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Old 03-29-2014, 06:39 AM
 
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In theory, just wondering if this could actually happen especially since Yonkers and Mount Vernon are the closest Westchester towns to NYC making the commute quite easy especially with easy access to the metro north. Would love to see all the run down and crime infested ghetto areas of Yonkers and Mount Vernon gentrify and improve with a better class of people replacing the current demographic.

Does anyone think it's possible?
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Old 03-29-2014, 09:53 PM
 
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I would like to see it happen, but if you could displace the troublemakers, where would they go? My best friend's father was a politician in Westchester for many years. This was decades ago, but he said that all the higher-ups agreed to send all the "trash" to Mt. Vernon, Yonkers or New Rochelle in order to keep it out of other Westchester cities. How they managed this I don't know. People who are at the bottom of the totem pole have to live somewhere. So where would they go? And how do you separate the good working poor from the gangstas?

You'd need a developer with some you-know-whats to come in and bulldoze some old buildings and create some cool loft-type apartments at a reasonable rate. Then you'd need a killer PR campaign to let people know Mt V has changed. The location is the asset, the new buildings would need every amenity. THEN new retail would spring up.

I had a very uppity friend who took an apartment in Mt V after getting married, to everyone's surprise. But she said the building in Mt V had so many amenities compared to other apartments in other cities, that she decided to live there.

It would take time, but it could be done. As a nice Italian girl from Fleetwood, I would love to see my town turn around.
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Old 03-30-2014, 06:59 AM
 
2,503 posts, read 4,095,909 times
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Originally Posted by roskybosky View Post
I would like to see it happen, but if you could displace the troublemakers, where would they go? My best friend's father was a politician in Westchester for many years. This was decades ago, but he said that all the higher-ups agreed to send all the "trash" to Mt. Vernon, Yonkers or New Rochelle in order to keep it out of other Westchester cities. How they managed this I don't know. People who are at the bottom of the totem pole have to live somewhere. So where would they go? And how do you separate the good working poor from the gangstas?

You'd need a developer with some you-know-whats to come in and bulldoze some old buildings and create some cool loft-type apartments at a reasonable rate. Then you'd need a killer PR campaign to let people know Mt V has changed. The location is the asset, the new buildings would need every amenity. THEN new retail would spring up.

I had a very uppity friend who took an apartment in Mt V after getting married, to everyone's surprise. But she said the building in Mt V had so many amenities compared to other apartments in other cities, that she decided to live there.

It would take time, but it could be done. As a nice Italian girl from Fleetwood, I would love to see my town turn around.
I agree. A place that the gangstaz can move to is maybe upstate like Newburgh which the demographic there already fits the gangstaz's lifestyle and culture. It would be right up their alley. They would be a shoe in. Other options are they can totally move out of NY and head down south to Georgia or some other southern state where the cost of living is much cheaper.

But the very best way to cleanse such undesirables and reclaim these areas that once upon a time were more desirable until they moved in, is to price them out. Make it so expensive for them that it's a no brainer that they would have no choice but to move to somewhere more affordable, hopefully out of state.

Last edited by hilltopjay; 03-30-2014 at 07:08 AM..
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Old 03-30-2014, 03:43 PM
 
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Look at how NYC displaced people into Upstate NY.
Newburgh, etc.
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Old 03-30-2014, 07:52 PM
 
Location: Armonk NY
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The problem is that a certain amount of new housing must be set aside for low income. Tough to price people out totally.
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Old 03-30-2014, 08:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by john70 View Post
The problem is that a certain amount of new housing must be set aside for low income. Tough to price people out totally.
It's a gradual process.
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Old 03-31-2014, 04:37 AM
 
Location: Washington, DC & New York
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The main stumbling block are the school systems because the cities are suburban, so not as desired by singles and childless couples for whom school performance and academic environments, that are influenced by social problems, do not matter. Fleetwood is a good area, and Yonkers has good parts as well, such as Lawrence Park. The desegregation order that effectively nullifies local school assignment in Yonkers is a problem, as is merging with other schools in Mount Vernon and middle and high schools is a problem in Fleetwood because of the social problems on the south side that affect the schools. These factors keep families, some of whom may be former gentrification advocates from the city in their single/newly married days, from settling in an area that needs work; thus, new investment is not attracted in the same manner as the city. Look at some recent highlights that have shown people moving from Williamsburg to Hastings, which is quite a change, as there's not much gentrification needed in Hastings, but the schools are good, which tends to make for a setting that is acceptable to families.

Now, if The Bronx were to completely gentrify, then the south side of Mount Vernon and SW Yonkers would be likely to follow suit, but as Riverdale is already sought-after and much better than SW Yonkers, with Kingsbridge and Van Cortlandt Village stable areas, for the most part, there is no push to look to a suburban city that does not have the same transit connections. On the east side, there are stable Bronx neighborhoods, without the upper middle class of Riverdale, but there is no spillover in terms of dramatic shifts in demographics where there are areas that attract new/refurbished development that would command higher price points.

