCC haven't experienced the same run-up in prices as in Rialto, but that's probably because JCC was already priced at the high end. Toll Brothers recently introduced a new 4 BR model as I think they're beginning to realize that they probably should have been targeting families all along (frankly, if you're not concerned about the schools and just want a good country club, you can probably get more home for your money in PGA National or Mirasol in PBG). JCC was at the very top end of our bracket and we had some concerns about what would happen when club fees went up after the new clubhouse was built. Toll Brothers also has a policy where you have to agree to purchase a house before they tell you the cost of options/upgrades. We had friends in JCC who bought their house on spec and it seems to me that is the way to go. There is also another lower-end development called Lakewood that has been proposed to be built right next to JCC which we were concerned might affect property values in the next couple of years.

We eventually decided to buy in a small, established community called North Fork. The homes aren't new, but property values are established, the neighborhood is well-maintained and we bought a quality built home complete with pool, spa and outdoor kitchen with a decent sized yard on a fairly private lakefront. If you're not absolutely set on buying new in a clubhouse community, there are some smaller gated enclaves such as Cypress Cove, Mystic Cove, Palm Cove, etc. that are north of Indiantown Road. I feel good about our decision, although I might eventually take another look at JCC in a few years after I get a feel for how that community builds out.

[JupiterLand]

@atlanta: Based on what you're saying, the best fit for you would probably be Jupiter Country Club.

[JupiterLand]

Prado is in Martin County as is "The Moorings of Jupiter". Many developments in Martin County try to tie themselves to Jupiter in their marketing, but the bottom line is that you don't get Jupiter schools or services. Also, keep in mind that even some areas described as "Jupiter" in Palm Beach County are actually located in unincorporated Palm Beach County and are patrolled by the Palm Beach County Sheriff's Office and not the Jupiter PD.

[WestPalmHereIcome]

Originally Posted by City Guy997S

Country clubs are a broken model....buyers age/don't play anymore/don't want to pay for something they don't use so many of the clubs have gone to a mandatory membership requirements to keep the club from going broke!

A few other caveats:

1. Initiation dues are partially refunded. Mirasol gets 100K+ for a golf membership but if you sell/move out you only get 80% refunded.
2. Club sells memberships but members are on a waiting list to exit! Some clubs need to get 5 new members before they let an existing member sell their membership. This is so the club gets the whole initiation fee vs. the hold back amount. 5 new 100K memberships is 500K but if an existing member sells a 100K membership for 80K the club only gets 20K per deal. It also keeps more people "paying" monthly dues. 5 new members, 1 existing member means 6 people extra paying the monthly vs. letting the exiting members escape.
3. Really desirable clubs don't have residency requirements and on the flip side less desirable clubs have mandatory memberships for their residents. Jupiter Hills, Bears Club, Seminole and a few others get 100,200,300K in dues but you don't have to live there yet Mirasol/Ballenisles require residents to buy at least a social membership.
4. Overselling- Mirasol doesn't have enough capacity to entertain all their members on say New Years Eve (too many members, not enough seats) so they offer a lottery system to see if you get to go "to the club" on big holidays. This overselling hurts tee times, club events right down to the locker assignments. Some clubs have fixed memberships, never to be exceeded. Jupiter Hills is 400 members, never a tee time and the club is equity. Club needs a 4mm makeover, each of the 400 members gets a 10,000 bill to be paid in 30 days.....no debt, bill it and they pay.
5. Constant "keeping up with the other clubs"- many clubs are constantly renewing their facilities to keep up with the new clubs, new features. This of course is to make membership more desirable but it is a constant expense for the existing members.
6. Outside members- Places like Jupiter CC cannot survive on residents (not enough units sold) so they allow outside members for a year or even a season (summer memberships). This allows the place to operate with extra income and make it look busy for potential buyers. As the place sells out, the outside members get let go. However I suspect in the future this policy won't be enforced due to the need for extra cash flow. Frenchmans had outside members but I suspect that is no longer the case because it is almost sold out. Never confuse the lower outside member rates for resident rates (someone in this thread did). As a resident you will not be allowed to skirt the system and join for the reduced rate.

Man, this was some of the most enlightening information I have read on here. VERY helpful, thank you!

[RTAF]

Does anyone know the time table for the Prado? All I can find is coming soon. I've driven by this week and it looks like there might be some activity. Anyone that lives around there notice any recent progress?

[char1755]

Hi noticed one of you lives in Abacoa. What do you think of the neighborhood in there called Martinique? My husband and I are thinking of moving to Jupiter and liked what we saw in Abacoa. We actually are in our 50's but like the mix of ages. I assume Martinique has younger and older folks?