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Gave me a shiver to read that..Colonel McNeils sword was a regular cavalry issue..nothing fancy...just a head chopper....
Most of these men were boys...and they had a sense of humor with their bravery. We had three in that war..one confederate...two union...one of them died from related wounds 2 months after discharge.
1. The TELSUR map from the Univ. of PA. This covers the entire U.S., they take actual speech samples and analyze them according to common speech patterns. As you see, they place the Southern dialect in West Virginia from the southwest corner up through Clarksburg and the eastern panhandle. This does not mean that someone from Martinsburg is supposed to sound like someone from Plains, GA, or New Orleans. It only means that they share many common speech habits.
I am from the central Virginia area and have lived in places like Gettysburg,PA,the Cumberland,MD area,and in Parkersburg. I've also worked all over WV from Weirton to Mullens and many places in between.The referred to map is pretty much correct.Not a whole lot of Southern accents in Wheeling or Morgantown.I hear it some in Parkersburg and more in Southern Wood County/Jackson County/Calhoun County and you hear it more defined the more South you are in WV.
Not all Southern accents are the same either.Virginia is a little different from Georgia and so on but we can all understand each other pretty much.
The only place anybody really made a big deal of the way I talk was while I lived in Gettysburg.
I have read in some newspapers the younger folks especially in areas like Richmond,Charlotte,etc are losing their accents and it's not being heard as often because those areas have a lot of people moving in from the North and Mid-West.Also since kids don't really hear a Southern accent on the internet,tv,or radio I can see this happening.
I wonder how many major dialect variations exist in Wv? Minor issue...but the mountain dialect of Hardy, Grant and Pendelton was a strange variation of 'old english when I was a kid...fetch, ketched...
I think these three maps will help put a little perspective on this issue. While I enjoy personal anecdotes they have no real definitive persuasion. The maps are as follows:
1. The TELSUR map from the Univ. of PA. This covers the entire U.S., they take actual speech samples and analyze them according to common speech patterns. As you see, they place the Southern dialect in West Virginia from the southwest corner up through Clarksburg and the eastern panhandle. This does not mean that someone from Martinsburg is supposed to sound like someone from Plains, GA, or New Orleans. It only means that they share many common speech habits.
2. The 2000 U.S. Census Ancestry Map. Sorry for the blurred copy, but I believe I posted the entire map early in the thread, this small section is just for contrast. You can see that West Virginia defines itself in common with Virginia and Kentucky, distinct from Ohio and PA. They identify themselves as "American" in ancestry, but that is usually read as "Southern", and not just by me. There was a thread on the General City Data page on exactly this topic just a few months ago.
3. A map of the Confederate counties of West Virginia. It should actually include a few more, since some counties switched sides once West Virginia was invaded by Ohio, I particularly refer to Cabell and Wayne counties.
4. This is not a map, but a survey. The Southern Focus Poll, conducted by the Univ. of North Carolina, found that approximately half (45%) of West Virginians identified themselves as Southern. Kentucky and Virginia were much higher, but I attribute the lower percentage to the state educational system which has for 100 years conducted a systematic disinformation program on the State's history. West Virginians have been taught that they are sympathetic to the North, though in their secret hearts they know this is not true. I will quote a passage from McGregor's "Disruption of Virginia"---"On almost the last day of the constitutional convention of November, 1861, according to the manuscript, a motion was made that the records of the convention be printed. One of the delegates opposed this motion for the reason that the discussion had revealed so plainly the opposition of the people of West Virginia both to the North and to the new state that the publication of the debates might interfere with the admission of the state."
GHO, your experience is not uncommon. I would suggest if you want to have a little fun with your friends, they next time you ask that question and they laugh, hand them paper and pen and ask them specifically to write out WHY they are laughing. I bet they shut up fast. And the few who do write anything I am certain will write total nonsense.
