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Old 01-25-2010, 04:06 AM
 
4,714 posts, read 12,160,923 times
Reputation: 1057

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Sorry, CT...the chaos of cultural conflict IS here...militant politicos, environmental wackos, gays, mexicans...blacks...dumb-down younger generation...and all with agendas and crafted within the last 40 years

Divided by what remains of the WW-2 generation and the Vietnamers...

The next election cycle will determine if we have a country or not...Haiti is the inner cities model for our future.
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Old 01-25-2010, 04:33 AM
 
Location: Troy Hill, The Pitt
1,179 posts, read 1,406,284 times
Reputation: 1080
Quote:
Originally Posted by CTMountaineer View Post
Let me get this straight... you are one of the people who favor opening our borders to hoards of unskilled, mostly illiterate, often criminally inclined aliens who generally don't speak the language common to our society and who compete with American workers who are unemployed by the millions as we write this? You essentially seek to move this, the greatest country in the world built by the huge sacrifices of our ancestors, in the direction of becoming a third world country with permanent culture conflict? Shame on you!

Not at all. I see a need for labor that isn't being met in many areas, and a need for employment coming out of our southern neighbors. I'm for an easing of restrictions to where people from the third world, both skilled and unskilled can come here legally and become documented American citizens if they wish.

In no way will this turn America into the third world. The only difference between this migration and the previous ones is that they're migrating from this continent. The reactions of people who opposed to them are very similar to the reception that the Italians, Polish, Irish, and Jewish immigrants faced. You think the current crop of immigrants aren't sacrificing? Try working several minimum wage jobs and feeling like you're constantly being hunted, so much so in fact that when you're sick you refrain from getting healthcare because you run the risk of being deported.

Will there be some competition for jobs? Sure. In any area where you increase the number of workers for a position there's bound to be. Will it push wages down? Doubtful. Most of the jobs that these immigrants will be taking are barely above minimum wage.


This isn't an invasion, although I understand why some see it as such out of a natural predisposition to stereotype. There has been an increase in crime from illegal immigration, but are the vast majority of them criminals? No. If the entire population of WV migrated into Maryland would there be an increase of crime? Of course.

This migration is no different than previous immigrant groups who have come into the country. "Shame on you" for thinking that you're at all different from Americans in the past who have discriminated, opposed, and stereotyped your ancestors.
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Old 01-25-2010, 05:38 AM
 
Location: Macao
15,996 posts, read 37,276,625 times
Reputation: 9618
PERSONALLY...and I've put thought into this.

This is a hard argument, as people are people, etc., etc. There are a ton of great hard working Mexican people, etc.

What I PERSONALLY have a problem is...WHY isn't it recipricol? If the U.S. has 40-50 million LEGAL Mexican-Americans, and another 30-40 million ILLEGAL ones.

How come Mexico accepts nearly ZERO AMERICANS. How come we can't go there and get citizenship, etc.

I don't mind the ol' come to America thing...but why doesn't anyone allow Americans in their countries? How come these things aren't recipricol?

I mean, when the 30 million + illegal Mexicans were being considered being legalized...and then it didn't happen...I remember MISS USA got booed BADLY in Mexico City for that policy during the Pageant. But can they really expect us to accept nearly everyone who crosses the border, but it's competely acceptable to deny ALL OF US from attempting to gain Mexican citizenship, rights, etc. NONE of us? I know the argument is 'who would want to...but believe me, if 40% of Mexico City was all Americans (much like 40% of Los Angeles is Mexican), I think we'd be able to be some pretty cool Mexican citizenry for them.

I also think people should get in a habit of ALWAYS bringing this up with the immigration issue as well...RECIPRICATION. It seriously needs to be addressed and discussed.

Last edited by Tiger Beer; 01-25-2010 at 05:49 AM..
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Old 01-25-2010, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Charleston, West Virginia USA
68 posts, read 169,870 times
Reputation: 47
Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-tip motha View Post
Would you assimilate if you moved to another country? No. Who in their right mind would expect you to? Why would you just up and give away a rather sizable part of who you are to placate anyone? At the most you might be expected to learn the local language, but how are you going to pull that off when you don't have anyone to teach it to you, and can't afford to pay them even if there is?
There is ample opportunity in this country for any non-English speaking persons to learn the language, i.e., ESOL (English for Speakers of Other Languages).
Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes :->2009->Ch1003->Section 56 : Online Sunshine

I won't argue there are immigration groups within this country that refuse to be a part of America, and my exposure to these types has left me with one conclusion : they are racists. Why they immigrate to America is beyond me (other than to funnel money back to their "home" countries). And why those who hate America and Americans are allowed to immigrate here, is even further from sanity.

