Mt. Vernon extremely run-down (Bronxville, Verona: homes, movies, high school)

[roskybosky]

I agree about the welfare 100%. But they started welfare in order for poor or unmarried women to stay home and raise their kids. Back then, a working mom meant unsupervised children, so the point was to enable moms to stay home, thinking it would lessen the number of kids-gone-wrong.

It was created in another era, but certainly backfired. We are also living in an age when it is 'normal' for women to work outside the home. Not so when welfare was created.

[roskybosky]

Italians are still discriminated against. Compare real estate prices in Chappaqua, Rye and Larchmont to Harrison and Eastchester.

Uh, those towns have plenty of Italian-Americans. The blue collar occupations were more of a first generation thing. Also, many Italians were fairly well-to-do when they came here, in fact, many considered themselves more refined than Americans. Not everyone did the tenement- in- lower Manhattan- pushcart route.

Also, I don't know if I quoted the above correctly. I'm still new in this forum. Maybe someone can clue me in.

[Forest_Hills_Daddy]

I don't know about Italian immigrants being fairly well to do. Most of the Italians who migrated to the US were poor in their country, from the southern part of italy - Palermo, Naples, Sicily. Italians from wealthier parts like Milan, Verona and Venice hardly immigrated.

[wordlife]

Originally Posted by Nexis4Jersey

They never help cities , they destory the mom and pop areas....

In the case of Mt. Vernon the bix box stores actually helped out. The most notable ones are all on the border with Pelham. If you're familiar with the area that they're in, it's pretty ugly with warehouses to the south and regular/ to above average (langdon terrace) housing to the north. I do feel that the target side wasn't well planned at all to consider pedestrian access.

Infact I would consider the Stop & Shop that was built over there to be a HUGE upgrade compared to the pit where pathmark is located.

These stores haven't at all hurt fourth avenue, Gramatan. The population density is too high in Mt. vernon for something like that too happen.

I think there's a lot of potential to reuse existing structures in Mt. Vernon, they've already started to do this on a small scale by converting some of the buildings along Macquestern into "work lofts". I don't think the market is right just now but I believe that area has tons of potential in the future.

[roskybosky]

I also think the big box stores helped Mt Vernon. There's so much that is antiquated and run down, I think the big boxes clean it up and make it look more modern.

Even though Mt Vernon is dumpy for the most part, I've read that it is thriving and growing on the industrial/business side. Suburbanites are not that interested in those things, but they have to put the factories somewhere.

I live in Texas now, but I'm a fourth generation Mt Vernonite. I would love to see some kind of revival, which I'm sure they are working on. It used to be so pretty...

It has its proximity to NYC as an asset-it needs a Louis Capelli to come in and work some magic. Mt V has some wonderful old buildings. One is just like the flatiron building in NY. The library was donated by Andrew Carnegie. If only I were a philanthropist...

[nonny]

I wish that a philanthropist would notice mt. vernon. It really needs a good leader.

[bg7]

Originally Posted by roskybosky

I also think the big box stores helped Mt Vernon. There's so much that is antiquated and run down, I think the big boxes clean it up and make it look more modern.

Even though Mt Vernon is dumpy for the most part, I've read that it is thriving and growing on the industrial/business side. Suburbanites are not that interested in those things, but they have to put the factories somewhere.

I live in Texas now, but I'm a fourth generation Mt Vernonite. I would love to see some kind of revival, which I'm sure they are working on. It used to be so pretty...

It has its proximity to NYC as an asset-it needs a Louis Capelli to come in and work some magic. Mt V has some wonderful old buildings. One is just like the flatiron building in NY. The library was donated by Andrew Carnegie. If only I were a philanthropist...

There really is some good architecture there.

[ExNooYawk]

Originally Posted by roskybosky

I still can't believe the Italian thing...it sounds so funny to me. But my family has been here since the late 1800s and has always been well off. To me, the Italians have the big houses and perfect lawns, and play a lot of golf and tennis and hope their kids get into the Ivy league. Well, I guess in the beginning they probably had language barriers...just hard to believe.

Rosky, I didn't know the Irish were discriminated against until I took some history courses in college.
Many Italian immigrants settled in Tuckahoe and Eastchester and worked in the marble quarry. My great grandfather was a marble mason and Town Clerk in Eastchester. They quite looked down on the Italians but gradually came to accept them as neighbors and friends. Spouses too, eventually. Jewish families moved to Eastchester too, but, well, they were mostly excluded from social events. That changed also, as people got to know each other. My grandparents had many Italian friends (always described as such) but not many Jewish friends. My dad's generation didn't perpetuate their parents' prejudice. By the time my generation came along, I thought the whole world was Irish/Italian/Jewish and we were all friends. One neighbor kid told me that he was told by some bullies that his parents were cheap because they were Jews. He was very annoyed. I had never heard that before and when I asked my mother about it she said that some people were more ignorant than others. True, that.
Blacks were part of the outside universe; we didn't know any and didn't think about them. There used to be a large contingency of blacks in Tuckahoe but when Urban Renewal Programs took hold in the 1960's, they relocated; mostly to Mount Vernon.
Imagine my surprise to study history in college and finding out about "No Irish Need Apply". We were very proud to be Irish, heck, we even ate green bagels on St. Patrick's Day.

[roskybosky]

Ex Noo Yawk- I love your post. Yes, when you are in the universe of your ethnicity, you never believe anyone could think less of you. Besides, Italians were so enterprising, they were too busy creating successful businesses to worry about anyone else. When you read the history of Mt.Vernon, Italians (and some waspy types from earlier) literally raised the town from scratch. 19th century photos show well-dressed people strolling through 4th avenue, earlier pictures of men with big Abraham Lincoln hats. Many came here with nothing. My relatives were better off, northern Italian/Austrian who came right to Mt Vernon after arriving. I never saw my grandfather when he wasn't wearing a tie.

But, America is IN LOVE with the idea of Italians as some kind of puppy-dog person, none too bright, sexually attractive, animated. Any directory in any hospital in New York reads like a who's who in little Italy, but you never see a surgeon on TV with an Italian name. America loves the gangster, or the deese, dems, and dose Italian. I literally cannot find a relative who matches these descriptions.

I know from moving to Texas that everyone thinks the best of their own kind, and the worst of other 'types.' Southerners think of themselves as polite-we think of them as rednecks.

In my life, I will not entertain any Italian derogatory remarks or jokes;when your family has been here 120 years, has risen to the highest levels of education and comfort, and made significant contributions, it is the height of rudeness to imply we are anything else.

BTW, I believe ethnic groups themselves look down on the lowest of their own kind. Black people must cringe when some of their group are seen in handcuffs on TV. My own mother called some Italians ..."the real Italiany-Italians" at times.

[ExNooYawk]

Rosky, most many Italians landed on the east coast and remained there. It was brought home to me after we moved to California. We were being joined by a 'fourth' player at tennis with an Italian name. The other ladies were very curious about it - all westerners. I told them that to me, an Italian name is as American as Abigail Adams, which they found surprising.

That mafia stereotype of Italians irritates me. I wouldn't watch The Sopranos for many years. Yes, there are Italian doctors, Supreme Court justices, movie producers and scientists, etc. I'm mindful but not overly sensitive about stereotypes of Jews and the Irish. Unless we are laughing at ourselves with affection the perpetuation of stereotypes has no place in the good old USA.