Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Just saw this article in today's Washington Post. Thought I'd forward this link (if it works). Not all are totally against Obama, just want some 're-writes' : )
Does anyone REALLY think govt run healthcare is going to bring an end to crisis medical bills for any/all individuals AND provide the full care an individual wants?
Does there need to be reform in the health industry - of course.
One of the first places to start is tort reform - but that won't happen because of the swarm of lawyers in DC and the support the law groups give to govt officials. For example, take a look at the biggest groups of contributors to presidental elections.
Free health care for all? Nothing is free - someone pays.
Let's really go to an extreme: How about this for the answer - no coverage for fat people, smokers, alcoholics, reckless drivers, risk takers, anyone harmed while committing a crime, premmie babies who are anticipated to have physical problems, ....hmmm what else shall we add to the list.
Then people would rarely need medical coverage - THAT would really bring the cost down.
Ridiculous, right? So is the idea that the US can cover everyone for everything and provide the health benefits demanded by US citizens.
Let's try speaking slowly. It may help. Almost all other industrialized nations have a "single payer system." They have lower cost and better performance. For those morons who would respond, "But the US is different" the VA runs a single payer system and it has 40% lower death rate for males over 65 than Medicare and 25% lower costs. Even a really slow learner should be able to grasp the essentials of this.
A single payer system will save us money. It's unconscionable that we have so many people without access to basic health care. We can save money and behave like an advanced society if we abandon the idiocy of the current heath care system.
Let's try speaking slowly. It may help. Almost all other industrialized nations have a "single payer system." They have lower cost and better performance. For those morons who would respond, "But the US is different" the VA runs a single payer system and it has 40% lower death rate for males over 65 than Medicare and 25% lower costs. Even a really slow learner should be able to grasp the essentials of this.
A single payer system will save us money. It's unconscionable that we have so many people without access to basic health care. We can save money and behave like an advanced society if we abandon the idiocy of the current heath care system.
It will cost more money by adding new layers of bureaucracy on top of what healthcare costs, so more expenses, born by the taxpayers. Nothing is free, and getting the government involved always makes it more expensive.
No one is denied healthcare. Show up at an emergency room and you must be treated regardless of ability to pay.
"Show up at an emergency room and you must be treated regardless of ability to pay."
This is part of why healthcare costs are so high. I have to agree with GottaHerdOn,like him or not,Obama is at least trying to do something about healthcare,which I question whether McCain would--I think he wouldn't have personally. Just like Bush didn't.
By the time you get your paperwork through the maize and layers of authorization...you will be dead or past help....or your records will be lost.
Many of us have been in the military...case in point.
When a business is run for profit, the need for 'cash flow speeds up the process, gives is some stability and produces an end result.
Government workers are not the same as those found in the private sector. They are very slow in everything they do. And they are fickle.
I signed up for Social Security last November, hoping to get a check in January. I signed up on-line and at the office too. In March, when I did not recieve a check that I did not exist. In April I got my first check without any backpay for money lost. direct deposit.
Four months ago, I asked them to mail me the check, as we would be traveling a lot this fall and I wanted the cash option of using it instead of writing checks.
I filled out the change form and the lady said...'You won't get this done...the government wants it on direct deposit."
I said, "This is my money here...mine and the employer who matched it..."
She said, "Makes no difference."
Letting the government ration health care will be a mistake...wait and see. Pie in the sky!
Thank you GHO...you will be getting the bill for this Obama-Care.
You can always cherry pick among diseases. By any WHO measure Europeans have far superior results.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader
It will cost more money by adding new layers of bureaucracy on top of what healthcare costs, so more expenses, born by the taxpayers. Nothing is free, and getting the government involved always makes it more expensive.
It will remove a tremendous amount of waste. Medicare has about a 10% overhead costs, about 1/3 of that of the private payers. Every private payer system has a different set of forms, adding substantially to the administrative burden of doctors. A single payer system is much more efficient.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader
No one is denied healthcare. Show up at an emergency room and you must be treated regardless of ability to pay.
That's the most expensive way possible to deal with chronic disease.
You can always cherry pick among diseases. By any WHO measure Europeans have far superior results.
Considering what a major issue cancer is, if the cancer survival rate is so much lower in Europe, I don't see how anyone could claim their healthcare is better. Shall I also go into how the elderly are denied healthcare that is given to the young, eugenics style, over there?
Quote:
It will remove a tremendous amount of waste. Medicare has about a 10% overhead costs, about 1/3 of that of the private payers. Every private payer system has a different set of forms, adding substantially to the administrative burden of doctors. A single payer system is much more efficient.
Cite your sources for those figures.
And medicare covers less people than the insurance companies do.
Quote:
That's the most expensive way possible to deal with chronic disease.
Perhaps but it directly contradicts the lies about people being "denied" healthcare.
Considering what a major issue cancer is, if the cancer survival rate is so much lower in Europe, I don't see how anyone could claim their healthcare is better. Shall I also go into how the elderly are denied healthcare that is given to the young, eugenics style, over there?
They aren't. BTW you just tried to slide by a dishonest broadening. First you claim Germany has higher cancer deaths for some cancers. Now you claim Europe has higher cancer deaths for cancers in general. Let's see some data.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader
Cite your sources for those figures.
And medicare covers less people than the insurance companies do.
Here's a CBO study on converting the country to a single payer system. See the table on page viii.
They aren't. BTW you just tried to slide by a dishonest broadening. First you claim Germany has higher cancer deaths for some cancers. Now you claim Europe has higher cancer deaths for cancers in general. Let's see some data.
Refute the stats at the link I posted then.
Incorrect, you did, when you posted:
Quote:
You can always cherry pick among diseases. By any WHO measure Europeans have far superior results.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