Immigrate to Iran and purposely try to not fit in. Tell me how that works out for you.

Despite your attempt to rewrite history and propagandize cultural shifts, Russians are the most successful immigrant group in America today because they do assimilate, as historically, most successful immigrant groups do. You purport that non-assimilation is a natural behavior?

I've known "immigrants", related to some, and have heard on occasion, "Yes, I was born in . . but now I am an American!" I'm not advocating a nationalism, but this is in stark contrast to statements such as, "Wherever there is a Mexican -- there is Mexico", waiving flags of another country on our soil, threats of overthrow, etc. Common sense, anyone?

Additionally, expecting another country to bend to your cultural will is not only absurd, it's a behaviour pattern demonstrated by those who come from empires. Under your premise of multi-culturalism, we should allow Sharia Courts for Islamists?
Saudi girl, 13, sentenced to 90 lashes after she took a mobile phone to school | Mail Online

Assimilation arguments are a ruse to sidestep facts, which serves a purpose unto itself.

Fact : illegal aliens are not immigrants.
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Old 01-25-2010, 10:16 AM
 
Location: Elkins, WV
1,981 posts, read 5,452,762 times
Reputation: 812
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Kennedy View Post
Sorry, CT...the chaos of cultural conflict IS here...militant politicos, environmental wackos, gays, mexicans...blacks...dumb-down younger generation...and all with agendas and crafted within the last 40 years

Divided by what remains of the WW-2 generation and the Vietnamers...

The next election cycle will determine if we have a country or not...Haiti is the inner cities model for our future.
don't forget about the hard headed uniformed older generation with AARP agendas, extremist Christians, war hungry morons, coal and industry leaders who no regard for the environment (West Virginia will be known as West Valdez) and most importantly... the uneducated.


I wonder if this sounds familiar to what was said in the early 1900's. The Irish, the Poles, the Italians, the Greek, the Protestants, the Catholics all with their own agendas.... divided by the remains of the Civil War and the Spanish American War generation. hmm?
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Old 01-25-2010, 01:08 PM
 
10,113 posts, read 12,758,877 times
Reputation: 1756
Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-tip motha View Post
Not at all. I see a need for labor that isn't being met in many areas, and a need for employment coming out of our southern neighbors. I'm for an easing of restrictions to where people from the third world, both skilled and unskilled can come here legally and become documented American citizens if they wish.

In no way will this turn America into the third world. The only difference between this migration and the previous ones is that they're migrating from this continent. The reactions of people who opposed to them are very similar to the reception that the Italians, Polish, Irish, and Jewish immigrants faced. You think the current crop of immigrants aren't sacrificing? Try working several minimum wage jobs and feeling like you're constantly being hunted, so much so in fact that when you're sick you refrain from getting healthcare because you run the risk of being deported.

Will there be some competition for jobs? Sure. In any area where you increase the number of workers for a position there's bound to be. Will it push wages down? Doubtful. Most of the jobs that these immigrants will be taking are barely above minimum wage.


This isn't an invasion, although I understand why some see it as such out of a natural predisposition to stereotype. There has been an increase in crime from illegal immigration, but are the vast majority of them criminals? No. If the entire population of WV migrated into Maryland would there be an increase of crime? Of course.

This migration is no different than previous immigrant groups who have come into the country. "Shame on you" for thinking that you're at all different from Americans in the past who have discriminated, opposed, and stereotyped your ancestors.
So, your position is that the same circumstances exist today that existed more than a century ago when we were a developing industrial nation needing unskilled labor? Where did you go to school? I'm curious. And, what was your major? Liberal arts? Your position is totally divorced from reality. We don't need any more illiterate, unskilled people. In fact, we have a limited need for skilled people now. We have 15 million of our own people who are unemployed of which we are aware. Many feel the figure is actually higher than that but some have simply given up trying to find a job.

And the current bunch of illicit breaking and entering artists aren't coming here with the same attitudes held by our ancestors. In the early 1900s, invited immigrants came here with a sense of gratitude and didn't ask for anything. They rolled up their sleeves and went to work because there was a need for their services, and they learned the language and assimilated as quickly as possible. Many even changed their names because they thought it would help them fit in better.