Attempts to gentrify in Yonkers have basically stalled, but I could foresee something like downtown New Rochelle occurring in SW Yonkers in the long-term view, where there is a mix of newer development, increased shopping and dining options, yet still some areas that are not gentrified. Ridge Hill is newer, and not built out, and I think that the condos there will take some time to sell at the asking price point, especially with the lovely view of the Deegan and Costco, not to mention the waste transfer station on the adjacent property. Some of the existing residential housing stock in both cities is in poor condition and not as attractive for rehabilitation as is brownstone Brooklyn, which tends to limit the type of tenant that can be attracted to a property, either as an owner/investor, or renter.

And, that's before the political debate enters the question, with respect to attempting to build new residential and commercial centers that would attract investment in the affected communities, as that would cause upheaval within the established voting base, the same thing that holds back portions of The Bronx and Brooklyn, but as they are smaller cities, the politics are more local, and not as easy to overcome.
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Old 03-31-2014, 06:37 AM
 
2,503 posts, read 4,095,909 times
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Originally Posted by bmwguydc View Post
The main stumbling block are the school systems because the cities are suburban, so not as desired by singles and childless couples for whom school performance and academic environments, that are influenced by social problems, do not matter. Fleetwood is a good area, and Yonkers has good parts as well, such as Lawrence Park. The desegregation order that effectively nullifies local school assignment in Yonkers is a problem, as is merging with other schools in Mount Vernon and middle and high schools is a problem in Fleetwood because of the social problems on the south side that affect the schools. These factors keep families, some of whom may be former gentrification advocates from the city in their single/newly married days, from settling in an area that needs work; thus, new investment is not attracted in the same manner as the city. Look at some recent highlights that have shown people moving from Williamsburg to Hastings, which is quite a change, as there's not much gentrification needed in Hastings, but the schools are good, which tends to make for a setting that is acceptable to families.

Now, if The Bronx were to completely gentrify, then the south side of Mount Vernon and SW Yonkers would be likely to follow suit, but as Riverdale is already sought-after and much better than SW Yonkers, with Kingsbridge and Van Cortlandt Village stable areas, for the most part, there is no push to look to a suburban city that does not have the same transit connections. On the east side, there are stable Bronx neighborhoods, without the upper middle class of Riverdale, but there is no spillover in terms of dramatic shifts in demographics where there are areas that attract new/refurbished development that would command higher price points.

Attempts to gentrify in Yonkers have basically stalled, but I could foresee something like downtown New Rochelle occurring in SW Yonkers in the long-term view, where there is a mix of newer development, increased shopping and dining options, yet still some areas that are not gentrified. Ridge Hill is newer, and not built out, and I think that the condos there will take some time to sell at the asking price point, especially with the lovely view of the Deegan and Costco, not to mention the waste transfer station on the adjacent property. Some of the existing residential housing stock in both cities is in poor condition and not as attractive for rehabilitation as is brownstone Brooklyn, which tends to limit the type of tenant that can be attracted to a property, either as an owner/investor, or renter.

And, that's before the political debate enters the question, with respect to attempting to build new residential and commercial centers that would attract investment in the affected communities, as that would cause upheaval within the established voting base, the same thing that holds back portions of The Bronx and Brooklyn, but as they are smaller cities, the politics are more local, and not as easy to overcome.
Good point BMW. Schools are indeed very important in the decision making process when deciding to move. Gentrification of Yonkers and Mount Vernon would be a very slow process but can be done if the school system improves.
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Old 03-31-2014, 07:25 AM
 
Location: Where my bills arrive
16,010 posts, read 14,204,991 times
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Any area has the potential to improve, my dad grew up near the water in Port Chester. In his day that area was the poorest of the poor today there are waterfront condos and apartments...who knew. I kidded him for years they should have bought there we would all be rich now...

As another poster said there has to be a place that the lower wage earners can live, the key is rules enforcement and good police coverage. Most are trying to work and raise their family's let the trouble makers be weeded out so the decent people can live their lives.
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Old 03-31-2014, 08:21 AM
 
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The only place I see further gentrification is a very small geographic are of downtown Yonkers. It has the gorgeous river views, the train station, and nice restaurants. But if you drive a small distance from the core, you will find modest walk-up apartment buildings and rundown multi-family houses that are not exactly Bed Stuy or Crown Heights material. Crummy industrial and warehouse buildings also don't help.

Downtown Mount Vernon is pretty much a dump. There are no attractive homes that are waiting to be restored by professionals. It is likely to continue its very slow but very real decline.

Meanwhile, both cities have beautiful areas that will always be beautiful. Lawrence Park West in Yonkers rivals anything in lower Westchester County.
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