Appalachiangirl: Regarding your comment that you saw few Confederate flags in central WV, that may be true, but I would like to mention a memorable quote from a Marietta OH newspaper which, in describing the guerrilla war in West Virginia, called central WV "the heart of Africa". The people in these counties were considered so savage that Gen. Crook organized a burn and pillage expedition through Braxton county and Sutton. I corresponded with a lady who does extensive historical research on mostly Unionist northern WV, and she told me that she ran into people in Calhoun county who to this day curse the name of Gen. Benjamin Kelley, who referred to most West Virginians as "savages". The ironic outcome of this was that both Generals Kelley and Crook were humiliated by West Virginia Confederates when they were kidnapped way behind Union lines by Hardy County's McNeil Rangers.
David K: Slavery was indeed of little importance in West Virginia's separation from Virginia. People forget, if they ever knew, that many if not most of the Wheeling government were slave owners. One legislator, Mr. Lewis, said that he voted against Secession because he believed it would be the end of slavery (he was right). Another, Mr. Burdett, said that he was "as good a pro-slavery man as any in the state." You could hardly find a more Confederate county in the state than Calhoun, yet they only had 9 slaves in the entire county.
I think West Virginia is mostly a Southern state with a heavy Northern influence. I also think that most West Virginians do not really know where they or the State came from, thanks to the duplicitous nature of the history as taught in the schools. I do not think it an exaggeration when I say that West Virginia history as taught is similar to Soviet methodology.
I don't know what I would do without you Bobbilee. I learn a lot from you and David . Anyway, I definitely agree with you, WV is clearly a Southern State overall. I hate to see the Northern influences from Ohio and Pittsburgh "bleed through" the Ohio River and Mason-Dixon Line into WV. For example, on our cable system, we have a sports channel called FSN Pittsburgh. Right here in Hurricane, 250 miles south of Pittsburgh, we have to rely on it for regional sports. Where's the justice in that?
While Googleing, I have found plenty of websites that I thought I would share, which includes WV in the South.
I wonder how many major dialect variations exist in Wv? Minor issue...but the mountain dialect of Hardy, Grant and Pendelton was a strange variation of 'old english when I was a kid...fetch, ketched...
That's a good question. We will probably never know. My closest guess is that most of the state is within the "Mountain Southern" dialect zone.
Growing up in Wetzel County (within the Pittsburgh zone of influence), I didn't think anyone had an "accent". But upon returning 10 years after graduation, somehow many of my classmates had acquired a more Southern speech pattern. In reality, of course, it was my ear that had changed, becoming accustomed to "yinz", "rett-up", and "gum-band".
Maybe there isn't a FSN Cincinnati? Back in the 50s, visiting my grandparents in Marlinton, virtually everyone was a Reds fan (I think there were no Bengals at the time.). The explanation was simple: Marlinton was on the Greenbrier Division of the C&O, which ran frequent excursion trains to Cincinnati for Reds' games.
There actually is a FSN Cincinnati and we get both here in Huntington, although the majority of the baseball fans in the area root for the Reds. Not sure about Marlinton, but Huntington is still Reds and Bengals territory. The Reds caravan still makes a yearly stop here at the mall to sign autographs and meet the fans.
As do the Pirates, Penguins and the Steelers into our area... I'm sure the EP supports the Baltimore and DC franchises....The minor league BB team in Little Washington is getting some good press and some of my cousins like them because of their new field and the close proximity...I've missed their name...not the Toledo Mudhens...for sure...
What about the Charleston area? Which sports teams do they root for? I know the northern panhandle and the Morgantown through Weston areas definitely route for the Pittsburgh teams (my father was a devout Steeler and Pirate fan!) It seems like no matter where former Steeler fans move,they stay loyal to that team. On a family trip to Florida we met a family living in Arizona who were visiting Florida,but were formerly from Butler,Pa(long sentence) and were strong Steeler and Pirate fans. I wonder if this is common to the Pa/northernWV natives or in other areas as well. I did live in Md (Frederick) but didn't notice that strong team loyalty I see here.
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. Anyway, I definitely agree with you, WV is clearly a Southern State overall. I hate to see the Northern influences from Ohio and Pittsburgh "bleed through" the Ohio River and Mason-Dixon Line into WV. For example, on our cable system, we have a sports channel called FSN Pittsburgh. Right here in Hurricane, 250 miles south of Pittsburgh, we have to rely on it for regional sports. Where's the justice in that?