The current uninvited bunch of malcontents come through out back door with a sense of entitlement. They refuse to assimilate and resist learning the language, and they demand special services (at our expense, of course) in a foreign tongue. There is absolutely no parallel between them and those who came before. And, just how are we to benefit from taking on unskilled, illiterate people with a penchant for crime and drugs, who seek to force a foreign culture on us and who refuse to assimilate.

I know about these people, because I speak their language. I understand them when they mouth off, and have heard it often in the NYC area. They don't seek to be one of us. They seek only to exploit us. Esto entiendo muy bien.
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Old 01-25-2010, 06:10 PM
 
4,714 posts, read 12,160,923 times
Reputation: 1057
I quit reading the blog when I got to the part about 'it not being an invasion...ha ha ha

an idiot for sure...a blind one.
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Old 01-26-2010, 01:17 AM
 
11,944 posts, read 13,184,661 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-tip motha View Post
They're competing for the jobs
When our national unemployment rate is WHAT?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-tip motha View Post
Let me get this straight: You believe that illegal workers are going to file a class action lawsuit in an attempt to recover money they've paid into social security when they were illegally employed using fake social security numbers...is that about right?
You'd be very surprised to read the fine print of both labor law and tax grievance cases. It's not implausible, in defense of this group of people presumed to have the same rights as all. They should have the same rights as all WHEN they become LEGAL. Having a separate population loose in our country that isn't anchored to the responsibilities of our nation is unhealthy for all parties concerned, not just Americans born here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-tip motha View Post
Once again you assume.... I'm willing to bet that you haven't been to Mexico outside of the resort areas, have you?
I think that sums up your attitude nicely. You have no idea whom you are speaking to, nor do you care to educate yourself. This chat is over.
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Old 01-26-2010, 01:47 AM
 
11,944 posts, read 13,184,661 times
Reputation: 2772
Quote:
Originally Posted by GottaHerdOn View Post
don't forget about the hard headed uniformed older generation with AARP agendas, extremist Christians, war hungry morons, coal and industry leaders who no regard for the environment (West Virginia will be known as West Valdez) and most importantly... the uneducated.


I wonder if this sounds familiar to what was said in the early 1900's. The Irish, the Poles, the Italians, the Greek, the Protestants, the Catholics all with their own agendas.... divided by the remains of the Civil War and the Spanish American War generation. hmm?
<gulp> man you're tough!
The thing that ties all these groups (and many more!) together? The thing they share that makes all of them wrong? The day they believed that winning at any price was acceptable. That is how we got where we are today in such a mile high pile of poop it's unfathomable.

The decisions I make as a voter can never ever be for a special interest when the greater good of my American family is at stake. Make no mistake about it Cody, America is in serious trouble and Obama has got the weight of the world on his head. He just might have to issue those marching papers for the good of the country, and I would hope that liberals would support his decision if it's for the greater good of all.
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Old 01-26-2010, 04:34 AM
 
Location: Troy Hill, The Pitt
1,179 posts, read 1,406,284 times
Reputation: 1080
[quote=harborlady;12615230]When our national unemployment rate is WHAT?
Not the fault of the illegals, and the result of a shift from a manufacturing based economy to that of a service based one. The illegals haven't caused outsourcing, and most of the jobs they are taking are minimum wage or very low paying ones at that.

What else can you scapegoat on them? The cost of healthcare? Outsourcing? Poverty?


Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
You'd be very surprised to read the fine print of both labor law and tax grievance cases. It's not implausible, in defense of this group of people presumed to have the same rights as all. They should have the same rights as all WHEN they become LEGAL. Having a separate population loose in our country that isn't anchored to the responsibilities of our nation is unhealthy for all parties concerned, not just Americans born here.
You'd be very surprised to have someone translate that fine print for you. It isn't happening, and that comes straight from a lawyer.


Quote:
Originally Posted by harborlady View Post
I think that sums up your attitude nicely. You have no idea whom you are speaking to, nor do you care to educate yourself. This chat is over.
Your initial post was laced with latent racism and hypocrisy. You expect them to live in the squalor of the third world and not attempt to better themselves.

You honestly expect me to assume that you're well traveled when you suggest that immigrants enjoy a decent quality of life in their home country, and just "want more" while you enjoy life in one of the nicest countries in the world? You sound like Pat Robertson trying to describe the Dominican Republic as being "prosperous" when people actually have to lock themselves inside with bars on the windows because the crime is so bad.
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